If you run meth you better check....

[we4turbo]

FYI

After running a autozone E2000 for over a year. I switched to meth. I ran the meth for about 2 months and the pump failed while in BG. I exchange the pump (life time warr), and have been running this pump since returning from BG. The new pump failed today.

I don't know if it is the meth or not but I think I'll be going back to denatured.

If your running meth. make sure you check your pump everyday.

 

[Chuck Leeper]

ALKY Problems

Dave, I'd bet the farm that the methanol is killing the pumps. Most pumps are NOT stainless inside and cannot withstand the corrosive nature of methanol.
A method we use to delay the failure on our alky rail engine is to add a methanol lube to the fuel in the drum. It can be had from go cart parts places and is called KLOTZ. 1 qt in 55 gallons does it.
However, we drain the tank and run some gasolene thru the system when the engine is to be sitting for more than a week.
I'd suggest you revert to denatured and save an engine.

Back under, again!!

 

[we4turbo]

Thanks, Chuck..


When are you going to the track again. I want to see that beast RUN !!! Jeff has tried a few times to get in touch with you so we could go to the track.



David Benton

 

[Orion231]

Methanol...

Any negative affects using Methanol injection? I have a 55 gallon drum of it ready to be sucked dry...Will it hurt the engine any?

 

[we4turbo]

I don't think will hurt the motor, as long as you don't get to wild with the boost.

The problem is if your under boost, and the pump stops or you run the alky tank dry... Overboost, and new head gasket if you don't back out quick.

 

[Lee Thompson]

pump

David, Have you tried the new pumps we have. I have not needed to change mine yet, so I still have them in the box . What do you know about them,( working with met. ). I am not giving up met. Lee

 

[we4turbo]

Lee,

At this point I don't know how those pumps will hold up with meth. They were made for alky, but I don't know how they will hold up with the meth.

As a side note, the guy I was with and that you met in BG. has been using those pumps with denatured and iso. for over 2 years with no problems. We both switched to meth just before BG. About 2 weeks ago his crank shaft broke . He is on vacation now, and my pump just failed. So I will have to find out if those pumps are holding up. I still have 2 spares that I got at the same time you did.

If you do use them check them often, I check mine every time I fill up, or raise the hood.

I'll let you know if Bobby's pumps are still ok or if they may have cause the crank to break.

 

[Steve Hill]

I'd be interested to learn the manufacture of these failed pumps, if you know.

 

[Chuck Leeper]

"Meth" users

From what I'm seeing on these posts, I'm a bit confused as to what the expectations are resulting from the change to methanol from denatured alky. [Anyone have data to support better performance, other than an improvement due to knock suppression??]
My dealings w/ the use of alky as a detonation suppressant is very good when using denatured, even better than using isopropyl. [ I sell, use and install the SMC kits]
I have considerable experience using methanol as the primary fuel, as in a JR fuel rail. Given that we burned about twice the alky as we did gasolene, [due to the energy value differences], I don't see how injecting 7-10 OZ of methanol does anything more than what you can get from the same amt of denatured. [Assuming you are after the knock suppressant action of this injector system.]
The serious downside to the methanol is the high level of corrosion it creates in a fuel system, aka: dead pumps, alum fittings eaten up inside,hoses dried out and stiff, etc.
If the goal is to add HP, then it would be necessary to add ALOT of methanol to see a positive result. [More than you can spray thru a single nozzle] More like an entirely redesigned system.

Why try to "reinvent the wheel"??

I saw a good saying concerning racing. [and life in general.]

INSANITY: The repeating of the same thing over and over and expecting different results

Back under the "you know what"

 

[we4turbo]

The pump was made by masters. I bought thru autozone for about $80.00. It is for the ford f150 truck.

As far a meth vs denatured, it was a cost mostly for me. I was paying $9.00 - $10.00 a gal. for den. and $3.00 a gal for the meth.

I have worked out a deal on the dentured for $5.50 a gal. For some reason our Ace can't get the 5 gal. cans of denatured, so he cut me a deal on the gal cans.


David

 

[Bob Avellar]

If anyone is interested in my experience using methanol, denatured, and isopropyl you can check out some of the info on my web pages. I have found that the car is much easier to tune when running methanol. It does not drown the motor as easily as denatured when using high flow rates. The denatured seems to cool slightky more and this can be seen by a drop in the boost pressure when my second stage turns on. When a substantial % of methanol is mixed with the denatured the boost does not drop off. The biggest difference using methanol that I have found is the extra kick of HP that can be felt when the meth % is around 50% or greater. A little bit like a shot of nitrous I imagine! I don't feel any increase in HP without methanol in the mix. I can increase my flow rates(by changing the nozzles and/or pump pressure) and not put the fire out in the cylinders like iso and denatured do when the flow is very high. That has been my experience anyway. No problems with the pump in over a year of daily alcohol consumption other than a swollen 5 cent O ring. 23-25 lbs boost on a 108 octane chip,never more than 1-2 degrees retard on a motor that was rebuilt more than 150,000 miles ago. In fact Mr Cotton swears he saw around 30lbs momentarily when I floored it on a dyno run (maybe because the dyno loads the car differently). HP #s sucked though because I had a crappy mixture of Iso and denatured and H20 in the tank at that time (ran out of methanol) and had too large a nozzle on the second stage. I hadn't planned to run the car on the dyno for just that reason but I couldn't resist cause everyone else was having so much fun. I think it hit 408 HP and 488 ft. lbs at the rear wheels and then it started to drown the motor and the HP dropped way off so I had to shut it down. That would NOT have happened with the nozzles I usually run and the mixture I normally use. Wish I knew what I could have run if I hadn't messed around with everything a few days before I went to the dyno day. Didn't have the other nozzles with me and there was no alcohol of any kind there. Maybe next time.

 

[Chuck Leeper]

ALKY MIX

Bob, do you contribute the long [er] life of the pump to the fact you have a 50/50 mix of denatured and methanol rather than 100% meth??

I have an SMC system, the only 2 stage Steve built, on my car and am now upgrading the fuel system to handle more power. When completed, I will run the system w/ 100% denatured and then do a 50/50 mix and see what I get. All tests will be done on a chassis dyno, on the same day, etc, etc.

What do you use for a lube in the mix??
How did you get the system "baselined"??

Thanx for your input.

Back under the proverbial rock

 

[Bob Avellar]

Chuck,
I have Steve Hill to thank for helping with my baseline tuning. He suggested a ballpark flow rate that turned out to be very close to what I ended up with. Basically my goal was to be able to run about 25 psi boost and use a 108 octane Thrasher chip. With the amount of alcohol that I was flowing at that boost level I had a bit of fluttering (drowning the motor) when I used just Denatured and H20. The methanol put an end to the fluttering. I always run about 30% H20 regardless of what other mixture I have of the alcohols. I never use a lubricant with this pump and after tearing it apart and looking inside it ,I see no reason to use any. The Shurflo is very different than the fuel pump types as far as construction- nothing like it really. I beleive Steve also may have been the one who said that by using some H20 it reduces substantially the corrosiveness of methanol.

 

[Steve Hill]

Hey Bob! I appreciate the kind words. Thanks!

-- off topic, but interesting --
You missed a good car show waaay up thar in Oxford, ME. Ask Brian (waGoN) Lee about the 12 second Lightning I smoked at 130+ on the way up! Just too much fun <G>

cya pal.