Do you make more power pulling out fuel or pulling out alky when tuning at higher boost levels? I'm at 25 lbs right now with a AR of 10.5 but the tune is pulling out 10% fuel. I'm going to tune to 28-29lbs of boost. It may lean itself out to no correction but I'm betting on still being rich. Car always runs on the fat side. I can pull fuel or pull alky. Is it going to make more power running more alky and less fuel? Seems that years ago there was a car making big numbers running more alky and less fuel. Think they tuned for running more alky out the big end.
Making the most horsepower with Alky
- Thread starter blackgn1
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In the last year I've posted a lot of info about tuning with methanol injection being used as an anti-detonant. You need to consider the mass flow of the engine, the timing, the charge air temp, and the amount of methanol injected more than anything else. More methanol and low charge air temps will get you in trouble.
Agreed 100%!!!!!!
log all your runs, good info will be your BEST FRIEND!!!!
baby steps ,change 1 thing at a time!!!!
JD
Seems running less alcohol is the safest tune. I guess you have to look at the alky as a way to run higher boost without knock. Not fuel. I have read most all of the alky injection threads. Some I understood. Some I didn't.
I spray dual nozzle so there is a large amount going in the engine. Looks like two tunes. Summer hot air. Fall cool air.
I spray dual nozzle so there is a large amount going in the engine. Looks like two tunes. Summer hot air. Fall cool air.
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You may see a need to reduce the amount of alky being used in winter vs summer but its not as much as you think. The first order of business is to get the tune right. You should be pulling around 25% of fuel out of the fuel map to compensate for the alky being injected. Make sure you start to do that around 10 psi or so and up. I would start at 12 psi and work your way up to 28 or 30 psi. 30 psi on the street is a lot you may not need that much to get moving as fast as you like. All out on the strip I can understand but just be cautious. My car runs at 20 psi on the street and there is not a car out there I am afraid of with it.
You should be looking for an AF ratio of 11 to 1 using the alky in the motor.
I would set the alky to come on at 8 psi and let do its thing from there. With a dual nozzle kit you are throwing a lot of alky into the motor. A wide boost range to work off of will be helpful. As long as the alky kit is working do not be afraid to pull fuel out of the map to get to the 11 to 1 AF ratio. As far as timing goes I would play it safe and put no more than 20 degrees total in the map under WOT. You can always add timing once the AF ratios are correct.
What has been suggested up above is very true. Data logs are your friend. Start at 12 psi, make a run, look at the data log and go from there.
Look at alky like this. Its still a gas motor until 10 psi, after that its a gas/alky combo. When you get it right you can run the 30 psi you are looking for all day. Make sure to run straight methanol.
Good luck.
You should be looking for an AF ratio of 11 to 1 using the alky in the motor.
I would set the alky to come on at 8 psi and let do its thing from there. With a dual nozzle kit you are throwing a lot of alky into the motor. A wide boost range to work off of will be helpful. As long as the alky kit is working do not be afraid to pull fuel out of the map to get to the 11 to 1 AF ratio. As far as timing goes I would play it safe and put no more than 20 degrees total in the map under WOT. You can always add timing once the AF ratios are correct.
What has been suggested up above is very true. Data logs are your friend. Start at 12 psi, make a run, look at the data log and go from there.
Look at alky like this. Its still a gas motor until 10 psi, after that its a gas/alky combo. When you get it right you can run the 30 psi you are looking for all day. Make sure to run straight methanol.
Good luck.
TurboTnZ06
Go on red!
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Not sure I'd target 11:1 with a fast alky car. Maybe single nozzle, but with dual nozzles, I'd start at 10.5 or less. Bison in the other thread said he ran I think 10.3. I run 10.3 in my car with dual nozzles.
"If" you use ally for knock and run just enough so it doesn't knock.. Like on the edge that's where you
Will make the most power. You have to rely on the knock sensor for tuning to run it on the edge
And trim AFR to match up with the alcohol
My fastest customer runs a 4.6 mod motor at 9.6:1 AFR
That's a mid 8 second car on 93 3400 lbs
Will make the most power. You have to rely on the knock sensor for tuning to run it on the edge
And trim AFR to match up with the alcohol
My fastest customer runs a 4.6 mod motor at 9.6:1 AFR
That's a mid 8 second car on 93 3400 lbs
Seems running less alcohol is the safest tune. I guess you have to look at the alky as a way to run higher boost without knock. Not fuel. I have read most all of the alky injection threads. Some I understood. Some I didn't.
Having seen a lot of kits tested and lots of logs of alky pressure, I'm a fan of running a lot of alcohol. But having the gains turned up usually means a lot of alcohol comes in quickly and can present some tuning challenges. Having said that, if you can get the spoolup tuned correctly with a lot of alcohol coming in I like knowing that the alcohol is coming in as quick as it can so it will be there at full boost. It does take a small amount of time for the pessure to build up and it definitely comes up quicker with the gain turned up. If you are closer to the edge with the minimal amount of alky and you run a little more boost or the pressure builds up a little slower because it hasn't been primed or run at boost recently enough it can be disaster. With the gain turned up there is a little more safety margin built in. Heck, I log my alky pressure and have a alky pressure tester kit and still run a high gain because I see that sometimes it takes longer to build pressure than other times. Now if you aren't logging alky pressure or don't have a pressure tester kit you are working blind and to be on the safe side I would suggest more alky than needed. At these power levels all it takes is one quick blip on the highway without enough alky pressure built up and bam. For example, say at the same boost, timing, and AFR running 25% of your total fuel from alky vs 20% at a lower gain setting is it going to effect your power level much? And is it worth getting rid of that safety margin?
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