NA engines

[dr_frankenstein]

well the heads are getting bigger valves and beeing ported and stronger springs and possibly a 55 degree valve job roller cam and lifters stock rockers with reinforcement sins i cant find any billet once for the shaft style that those engines have any thing else i can do`?

if your going to push a roller cam for the motor, I would suggest dropping factory cast heads and pursuing some aluminum champions or TA's

see, what makes power sooo hard to get on the NA buick 3.8 is the heads... they just dont flow... our best head is like a chevy small blocks worst.

thats why these motors are so potent with a turbo, as the heads arent nessacarily breathing, the turbo is breathing for them. Thus, the turbo guys running the aluminum heads and pound out some eye popping numbers. even the cast heads make impressive numbers when the turbo breathes for them.

I would upgrade the rockers to a roller rocker system, (avail from any of the turbo vendors) and push the largest valves possible into the heads. follow up with the best porting job possible. and since you will go with a roller, push for as high of compression you can live with on the street and the biggest cam possible.

provided you upgrade the rod bolts and give it a good balance, I would add main bearing studs, and wind it up into the 6000 rpm range so that we can make use of the giant heads and cam. but thats where it will make the power.

I only worry of the pistons seperating from the crown at that rpm speed. simply cause there heavy and cast. but there are really no other cheap options.

but thats as close to real nascar feel you can really get with a production 3.8.... now if you jump up to a real Stage 2... you can actually get a NASCAR style engine for like 13K$.

A.j.

 

[futten]

only aluminum heads i found was brodix but they are for stage 1 or 2 blocks ill stick with stock heads and just make em breath good with a port job the roller cam and lifter i wan to get a little extra power and to not have the headacke of the breakin just seemes to me that the flat tappet breakin is a nightmare if you dont have the right amount of experiance and equiptment

this is my first engine build but you probably already realized this and i realy aprichiate your help i found weber racing has aluminum rockers on shaft wasent cheap heheh

 

[dr_frankenstein]

only aluminum heads i found was brodix but they are for stage 1 or 2 blocks ill stick with stock heads and just make em breath good with a port job the roller cam and lifter i wan to get a little extra power and to not have the headacke of the breakin just seemes to me that the flat tappet breakin is a nightmare if you dont have the right amount of experiance and equiptment

this is my first engine build but you probably already realized this and i realy aprichiate your help i found weber racing has aluminum rockers on shaft wasent cheap heheh

LOL.... now your seeing the reason why very few people build NA 3.8 V6motors.... for the cost of making 300 HP might as well go for a chevy V8 and had 475 or 500.

As for the flat tappet problems...... I run them... nuthing special other than proper preload a drilled lifter and ZDDP+. have only lost one cam in 5 years.

A.j.

 

[futten]

yeah i know a chevy 350 is easyer and little cheaper maybe but im wierd im wanna stick to the stock engine one reason also is the dmv in norway are a royal pain to deal with if you swap engines you have to document this and that that the chassis is capable of the increased weight bla bla bla and ive already spendt money buying the edelbrock intake headman headers and and a few other things

 

[charlief1]

Welcome back futten. ( Shouldn't it be flutten?) It's B4turbo.:biggrin: Different name but same guy. There's several thing you can do to make the power but in reality an NA motor is somewhat limited to say the least. Cut the heads and block .030 and get some of the very early 3.0 pistons. This should give you about 10.5 to 11.0 compressing ratio. Port the snot out of the heads and you should be close to 300 but it will make more torque than HP. This is one of the advantages of the Buick V6 cars. The design will help you get off the line but you have to figure out how t keep it going.:biggrin:

 

[CamoDeafie]

the 82-85 FWD 3.0s are the LK9 RPO code engines. these are the flat top pistons...I was under the impression with the 3.8 crank and rods that they would give you 12something CR?

 

[charlief1]

the 82-85 FWD 3.0s are the LK9 RPO code engines. these are the flat top pistons...I was under the impression with the 3.8 crank and rods that they would give you 12something CR?

Depends on the block and head combo. Do some reading in the Buick power source book.:biggrin:

 

[fuzzyGN]

What is your budget and goals for this engine? Need to know that first because these things get expensive quick. It snowballs too. I started off building a nice 9:1 engine with fuel injection to drive. After collecting parts and getting great deals on stuff I ended up with an engine that pegs the stupid meter. Tons of compression, huge heads, huge solid roller. I stopped counting at $7G's and don't even want to know what I have spent past that. This is still a factory block without a girdle or caps. Easily could have spent close to another grand on getting that done. Stoke stroke too. So the point to all of this is if you want to make the biggest baddest factory block N/A engine (stroker, girdle, aluminum heads, roller cam) plan on spending $10,000 or more. Even at that it probably won't make much more than 425 HP and it won't be fun to drive on the street. you do get a weight break with the V6 over a similar SBC but 400HP from a SBC is about $2500 or so. I am in no way trying to sway you away from building a Buick V6 but you need to have realistic goals and budget in mind.

 

[futten]

i have no budget in mind if i get 300 hp im happy im not after building the biggest baddest NA v6 i just want it meaner then stock 115 is ok but i want a little kick when i stomp on the gas ive learned not to put a budget on things like this you usually pass it i just spend what i need to get what i want/need goal is just to build myself a v6 with more power but i dont want to just do the intake carb and cam like most people do

i know all about a SBC beeing alot easyer and cheaper to get power from and i realy aprichiate all the help

 

[futten]

should i upgrade to a edelbrock 500 carb or is the 390 holley enough?

 

[charlief1]

These engines really like a bigger carb than a 390. Get a 500 CFM Holley and stay away from the Eldelbrock carb. You'll be much happier with it in the long run.

 

[dr_frankenstein]

i would say it depends on the intake.
a weiand should either run one of the 2, 390-450cfm... or 900 cfm dominator.

edelbrock, you choose carb based on typical carb knowledge.

A.j.

 

[futten]

well im running a edelbrock intake charlie told me to get a 600 holley and change to a smaler jet but holley themselfs told me that it will be fine with the 390 but needs a bigger jet but then i need to sell that 390 which is not easy in norway most people get v8s and gett bigger carbs like 500 and up

 

[dr_frankenstein]

yea you will be fine with the 390.... will be super snappy on the response!

A.j.

 

[charlief1]

But you'll loose top end performance with a smalller carb.

 

[futten]

well i guess charlie has a good argument there

 

[dr_frankenstein]

well i guess charlie has a good argument there

true, but you already have it and you dont have to source out another.... and well... your NA..... 390s truely gonna be just fine.

A.j.

 

[futten]

hey doc is there any way i can improve the carb other then jets?

how about fuel pump will the stock one work or do i need something bigger?

 

[dr_frankenstein]

hey doc is there any way i can improve the carb other then jets?

how about fuel pump will the stock one work or do i need something bigger?

agh, well... you could de-choke and horn it.... but I wouldnt if I were you.... basicly there nuthing you really need to do... other than a good rebuild.

stock mechanical fuel pump will be fine.

A.j.

 

[charlief1]

Here you go.

Chrome Fuel Pump 1978-later Buick 231 V6 8 psi 80 GPH: eBay Motors (item 390115002517 end time Oct-01-10 13:37:41 PDT)