GNONYX
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- Oct 16, 2009
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Ha,ha, How true
new scanmaster numbers
- Thread starter 86grdnatl
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ok guys, im going to try to clear things up. I may have forgot to include some information with the restoration of this car. So heres my story. It was my grandfathers 86 gn and in 1993, for whatever reason, he parked it in his garage and never drove it again. The car had 164,000 miles on the odometer. When my grandfather passed away in 2011, my grandmother called and asked if i was interested in it. Of course i was, so i bought it. It was a total mess. The car was sitting from 1993-2011 in a enclosed garage. I took the car out and washed it, put new wheels and tires on it, removed the gas tank, replaced the fuel hanger and fuel pump (airtex fuel pump from advance auto parts, which i think doesnt have the right about of flow needed for this car), replaced the fuel filter twice with acdelco. Replaced the alternator, battery, all fuses under the hood, brand new vacuum hoses EVERYWHERE. new muffler and tailpipes, brand new copper spark plugs, spark plug wires, coil pack, ignition module, air filter, oil filter, new oil change. new headlights and tail lights. New a pillar turbo guage and scanmaster. new radiator hoses, and remanufactured maf sensor from advance auto parts. New adjustable wastegate actuator and vacuum lines, new brake hoses. The brakes were good enough for inspection because my grandfather must have replaced them before he passed.
Here are the things that i have not touched or replaced:
radiator
thermostat
intercooler connection hoses
injectors
anything internal engine related ie pistons, valves, anything like that
original steel fuel lines and return lines
And im sure a bunch of other things that i am forgetting
I have been driving the car about once or twice a week since april (when i finally got it inspected and road worthy) to keep everything on the car in shape.
But as i said before, in the above paragraph, i replaced everything that a 20 year old kid could do himself with the help from the forum. I am trying to work on this car and get it completed for my late grandfather who never got to see it back on the road. I am doing this for him so i really do appreciate any help that any members could offer me. It is just really hard for me to figure out how to do everything. I dont really have the money to pay a shop to do alot of this work because i am in school and the part time job i have only gets me so far. So i hope that this post helped to clear alot of the questions that anyone had up so that i can continue to restore this awesome car. Thanks alot, Justin
Here are the things that i have not touched or replaced:
radiator
thermostat
intercooler connection hoses
injectors
anything internal engine related ie pistons, valves, anything like that
original steel fuel lines and return lines
And im sure a bunch of other things that i am forgetting
I have been driving the car about once or twice a week since april (when i finally got it inspected and road worthy) to keep everything on the car in shape.
But as i said before, in the above paragraph, i replaced everything that a 20 year old kid could do himself with the help from the forum. I am trying to work on this car and get it completed for my late grandfather who never got to see it back on the road. I am doing this for him so i really do appreciate any help that any members could offer me. It is just really hard for me to figure out how to do everything. I dont really have the money to pay a shop to do alot of this work because i am in school and the part time job i have only gets me so far. So i hope that this post helped to clear alot of the questions that anyone had up so that i can continue to restore this awesome car. Thanks alot, Justin
GNONYX
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- Joined
- Oct 16, 2009
- Messages
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Hi Justin,
My condolence to you and your family, and I can relate to you having your car running correctly and true to being original.
On the other side of the coin, you're one lucky 20 year old to have an 86 Buick Grand National especially when it was your grandfather.
It seems you have done some spring cleaning, and as far as the other things not being touch, you only need to do the thermostat and as I mention before and bring the radiator to a radiator shop. Most of the work can be done by yourself, and do a lot of price research on parts replacement.
If the intercooler connection hoses are still in good shape leave them be.
Right now you don't know if the fuel pump from Advance auto is causing your engine to run rough or it may be the injector has vanish build up since that is also original.
On the next gas fill up or if the tank is half full put some fuel injector cleaner I used with no issue: Lucas Injector Cleaners and Fuel Conditioners.
Some members are trying to help you out on your fuel issue, first thing you need to remove the cat install a test pipe in place and also check to see you have any crack headers.
As Charlief1 mention:
A clogged cat would cause the car to loose power and I have seen them cause a backfire once they start going bad so it is possible. Depending on where you live you may be able to just shell it out or replace it with one of the spun metalic units rather than a stock type so it will flow better.
I had, I believe an 86' Buick Skyhawk 4cyl. Turbo (Love that car) over 100,000 and I knew my cat was clogged since the temp was very high and losing power when I accelerated. Replaced it temp went down and had more power until the valves needed work .
Keep us posted of your venture
The pump you have should be enough to do better than the gauge is indicating. Did you get a chance to check voltage at the pump's electrical connector at the back of the tank. Did you get my PM?
It sounds like you have already put lots of effort into getting the car back on the road and running right Justin. My car sat for about 10 years in someone's garage before I picked it up and I know first hand what its like to try and get it road ready. Been working on it for close to a year already and have gone from new paint to changing plugs, wires, coil packs, module, brakes, vacuum lines, and most recently installing a hydroboost brake system. There definitely is lots to learn.
Back to the subject at hand..... While a clogged catalytic converter would most certainly cause you to lose power and possibly backfire, stall etc, it wont explain why you only see 39lbs of fuel pressure at WOT and why the O2 sensor is at 003 either. In my opinion, you should start by fixing the obvious fueling issue and buy a known good MAF or possibly upgrade to a translator as Ttype6 has suggested. Injectors could also be an issue as GNONYX indicated.
Change out your thermostat for a 160 degree and that will definitely bring your temps down.. If it doesn't help then you can look at the radiator. With that being said, it's not unusual for a car to run around 200 degrees as i believe the original thermostat opened at 190 degrees. Again, change it out and see what happens.
Take it one step at a time and see what that does to the performance of the car. Start with the obvious and then see what develops and good luck and keep us posted.
Back to the subject at hand..... While a clogged catalytic converter would most certainly cause you to lose power and possibly backfire, stall etc, it wont explain why you only see 39lbs of fuel pressure at WOT and why the O2 sensor is at 003 either. In my opinion, you should start by fixing the obvious fueling issue and buy a known good MAF or possibly upgrade to a translator as Ttype6 has suggested. Injectors could also be an issue as GNONYX indicated.
Change out your thermostat for a 160 degree and that will definitely bring your temps down.. If it doesn't help then you can look at the radiator. With that being said, it's not unusual for a car to run around 200 degrees as i believe the original thermostat opened at 190 degrees. Again, change it out and see what happens.
Take it one step at a time and see what that does to the performance of the car. Start with the obvious and then see what develops and good luck and keep us posted.
Step one
I took the car out to test to see if the fuel pressure rises with boost. i was idling at about 32 lbs on the gauge. I got the car up to 10 lbs of boost and the fuel pressure gauge read 40 lbs. I tried again got the car up to about 15 lbs of boost on the second run and the fp gauge only read about 42 lbs. Would you think that the fuel pump, or regulator is the problem? I would like to check the voltage at the pumps electrical connector as well, how would i check that again?
Thanks alot for the reply, yes i plan to start off with the fuel pressure issue and see what happens from there. All of the information and stuff for these cars can be a little overbearing and intimidating at times, and i appreciate any input that i can get from people like you who know there way around this car like the back of there hand.
I know i am lucky to have a classic car like this, but i sometimes i believe that i may have bit off more than i can chew. However, i am going to keep working on it and see what happens. I have been putting fuel injector cleaner in the tank at about 1/2 tank for the last two months probably. I do think that i can see an improvent, just slightly. I did find a very small crack in my driver side header tho. Would this be a possible cause of the overheating? And i am probably not going to try to change the headers out anytime soon, would that be a very hard job to do?
Quick question... you say that you went up to 15 lbs of boost? what actuator did you replace your stock one with? Are you reading your boost on an aftermarket boost gauge?
. I used an actuator from kirban performance. When I installed it, I made sure it was exactly the same length as the stock non-adjustable one. And yes, I am using an a pillar mounted vdo boost gauge. 15 lbs of boost is the MOST I've ever got it to go up to, the car usually stumbles around 12 lbs of boost
Don't go full throttle any more.
You probably have a bad pump.
Check the voltage at the connector,or do you not have access to a volt meter.
Your header is a non issue.
Go to the back of the tank. You'll see the connector. You'll need a volt meter. I like to stick a safety pin through the wire's insulation,or you can stick it into the back of the connector housing. I think the wire is red with a white or silver stripe. You'll know if you have the right wire when you see 10-12 volts. Check it with the car running.
The car has to be running,so you can't unplug it. You can meter the wire on either side of the connector.
Gotcha, I'll let you know what I find ASAP
If you got the HD Actuator I believe the lowest boost setting on those is 18 lbs.. you will need a chip for it as the stock chip is set up for 12 lbs... And since you are experiencing problems after 12 lbs this may be an issue too..
And regarding checking the voltage at the pump, just get the hotwire kit and fuel pump. It's one of the first things done to these cars anyways and may even solve part of your issues. The hotwire bypasses the factory wiring and connects directly to the alternator. Then the factory wiring is out of the equation, at least as it pertains to the fuel pump...lol.. I've read some posts that say factory wiring can lose 2-3 volts by the time it gets to the pump.
Ok cool thanks. That is the one that I will probably end up buying.
GNONYX
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Oct 16, 2009
- Messages
- 1,761
It may seem overwhelming, but like I said one issue at a time, and you will finally enjoy the work you did and learn how to repair and tune your own engine without the expense of a mechanic shop.
The small header crack is probably why your Bl is low, and repairing the crack headers is not as bad as it sound.
Patience, then remove both side, if one has a crack probably the other side may also be crack. When that time comes reach out and post and we'll help you then.
For now other members are helping you with the fuel problem you are having now, and lets correct that issue first.
