No Start - A real head scratcher

[turbo-we4]

Guys I've tried everything. I have all of the charts from Vortex and I've done everything.
My quest started a month ago when I was running the car, while in storage, to get the fluids going. While idling I found a short in the computer wire near the battery. While starting and killing the motor by moving the wire, I found the short after the fourth start. After fixing the short near the weather pack connection I tried to start it and had a no start!! For the last month I've checked everything including verifying the computer is good and changing out many of the normal problem areas. I have fuel pressure, I have the SES light, I have fuel injector pulse and verified with a noid light. I have spark and new plugs. I have a new crank sensor, and I've reset the cam sensor. I have the coil pack and module tester and both have tested fine. Now for something really funny, when I remove one of the spark plugs and put the plug wire back on it then ground the threads while turning it over, the car will start. Even with one plug missing and the hole open!! I have looked at all of the grounds on my ground relocation kit and they look fine. I'm thinking it has to be a ground or something with the cam sensor. I have datalogger if someone wants to see the file.
Dave Ruffcorn
87 WE4
Stock Block DLS motor, Forged Eagle Crank, Forged J1 Rods, JE Pistons, Roller Cam, Champion Iron Heads, TA61 turbo, 50# MSDs, Extended Stock Location IC,

 

[trixdout]

Do you have a different calpak chip? Swap one in the Em board and see if she fires. The calpak chip is the small chip on the board. But before you do. Remove the 14-pin connector on the side of the ignition module. When looking at it, key on engine off, check with a volt meter for 12volts dc on pins p and m. If you don't have a full 12volts, change that calpak chip. And then see what's up.

Sent from my iPhone using Turbo Buick

 

[TurboBuRick]

Does it respond at all to starting fluid?

 

[turbo nasty]

Theres a black plastic "block" on the positive ecm feed by the weather pack connector you mentioned by battery. Check that area for integrity its notorious for breaking internally.

Posted from the TurboBuick.Com mobile app

 

[turbo-we4]

Do you have a different calpak chip? Swap one in the Em board and see if she fires. The calpak chip is the small chip on the board. But before you do. Remove the 14-pin connector on the side of the ignition module. When looking at it, key on engine off, check with a volt meter for 12volts dc on pins p and m. If you don't have a full 12volts, change that calpak chip. And then see what's up.

Sent from my iPhone using Turbo Buick

Tonight I've tested pins p and m on the module connector and have battery voltage of 12.54. I don't have another calpak but the computer was tested on another car yesterday with the same calpak. I can get one tomorrow if you think I should try it. It tries to start on starting fluid just like gas. I've also drained the gas and added some fresh 93 octane. It wants to start but just isn't there. Here's another clue, after it loads up with gas it fires on the intake side with smoke coming out of the open vac. port where I shot the starting fluid. It shot one of the bolts out of the vac block and I found it under the intake.
Dave Ruffcorn

 

[turbo-we4]

Theres a black plastic "block" on the positive ecm feed by the weather pack connector you mentioned by battery. Check that area for integrity its notorious for breaking internally.

Posted from the TurboBuick.Com mobile app

I don't see a black plastic block near the weather pack connector but I'll check further down the line it could be under the wireloom.
Dave

 

[broke]

Subscribed so I can see where this goes.

 

[trixdout]

Tonight I've tested pins p and m on the module connector and have battery voltage of 12.54. I don't have another calpak but the computer was tested on another car yesterday with the same calpak. I can get one tomorrow if you think I should try it. It tries to start on starting fluid just like gas. I've also drained the gas and added some fresh 93 octane. It wants to start but just isn't there. Here's another clue, after it loads up with gas it fires on the intake side with smoke coming out of the open vac. port where I shot the starting fluid. It shot one of the bolts out of the vac block and I found it under the intake.
Dave Ruffcorn

If you tried it on another car and its works, then it's fine. Try a different chip, like a different tt chip or the stock chip.

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[turbo-we4]

If you tried it on another car and its works, then it's fine. Try a different chip, like a different tt chip or the stock chip.

Sent from my iPhone using Turbo Buick

I've tried two different chips and the chip I normally use is a TT. I've pulled all of the plugs on one side to verify spark to a ground. It will actually run on the left over fuel with one of the plugs out of the block.

 

[Phoneguy]

If your plugs are fuel fouled you need to replace them all. If they are fouled try this, remove all plugs, clean them with carb cleaner, re gap. unplug the orange connector for the ECM and turn the car over several times to clear the cylinders. Re connect ECM orange wire,Replace the plugs and see if it fires.

Bryan

 

[TurboBuRick]

Give the cam sensor a little turn...

 

[TurboTdr3.8]

I have done this also to get hard to start cars going pull plug wires off far enough to make them jump fire to the plugs and then try to start it , worked for me many times when the plugs were trying to foul out .

 

[TurboBuRick]

I have done this also to get hard to start cars going pull plug wires off far enough to make them jump fire to the plugs and then try to start it , worked for me many times when the plugs were trying to foul out .

 

[turbo-we4]

Ok, I've made sure the good gas is up to the rail, the plugs have been replaced and I clean them after each try. I'm thinking it has to be the cam sensor set too far advanced. I've set the cam sensor with Caspers sensor tool but not every car is the same. So which direction should I turn the cam sensor to be certain this isn't the issue? Clockwise?

 

[TurboBuRick]

I'm going to say counterclockwise. You'll know when you try and start it. If it gets worse, go the other way.

 

[turbo-we4]

OK guys I got the car started!! Here's what I did, changed the MAF sensor to a second one I had lying around, then I put the car in clear flood mode by putting the gas pedal to the floor while starting it. I don't think it was the MAF but I'll change it back tomorrow to verify. I believe it was the IAC and TPS together. The IAC had been acting funny by surging at start-up and stalling during warm-up. I changed the oil right away because of fuel contamination. Now I need to set the cam sensor again and replace the water pump, its leaking and making noise.
Thanks for all your help!