picked up a rough 87 Grand National - how to approach project?

[paradigm]

Picked up an 87 Grand National clean title car with 98k miles from NJ. VIN checks out as does the RPO sticker / WE2 code. The car is a bit of a mess, with the wrong trim bits on it, rotted areas on floors, areas cut out of the rear driver fender, doors not in good shape with holes along the bottom, and original drivetrain is gone and an incomplete LS swap sits in it. Frame looks solid, most body panels look decent, trunk is solid. A lot of the wiring has been modified due to swap, unsure if the motor and transmission are operable (5.3 LM7 + 4L80e with no driveshaft). Not sure what condition the brakes are, and how ready the fuel system is.

How would you guys approach this project?
Work on the floors first? then drivetrain?
Before I get the motor running, I want to paint the engine bay which will be a good bit of work on its own removing the inner fenders, other metal bits, preparing everything, and priming / painting. I have never done metal work or welding. I am hoping to buy a mig welder and learn on the floor.

driver floor looking forward:

driver floor looking rear:

passenger floor looking rear:

Areas of floor suspected to be rotted out:

 

[paradigm]

Engine bay (this will probably upset many here):

 

[TexasT]

Goal for the project?

I'd do the floors and look for a series II v6 and 4l80e and aftermarket ecu/tcu and make it run and drive. Nothing kills a project faster than loosing interest. If it is running and driving way harder to loose interests.

But you do you.

 

[Turbo6inKY]

Goal for the project?

Yup. You haven't provided enough info on what YOU want out of it.

Sure, the rust needs to be fixed no matter what you're going to do, but beyond that, what do you want?

You bought a basket case, that much is clear. The only way you get anywhere is set a goal. If you set a goal, we can help you get there. If there's no goal, we're not taking the engagebait.

 

[Buckshot G/N]

What ever desire that drove you to purchase that hodge-podge case GN, I'm for sure you where aware the endeavor ahead. As stated above addressing the severe rust first and not loosing focus on the task at hand. These are fun cars and will eat a hole in your pocket. But in your case to restore car just adequately, you're still dealing with a money pit. Wish you well and joy on your project.

 

[Chuck Leeper]

Put the engine/trans in an S10 and part out/junk the rest.

 

[paradigm]

Goal for the project?

I'd do the floors and look for a series II v6 and 4l80e and aftermarket ecu/tcu and make it run and drive. Nothing kills a project faster than loosing interest. If it is running and driving way harder to loose interests.

But you do you.

Goal is to get the body cleaned up, get all the trim and interior restored back to original, and get the LS drivetrain running. Basically have a clean rust free painted GN with the LS drivetrain. If I keep the car long enough I could eventually look to swap back in the original drive train but that’s way down the road. I’m unsure if the rear end is the factory 8.5” - how can I tell?

 

[paradigm]

Yup. You haven't provided enough info on what YOU want out of it.

Sure, the rust needs to be fixed no matter what you're going to do, but beyond that, what do you want?

You bought a basket case, that much is clear. The only way you get anywhere is set a goal. If you set a goal, we can help you get there. If there's no goal, we're not taking the engagebait.

Goal is to get the body and interior cleaned up back to near factory spec, but get a he LS drivetrain running for now. Then if I keep it longer term, look to swap back in the factory drivetrain.

 

[paradigm]

What ever desire that drove you to purchase that hodge-podge case GN, I'm for sure you where aware the endeavor ahead. As stated above addressing the severe rust first and not loosing focus on the task at hand. These are fun cars and will eat a hole in your pocket. But in your case to restore car just adequately, you're still dealing with a money pit. Wish you well and joy on your project.

I’ve always liked the look of the GN since I was a kid and these cars were new. I recently owned a clean Monte Carlo SS with an LS swap and I always preferred the Regal / GN body style.

 

[TIMINATOR]

Sell it to someone you are mad at or part it out, and find another project car closer to your end goal.
These cars contain so many rare, unavailable, and specialized parts that you don't have and I would guess you can't afford or you wouldn't have bought this car, hopefully inexpensively.
Its also my guess that you don't know anyone that has intimate knowlege of these cars, or they wouldn't have recommended that you purchase it.
No offense intended, but you are waaaaay over your head here, and I believe you would have 2 or 3 times more in it than what the car is worth when or if it's finished.
The less you know about these cars, the more time you need to spend finding a near perfect specimen.
I own a machine and fab shop, have owned 2 other GNs, and have spent the last 5+ years and countless $$$ making my "I thought this would be an easy to finish project" finished.
Someone would probably like to make a drag car out of yours, and I think that's how you should market it.
Not to rain on your parade, but I don't believe you could break even on anything you spend on it before you decide to give up on it
I have spent over $24k on my "running, driving, close to finished as purchased project." And I'm still not satisfied or finished 5+years later. At $32,500, if I can get that, it won't cover my expenses, and my labor was free. JMHO
TIMINATOR

 

[paradigm]

Sell it to someone you are mad at or part it out, and find another project car closer to your end goal.
These cars contain so many rare, unavailable, and specialized parts that you don't have and I would guess you can't afford or you wouldn't have bought this car, hopefully inexpensively.
Its also my guess that you don't know anyone that has intimate knowlege of these cars, or they wouldn't have recommended that you purchase it.
No offense intended, but you are waaaaay over your head here, and I believe you would have 2 or 3 times more in it than what the car is worth when or if it's finished.
The less you know about these cars, the more time you need to spend finding a near perfect specimen.
I own a machine and fab shop, have owned 2 other GNs, and have spent the last 5+ years and countless $$$ making my "I thought this would be an easy to finish project" finished.
Someone would probably like to make a drag car out of yours, and I think that's how you should market it.
Not to rain on your parade, but I don't believe you could break even on anything you spend on it before you decide to give up on it
I have spent over $24k on my "running, driving, close to finished as purchased project." And I'm still not satisfied or finished 5+years later. At $32,500, if I can get that, it won't cover my expenses, and my labor was free. JMHO
TIMINATOR

You bought your car originally for $8500? What kinda shape is was it in back then?

Yeah I know the car is in rough shape, but after going through a MC SS with an incomplete LS, and also not fully back together, and being my first Gbody project, for some reason I am not too intimidated.

I don’t see this one as being much worse other than floor needing to be patched and the rear driver fender area needing metal work, the rest doesn’t seem that bad. It’s going back as an LS car. But as you said I wasn’t informed so let’s see.

I don’t believe the car is part out worthy and I would like to save it. In terms of affordability, I could absolutely afford better but chose not to, the challenge is part of the fun.

I hope to make some sort of cool looking restomod out of it. Or maybe I’ll come to a hard realization that I am in way over my head as you said, and it’s not worth it, and sell it as a running beat up GN.

 

[TIMINATOR]

I wish!!!!!
Bought it for about double that in 2019. It had fresh body and paint, freshly tinted windows, good tires, near new turbo, fresh engine (by what turned out to be a "lesser grade" machineshop, and kicked out both headgaskets within 12 miles!) functioning A/C, new aluminum radiator (cheap and soon failed), new shocks (incorrect length), big (but chineese) fuel pump, recently rebuilt posi rearend (7 1/2" 2.46 gears! not an 8 1/2" 3.42) my fault. I didn't crawl under there. A "rebuilt" trans that soon failed, with a stock V-6 convertor.
Incorrect driveshaft, (too long).
I can go on, but you get the picture, and I am (in the business!)
All of this from a 20+ year "friend" that sold it to me.
It also had a portfolio of recipts from work he and the previous owner had done. Neither of them are "car guys."
So much for recipes and friendship.....
I'm buried in this car. The next guy will get a bargain, I built it for a nice, fast, good handling "weekend mountain cruising" car for the wife and I.
The wife died a week and a half after I purchased it, and never rode in it due to the soon after purchase headgasket issue.
I put a lot of time and cash in this car, and with running a business and the memories attached to the car, it's going to a specialty car consignment dealer once I am confidant of its reliability. I am an old experienced car guy and look at all I missed. Good luck with whatever you decide!
P.S. 12 lbs, premium gas and no detonation signs....
TIMINATOR

 

[paradigm]

I wish!!!!!
Bought it for about double that in 2019. It had fresh body and paint, freshly tinted windows, good tires, near new turbo, fresh engine (by what turned out to be a "lesser grade" machineshop, and kicked out both headgaskets within 12 miles!) functioning A/C, new aluminum radiator (cheap and soon failed), new shocks (incorrect length), big (but chineese) fuel pump, recently rebuilt posi rearend (7 1/2" 2.46 gears! not an 8 1/2" 3.42) my fault. I didn't crawl under there. A "rebuilt" trans that soon failed, with a stock V-6 convertor.
Incorrect driveshaft, (too long).
I can go on, but you get the picture, and I am (in the business!)
All of this from a 20+ year "friend" that sold it to me.
It also had a portfolio of recipts from work he and the previous owner had done. Neither of them are "car guys."
So much for recipes and friendship.....
I'm buried in this car. The next guy will get a bargain, I built it for a nice, fast, good handling "weekend mountain cruising" car for the wife and I.
The wife died a week and a half after I purchased it, and never rode in it due to the soon after purchase headgasket issue.
I put a lot of time and cash in this car, and with running a business and the memories attached to the car, it's going to a specialty car consignment dealer once I am confidant of its reliability. I am an old experienced car guy and look at all I missed. Good luck with whatever you decide!
P.S. 12 lbs, premium gas and no detonation signs....
TIMINATOR

Sorry for your loss, that is tough.
As for the car, I bought it knowing it will be work. Its going to need some body work in the rear fenders, new driver door, floor patches. POR-15, Mastercoat, KBS or equivalent on the frame, rear end, underbody. Clean up the engine bay and paint it.

Then clean up the LS motor (compression test showed high numbers, around 180 to 210 which seem off), get it wired up, get a drive shaft made to go between the 4L80e and rear end. Get the alternator, battery, starter, power and ground wiring and charging system working.

Get all the wiring to run the car setup. Ignition On needs to be put back to the key ignition, it was re wired as push start. Get electric fans setup with relay controlled off LS PCM. Get the LS PCM wired up to gauges (unsure if I will go stock or aftermarket).

Need to check the fuel tank, fuel lines, fuel pump and see if any of that needs to be addressed.

Then there is the brakes; need to check out the front brake setup and replace what is necessary or possibly looking to go with larger calipers / rotors from a newer GM car. New brake booster, and possibly new brake lines. Rear drums I want to convert to disc, not sure which GM car I will take that off of.

Then attempt to run the car, and hopefully the trans, motor and rear end are good otherwise replace whatever is necessary.

There is a ton of other stuff to address before I can get it running.

Once the car is running smoothly, tuned, then I look to complete body work, factory looking LED headlights, 87 GN grill, new handles, door locks, wheel molding trims, new front and rear lamp bezels, new front side markers, prime and paint, new door strip moldings, new bumper fillers in front, repaint the existing in rear, new emblems.

Then interior. New carpets, repainted interior trim pieces, either aftermarket front seats or re-upholstered stock front seat, rear bench looks good, new upper door panels, aftermarket stereo system, new headliner, headliner trim repainted, new LEDs in factory locations, new driver front seat belt.

Then suspension work. A stage 3 or 4 tubular kit with coilovers. Body mount bushings and every other bushing I can get at.

I am missing a bunch of stuff. It is going to be a labor of love and some money.

 

[TexasT]

frame zip tied to wall



body sitting on a stack of 40x48 pallets
Plenty of parts but just as much missing. If you wrench you will be ok, if you don't and have to pay someone or more than one, you are underwater in a hurry. This is my current focus. I also managed to acquire this one as a roller.



Had to bring my own wheels but it came with an 8.5 and interior and some nasty holes under the rear seat that we will address at some point.
In the middle was this one I ended up cutting up and using the rolling chassis to get that one with the frame up against the wall. The original had been "violated" by a young person who unceremoniously wore out the pass quarter and "hurt" the frame.





For that white one under the rear seat.


Quarter for the OG we4

While we are still "mid" project on these due to a 2023 job loss and fundage setback, we will get one or more going. Goal is for a drag n drive or at least a power tour and some local events. I do miss driving a g body.

Just have realistic goals. I'm not an ls guy but yours ain't mine so you do you. I'm more of a series II buick v6 and we have one on tap my son bought for another project that may or may not go forward(and it is sitting on a pallet waiting for the call on that). I've started studying up on 4l80e stuff and might even go that way. One will get a 9 inch rear as I only have two of those 8.5 units and the OG car will retain its and get a quarter.

 

[BEATAV8]

Car doesn’t look too awful in the pics. I sorta like cars that could use some body work. Like you say fix the floors get it driving and drive it. It’ll turn some heads just as it is.

 

[THensley]

Paradigm last pic looks better than the first set and it looks like the reared has the ears sticking down indicating it's a 8.5.
once you do the research a 8.5 is easy to spot , If you get down on the ground and look. Timm a good mechanic and made the a simple old mistake and took a friends word.
And Texes T you have project too have fun fellows

 

[TexasT]

Paradigm last pic looks better than the first set and it looks like the reared has the ears sticking down indicating it's a 8.5.
once you do the research a 8.5 is easy to spot , If you get down on the ground and look. Timm a good mechanic and made the a simple old mistake and took a friends word.
And Texes T you have project too have fun fellows

With the age of these cars, they are ALL projects. Just some are bigger than others. I wanted a limited and I doubt I could put together the fundage all at once to go that route so when this one came up even though it was some assembly required I jumped in.

Looking at the bottom of the pumpkin of a ten bolt, If it has Fangs it is 7.5 if it is squared off you have the 8.5.