PTFE Rear Main Seals ?

[KWIKR 1]

Maybe I've found something of Rear Main Seal Importance . - TurboBuicks.com

if anyone has any info on these types of rear main seals please chime in . Thanks .

 

[Lee Thompson]

?

I assume you are currently using a neophrene rear main seal. What about the crank? Is it knurled? If so, what brand is it, assuming it is aftermarket?

 

[KWIKR 1]

I assume you are currently using a neophrene rear main seal. What about the crank? Is it knurled? If so, what brand is it, assuming it is aftermarket?

yes it is a neophrene seal in it right now . It's a BA Performance crank , not knurled .

 

[Lee Thompson]

I have said this more than

yes it is a neophrene seal in it right now . It's a BA Performance crank , not knurled .

There is your problem--you can not run a smooth seal on a smooth crank--one or both must be knurled. Had an eng. out 4 times before I got my leak stopped.

 

[KWIKR 1]

There is your problem--you can not run a smooth seal on a smooth crank--one or both must be knurled. Had an eng. out 4 times before I got my leak stopped.

I've never seen a "knurled" seal ??? The seal in there now is a FelPro BS40613 . I could be wrong but I honestly do not remember a knurl on the BA stroker crank .

 

[Lee Thompson]

Imho

I've never seen a "knurled" seal ??? The seal in there now is a FelPro BS40613 . I could be wrong but I honestly do not remember a knurl on the BA stroker crank .

I questioned this when the smooth (no knurling) cranks starting appearing. Big block Chevy and I'm sure there are others seals have knurling molded into them. I bought @ least 4 different brands V-6 Buick neophrene seals. All of them had the same part # molded into them. They are all made by the same company up around Chicago. Different package-different name --same seal. Ranging in price from $13 to $3. None of them had knurling on them and one reason being that the seal is very narrow as compared to a big block Chevy. No enough room to put enough on.
There is a post on this subject some where. I have installed 2 BA stroker cranks and neither was knurled when I got them. The first one went in a later Stage II block that took a Chevy seal. No need to knurl that one. The second one went in a 109 block so I had it knurled before installing. Neither leaked. Sorry to say, but I firmly believe you will have to have your crank knurled to stop it from leaking. The knurling acts as a pump to pump the oil away from the seal. Without it it floods the seal and gets by it. Let me guess, you have around 200 miles on your new eng. or that is what I would get before it started dripping and steadly got worse. Depending on how hard the crank is you may be able to get a shop to do it. The first crank a ran into with this problem was a BMS Moldex prepared carnk that was so had that Moldex could not knurl it. I have a local friend who installed the knuling by hand. 501389-2 is the # stamped on all the Buick seals I have. As I said they came from different sources. Somewhere around $13 for the Club and Felpro seal to $ 4 from the place I can buy them. Have to buy 20 to get them @ that price. BTW I believe that is the same supplier the Club uses because I called the Club once looking to buy one of thier Super seal and was told they were out but had 20 coming. Pretty good mark up !!!!. Best of luck.

 

[KWIKR 1]

I questioned this when the smooth (no knurling) cranks starting appearing. Big block Chevy and I'm sure there are others seals have knurling molded into them. I bought @ least 4 different brands V-6 Buick neophrene seals. All of them had the same part # molded into them. They are all made by the same company up around Chicago. Different package-different name --same seal. Ranging in price from $13 to $3. None of them had knurling on them and one reason being that the seal is very narrow as compared to a big block Chevy. No enough room to put enough on.
There is a post on this subject some where. I have installed 2 BA stroker cranks and neither was knurled when I got them. The first one went in a later Stage II block that took a Chevy seal. No need to knurl that one. The second one went in a 109 block so I had it knurled before installing. Neither leaked. Sorry to say, but I firmly believe you will have to have your crank knurled to stop it from leaking. The knurling acts as a pump to pump the oil away from the seal. Without it it floods the seal and gets by it. Let me guess, you have around 200 miles on your new eng. or that is what I would get before it started dripping and steadly got worse. Depending on how hard the crank is you may be able to get a shop to do it. The first crank a ran into with this problem was a BMS Moldex prepared carnk that was so had that Moldex could not knurl it. I have a local friend who installed the knuling by hand. 501389-2 is the # stamped on all the Buick seals I have. As I said they came from different sources. Somewhere around $13 for the Club and Felpro seal to $ 4 from the place I can buy them. Have to buy 20 to get them @ that price. BTW I believe that is the same supplier the Club uses because I called the Club once looking to buy one of thier Super seal and was told they were out but had 20 coming. Pretty good mark up !!!!. Best of luck.

yep...I'd be pretty close to that mileage . I guess I'll live with it this year unless I can find something to correct it . and just pull the engine out next off season . Thanks for the info . I have a email to a company that makes custom seals . I'll see what they come back with .

 

[KWIKR 1]

got a reply back from the seal company they are looking for the following info .
shaft O.D., seal housing I.D. and depth or width.

can anyone help out with this info ? this is the only info I can dig up from the link below . not sure if it's correct .


::: Engine Tech Catalog Online :::

 

[KWIKR 1]

well got a reply back from the company that makes custom automotive PTFE seals for NASCAR , etc . After checking his data base he can not find anything that would work for a Buick V6 . he can build a new PTFE seal for our engines but the intial setup cost will be $500 for the first lot of 25 , his cost . This would include the engineering/create blueprints/program machinery/manufactor . Not a bad deal considering similar seals list for $30-$35 . These PTFE seals would work well on a non-knurled crankshaft . anyone interested in 24 seals ? I only need one . .

 

[lazaris]

I'll try one.

 

[Alky V6]

I'll take 5.

 

[KWIKR 1]

If someone wants to take over and run with this it will be alot easier being done from States than it being shipped up here to Canada and then back down .Because of the added shipping expense and duty charges/brokerage fees (25%) that would have to be passed on to the price . The contact name is Jerad Lindsey at jeradlindsey@hotmail.com . you can put me down for 4.

Link to company : Design and Consultation Services for Custom Seals and Fasteners for Extreme Applications: Signal Seals & Fasteners - North Carolina

 

[Eticket]

Guys.. I have a fix for this! Thanks to Lee Thompson for the extensive research on the problem.

Here's a teaser.

Someone guess what this is? See the knurling on the seal itself

Will cost you about $25.

 

[Alky V6]

Looks like someone found a seal.

 

[KWIKR 1]

Guys.. I have a fix for this! Thanks to Lee Thompson for the extensive research on the problem.

Here's a teaser.

Someone guess what this is? See the knurling on the seal itself

Will cost you about $25.

please share . I'm not sure if it's the pic but the seal looks rather large in the pic compared to the Felpro BS40613 I'm looking at .or you have small hands .

 

[Eticket]

The seal on the right is a stocker.. the seal on the left is ???? hmm..

Sorry guys... this problem with th leaking kept me from really enjoying driving my stage II car "everywhere" for probably 2 years. It would leak 1/2 qt in 30 minutes of driving sometimes (but would plateau down to 6 qts). That's why I'm leaving you in suspense and letting you guess for now.

I was ecstatic when I got this figured out! car only seeped a little sometimes after this fix.

 

[KWIKR 1]

The seal on the right is a stocker.. the seal on the left is ???? hmm..

Sorry guys... this problem with th leaking kept me from really enjoying driving my stage II car "everywhere" for probably 2 years. It would leak 1/2 qt in 30 minutes of driving sometimes (but would plateau down to 6 qts). That's why I'm leaving you in suspense and letting you guess for now.

I was ecstatic when I got this figured out! car only seeped a little sometimes after this fix.

PLEASE don't keep us in suspense to long , because I plan on pulling my pan most likely tomorrow .

ok.... I'll start you answer yes or no .

Is it a Chevy seal ?

and it's not a FelPro #2904 Chevy BB/Stage 2 seal ?

 

[Eticket]

Yep.. Big Block Chevy Seal.

If you think about it. it is what goes into the late stage II engines, which means that the crank dimensions are close enough.

All I did was cut up a BBC seal with a dremel cutoff wheel and made the big lip side narrower by gently grinding away at it on the side of a bench grinder.

I lived with the seal edge not being "perfect" so long as there was always tension between it and the crank surface.

It is good that you will do this with a crank in the engine - because as you whittle away at the seal, you can do test fits.. you can feel how snug the seal is with the crank.. and what it takes, width wise, to get the seal and still have the crank be able to rotate without a bind.

This second picture will help you with what the profile looks like. I have to run errands right now, but I can draw out these details/steps if you guys are interested this evening.

 

[Lee Thompson]

Knurling

The blue Chevy seal shows the knurling molded into it. Wonder if someone could TOOL UP and cut them PERFECT to fit the Buick ?

 

[Eticket]

I think there'd be a problem with systematically cutting them because they are rubber with the steel core. But believe me.. mine was just done with an eye ball and it worked great.