Quick question for police officers.

[V6UnderPressure]

I know that nowadays, most cop cars have cameras/microphones built in. My question is this. If I get pulled over, is it ok for me to have a tape recorder on hand recording also???

Also another quick question. I heard that in Illinois, they were going to raise the fine for no front license plate to 100 bucks. Anyone else hear this???

Thanks!

Scott

 

[TurboJunky]

Yes, you may record any in person conversation you wish without disclosing the fact you're recording it. State laws differ when recording PHONE conversations you're involved in. Federal law allows it but states may restrict that. Monica Lewinsky was faced with that since she recorded some conversations she was a party to in one state and recorded some in another. One state allowed it while the other did not.

As far as Illinois upping their fines/fees for not having a front plate I would suggest checking the state's web site or Illinois State Police site. You can also call your local district court and ask them directly since they're the ones that levy fines for that offense.

I'm glad Michigan doesn't have front plates since I could find myself making that a pet-peeve. As far as I'm concerned there's no reason not to have one if it's legally required, just as there isn't a valid reason not to have a rear one. It's highly suspicious for someone to remove their front plate. From a police officer's point of view it's a purposeful act and is highly suspicious. Perhaps someone's planning a crime and doesn't want their plate read.

 

[ALXTTA 1]

Hmmm...I didn't hear that about the front plates. (You'd think that they'd be getting enough $$$ now from doubling the tolls if you don't have IPASS..)
I can tell you that in the 3 or 4 times I've been pulled over in my TTA (never by the State Police, but at least once by a Lake County sheriff), they've never said a word about the front plate, which it isn't even drilled for. It probably doesn't hurt to be extremely curteous and respectful in a traffic stop (which I'd do anyway, but if it also earns me a little leaniency...all the better.)

 

[Captain Mark]

The state of Texas requires front plates, and my TTA has never had one. I have been pulled over twice and it has never been brought up. I would hate to drill holes in the front of my car!

 

[Pablo]

I guess now I see how someone can get a ticket for not having one.


I thought it was blatantly obvious why someone wouldnt want a front plate on their sleek sports/ muscle car.

California requires them and id say car guys that actually mount them are the minority. Theres also a huge drive to have them removed

TT/A1233 I take it you arent a libertarian by any stretch of the imagination

 

[Pablo]

..and on another note, no offense or anything TT/A, but talk like that is exactly why a good portion of people have a very negative reaction to police. Its this tone that you guys are here to "regulate" the populace that I and others find troublesome.

Especially by making your relationship with law abiding citizens adversarial because of stupid laws like that. Im sure the people you dealt with on a daily basis would be less inclined to treat you rudely and vice versa if they werent harassed over rediculously inconsequential (in the grand scheme) laws like that.

Why is an assumption made that because someone has removed their front plate that they are probably some criminal with something else up their sleeve?

I guess thats why I couldn't be a police officer.

No flame intended

 

[Captain Mark]

Remeber Pablo, the Police don't make the laws, only enforce them. When a law is passed and put on the books, it is the cops duty to enforce it, even if they don't agree with that particular law.

 

[1987 GN]

Originally posted by Captain Mark
Remeber Pablo, the Police don't make the laws, only enforce them. When a law is passed and put on the books, it is the cops duty to enforce it, even if they don't agree with that particular law.

Very true.

However TTA stated he could find himself making that a pet peeve. To me this implies he promoted himself to determining that those in violation of this law are more guilty than those people violating some other law he does not have a pet peeve about. I thought police were supposed to enforce all of the laws not just the ones they found most interesting.

 

[kalifornia87]

The smartest thing you can do is not talk to the officer, sign the ticket and move on. "anything you say can and will be used against you" They want you to talk, its evidence against you!

 

[V6UnderPressure]

Originally posted by Captain Mark
Remeber Pablo, the Police don't make the laws, only enforce them. When a law is passed and put on the books, it is the cops duty to enforce it, even if they don't agree with that particular law.

This may hold true, but this goes back to a previous argument about the neon lights incident. They are not legal, but are they REALLY causing a problem? A guy out here got pulled over on his way to work at 4am. When he asked why? They said his air freshener is blocking their view. Cmon now. That is ridiculous. And if I got pulled over for that, its no more ridiculous then the cop that pulled me over. I don't have a problem with police officers stopping crime and drugs. But having fun and keeping out of trouble is something we all try to do and laws like this keep it from happening. You officers can help by just ignoring this. And since when is a front license plate missing suspicious. If any criminal didn't remove BOTH, then thats plain dumb. Why anyone would remove the front but not the back is anyones guess. But let me take a stab at it. Because we care about our cars and we're not criminals. Flame INTENDED!

Scott

 

[V6UnderPressure]

Originally posted by kalifornia87
The smartest thing you can do is not talk to the officer, sign the ticket and move on. "anything you say can and will be used against you" They want you to talk, its evidence against you!

In this country you have the freedom of speech, which means yell, cuss, shout with glee! Whatever you want. Thats the law my friend. And no police officer will get respect if they dont show respect. There is no reason for a cop to come to the car door all cocky. This happens more times than not, and sometimes gotta look at em stupid when they tell me WHY they pull me over.

Scott

 

[V6UnderPressure]

Just an FYI, I highly doubt that at the police briefings in the mornings tell you to keep an eye out for neon lights and cool cars.

 

[Drac0nic]

Originally posted by 1987 GN
Very true.

However TTA stated he could find himself making that a pet peeve. To me this implies he promoted himself to determining that those in violation of this law are more guilty than those people violating some other law he does not have a pet peeve about. I thought police were supposed to enforce all of the laws not just the ones they found most interesting.

Yep, it all boils down to "don't shoot me, I'm just the messenger" to a degree. But I'll disgress I've met some cool cops and some real assholes, it all boils down to cops being mortal men and women. don't forget that.

 

[2QUIK6]

Wow, I haven't had a front license plate here in TX on any of my cars since 1988!! And have been stopped at least 100 times and never been asked about it during a stop. I have had a cop walk up and ask where it was when I was stuck on one of the local teen cruising streets and traffic was clogged....told him its an old car, and don't have the hanger for it, I'm not jst going to bolt the plate to the front bumper of a Collector Model Trans Am...he said cool, just for me to keep an eye out for a license mount for it that was original

In todays justice system, on the streets you are GUILTY until proven INNOCENT for most misdemeanor crimes where you just pay a fine, like traffic tickets. Case in point, there is almost no way to get out of a traffic ticket if its cops word against yours no matter how wrong the cop may be. But if I killed someone and someone witnessed it, or I even admitted it, I still have a chance to be found INNOCENT...how screwed up is that.

 

[TurboJunky]

Originally posted by Captain Mark
The state of Texas requires front plates, and my TTA has never had one. I have been pulled over twice and it has never been brought up. I would hate to drill holes in the front of my car!

No need to drill holes. Double-sided 3M trim tape works wonders. That's how I put the license plate on the back of my travel trailer after the mount broke. Worked like a charm and damn did I have a hard time pulling it off!

 

[TurboJunky]

Originally posted by Pablo
..and on another note, no offense or anything TT/A, but talk like that is exactly why a good portion of people have a very negative reaction to police. Its this tone that you guys are here to "regulate" the populace that I and others find troublesome.

Especially by making your relationship with law abiding citizens adversarial because of stupid laws like that. Im sure the people you dealt with on a daily basis would be less inclined to treat you rudely and vice versa if they werent harassed over rediculously inconsequential (in the grand scheme) laws like that.

Why is an assumption made that because someone has removed their front plate that they are probably some criminal with something else up their sleeve?

I guess thats why I couldn't be a police officer.

No flame intended

I already stated I'm glad Michigan repealed the front plate law and am puzzled why you think I'm coming off as some sort of jerk.

Most of the drivers in states that require front plates obey the law. It's a matter of playing fair. If the state legislature says you need a front plate what makes you special that you don't have to obey that law. If you don't like the law as written, then excercise your right as a citizen to petitiion the government for a redress of grievances. I think I read that somewhere in the Constitution.

A criminal may remove one of the IDENTIFIERS of their car as in the front plate. They aren't the smartest folks in the world and may not try to be "too suspicous" and just take the front off. Without being a cop I know it's hard for the lay-person to undersand what makes us suspicous. I'm suspicous of people who put illegal, smoked plastic covers over their plates. I wonder why they want to obscure their registration information....drive off without paying gas?....drive like a moron so other's can't read their plate?....commit larcenies so people won't read the info? I'll stop and usually ticket every person I see with a dark-plastic cover over their rear license plate. Even when I was 16yr old and started driving knew it was pretty dumb to do that. There's a reason for a license plate and a reason it needs to be easily read....by everyone.

As far as having "pet-peeves" you must understand cops are human. I'm sure there's traffic infractions you see daily as a civilian that just boil your blood and others you could care less about....like missing front plates. I'm sure not everyone would agree with some of the things that infuriate you.

There's things I ticket many people for that my partners don't, and vice-versa. We're not robots but individuals.

Off my soap box, flame away.

 

[Pablo]

Obviously officers are selective in the laws they choose to enforce.

As a Sgt in the Marine Corps, I see junior Marines doing jackass things every day and breaking some regulation or another every day. If I were to stop and correct or confront every single Marine I saw doing something wrong, I would be correcting and confronting people all day long. Id also quickly get a reputation as an asshole and likely wouldnt inspire anyone to do the right thing when no one was looking.

Because of this, I pick and choose my battles.

To me, a police officer is in a very similar situation. If a police officer wanted to, he could write citations all day long. There are enough laws on the books and enough people on the streets to criminalize and or harass a huge number of people. Obviously police officers dont do this, so this notion that police officers "just enforce the law" I think is bogus.
Police officers SELECTIVELY enforce laws based on presumably sound personal judgement which amongst some police officers is severely lacking (In my personal experience) Maybe more leadership/judgement training is neccessary for some depts.


I try not to harass my junior Marines over piddly things because im not looking to have a strictly authoritarian relationship with them. When I tell them they need to fix themselves for whatever reason they (hopefully) know its not just to bust their balls for no reason. All that busting their balls would do would foster contempt to my authority. Ive seen it time and time and again when NCOs and Staff NCOs act like dictators... basically it goes in one ear, out the other and no one is inspired to do their best for that person. That doesnt help accomplish the mission and it doesnt look after your troops welfare.

In this I believe a parallel can be drawn to you and the general populous in that your mission is to enforce laws and promote the general welfare of the populace.

You can obviously draw what you will from that and how its related to harassing people over front license plates, and the plethora of laws on the books that can basically criminalize any breathing human.

just my 2 cents

 

[dgreen1069]

I think Pablo hit it on the head when he said, "Police officers SELECTIVELY enforce laws based on presumably sound personal judgement which amongst some police officers is severely lacking (In my personal experience) Maybe more leadership/judgement training is neccessary for some depts."
Police officers do selectively enforce traffic and misdemeanor laws based on their own personal beliefs.....it is called discretion. I generally don't write tickets for equipment violations...at least light bulbs and such. I think most times people don't realize their cars are broken. I think it puts a better taste in someones mouth when they get pulled over and told there is a problem rather than finding out on a citation. Along the same lines, I write every county decal violation I see.....If I have to pay my taxes, everyone has to pay. My county is pretty good about most non-moving violations. As long as the offender complies with the law (pays their taxes, gets their car fixed, puts on their front plate, etc.) the courts generally dismiss the charge. It's kinda win-win for everyone.

 

[V6UnderPressure]

Didn't mean to flame any officers here. Just stating that I get real angry every time I'm pulled over. Why you ask? Because, I think I drive very responsibly and I know that when I'm pulled over that it's for something really small and lame. And I admit, I'm a smartass the minute they walk up to the window, and I will continue to be. IF they catch me speeding, then I will respect them because of course it's dangerous. If they pull me over because I have neon lights under my car or for a air freshener, that = no respect. True you need to enforce laws, and its understood that some cops will enforce certain ones while others do not. I am here to say to you guys, please try to convince all your other fellow officers to just look the other way on equipment violations/modifications etc. There are many kids out there who tinker with their cars instead of sitting in the house smoking dope. I really thing cars gives the younger generation a chance to shy away from something bad and turn it into good. When you start enforcing laws banning everything and anything as far as modifications go (that arent harmful), it ruins it for everybody. Cars are an alternative to crime. Think about it!

Scott

 

[dgreen1069]

Scott, I think it's pretty natural to get pissed off when you get pulled over. When you think about the number of citizens on the road vs. the number of cops out there.....the likelihood of getting pulled over is pretty rare. If you are unlucky enough to get stopped, you definitely aren't living right. I very rarely get pulled over, but I do get upset when I do.....usually with myself because I should know better.

It does blow my mind every year when I get my legislative update July 1st....I find it hard to believe that year after year, VA legislators find more and more things to make illegal. In the last few years, VA has added lights on when windshield wipers are on, no more nitrous, teen license restrictions, etc. I wonder if they will ever look at the law books and say, "Enough is enough".