Shurflo and Resistor(s) Test

[salvageV6]

Here's some data someone might find interesting to use to tame the Shurflo pump when using a single M10 nozzle.

Pump is a Shurflo #8000-543-236: the cheesy bypass switch was bypassed pump was wired directly.

Water used for all tests approx. 6ft. hose 3/8" used for feed line primed first.

(2) Fluke 87 meters used and one Fluke 8050A meter used.

I'll just post the results without a current meter in-line since that is how most will wire their systems up anyway.

Current meters internal resistance and cabling did minutely affect the results so make sure you use good wiring practices when assembling any alky. system. 10 gauge wire should be good.

All flow tests were for 30 seconds to minimize on/off possible operator induced irregularities.

Pump to Source NO Resistor: 12.8 volts on pump source 13.1.
Flow was 14.0 oz.

Pump to Source using .5 ohm resistor: 8.5 volts on pump source was 13.25 volts.
Flow was 12 oz.

Pump to Source 1.0 ohm resistor: 5.52 volts on pump source was 13.4 volts.
Flow was 10 oz.

I am thinking a .75 ohm resistor of 50-75 watts would be nice for a first stage.

I think for testing a 1 ohm variable tapoff resistor will work fine for you to get the pump tamed and the flow you want for use with an M10 nozzle, it would also allow you to take a second tapoff for stage II higher voltage.

Should be available at a surplus electronics dealer either used or new relatively cheaply.

Then add another nozzle for WOT and full pump voltage and you are good for 30+ psi.

Good luck with your own DIY projects.

 

[4sfed4]

Thats good info. Thanks for the test.

Well.....the M10 is rated at 10 gpm @ 100 psi. So, in 30 seconds it should deliver about 10.6 ounces @ 100 psi.

In your tests, you got 14 ounces in 30 seconds, or 13.1 gpm.

Theoretically, that would mean the pump pressure rose to about 172 psi.

 

[Razor]

Would have been neat to test on straight alcohol since its thinner(specific gravity) than water.

Also the pumps amp draw should be kept under 15 amps.

So with the pressure switch bypassed you had higher than 15 amps.

You should run the amps test to calculate wattage for resistor used.

 

[salvageV6]

Amps. were way under 15.

Half ohm were about 9.2 amps.

One ohm were about 7.88 amps.

No ohms were about 10.8 amps.

Meter and lead resistance was a factor however lowering the total a bit I believe. Probably in the .1 to .2 ohms region which is significant with your add in resistor being .5 and 1 ohm.

Everyone can choose what pressure and flow they need in what operating range they want rather easily with a power resistor of their choice.

Pump ran rather smoothly which was what I was trying to accomplish, no wild pulsations and trying to get the spray pattern more like an efi. pump. It worked. Good for a first stage for sure.

I will try and find a suitable pressure gauge to plumb into the line but I wanted a 300 psi. one to be safe LOL.

I've got a 160 psi. one somewhere, don't think it's been calibrated lately however....

I think you would only need to limit the pump speed until about 22 psi. on most buildups anyway. With what I have for electronics adding nozzles is easier for me to do.

But until I get heads and cam. and put the thing on the car who knows or cares the SMC systems work fine on my stock longblocks for now.

Good luck with your testing, and post those results too.

 

[salvageV6]

Using a 160 psi. gauge with the 1 ohm resistor I got pressures around 100-140 swinging with the pump surges.

The nozzle flow was reasonably nice and smooth however.

Tried the .5 ohm and pegged the gauge so off to find a larger one.

I am liking 1.25 ohms for a stock block car first stage now.

Gonna dig up a variable resistor around 1.5 ohms or so from the internet or junk pile.

Here's a link to a nice one cheeeeep.

http://www.mpja.com/viewallpict.asp...hing that should work well and is adjustable.

 

[salvageV6]

http://www.mpja.com/viewallpict.asp?dept=161&main=110

Second one down 3 ohms 100 watts adjustable.

Ran out of time to edit....

 

[salvageV6]

Ordered 5 of them for $25 out the door including shipping.

$15 minimum order.

We shall see if they show up.

Company is in FL.

 

[scottyb]

Salvage, please shed some light for the challenged.

I am using the SMC controller and single nozzle, but converted to a Shur-flo pump. The contoller doesn't turn down far enough to keep the pump from cycling due to it's pressure switch which I have adjusted all the way up. I don't want it to cycle. Will adding a resistor work for me? If so, can you give more details on how it should be wired and the type of resistor I need? Can I get it at radio shack?

TIA

 

[salvageV6]

I haven't tried the SMC controller on the Shurflo so I have no idea about how well that works with the cycling switch.

If you don't want it to cycle get rid of that cycling switch and wire the controller to the pump wire directly. Leave some wire on both sides in case you change your mind and want to hook it up back in line. Just cut the wire in a place that's easy to repair.

Nothing a soldering iron and some electrical tape can't fix up in 10 minutes.

The link above has a type of resistor that should work well and be adjustable also. Simply put it in series with the power or ground lead to the pump and adjust as needed, assuming the resistor is adjustable like the one in the link.

No there's nothing at Radio Shack that will work well. Well perhaps using (8-10) of their 10 watt 10 ohm power resistors they sell wired in parallel would work but that would be expensive and a pain to wire up. It would be easy to adjust by adding or subtracting resistors which would be about a 10-15 percent voltage change for each one, just cumbersome.

I'd try the SMC controller with the pump direct wired first and see how it works for you as far as spray pattern and the motor running etc. Good luck, I won't be trying the SMC controller and the Shurflo until next spring at the earliest myself.

Probably won't go with a controller on my setup as the pump voltage will only be limited for a second or so when spooling my car which is very fast spooling with the correct torque converter.

Nothing a resistor and relay can't do for that small of a time period where limited flow is needed.

 

[JLockhart]

Thought I’d mention a few things, some of which may be relevant. I am using a Snowperformance variable controller, and monitoring controller output voltage. I also have an LED in the dash so I can see when the pump is cycling. I have the Shurflow pressure switch maxed, and at just a little above 7 volts is where the pressure switch kicks in and starts to cycle the pump. So presumably 7 volts provides 130psi in my case. I am running an M15 jet, 80% methanol, and 28 psi boost.

I am still running 20% water as I still need it to suppress knock. I have found the water suppresses detonation a little better than the alky, although I have not tested that in a while. I could bypass the pressure switch and up the voltage a bit to get more spray, but I like having the safety of the pressure switch, and I believe a 2nd stage of alky with an M10 jet will be a better solution in my case.

I have a quick-spooling setup, and I still got a huge benefit by adding a variable controller. When rolling into boost in the upper gears, the on/off setup would bog the engine, ultimately limiting the amount of alky (and therefore boost) I could run.

 

[scottyb]

I bought the SMC kit used with dual nozzle, and replaced the failing in-tank pump with a shur-flo. I don't know the nozzle size. I have a street setup and even with the old pump, 2 nozzles was too much, so I installed a ball valve to turn off one of the nozzles. Now with 1 nozzle and the SMC set at it's lowest setting, I still feel that I'm drowning the motor. I don't have any knock even with boost north of 22 lbs. I basically have no adjustability because of this minimum setting.

I have found that the SMC controller varies pump speed by "pulsing" the ground, so I was thinking that a resistor on the positive side would help my situation. I want the pump to pulse only when I get the controller setting to mid-range. This way when I put in my 100 chip, I can open the ball valve and crank the controller to high without it pulsing.

Thoughts?

I just want to make sure I'm not introducing conflicting electrical components.

 

[salvageV6]

I would try a 1/2 ohm 50 watt minimum resistor in series with the pump power lead and then the SMC controller.

Obviously run some tests and visual inspections before a driving test.

My power resistors are due in Thursday, MPJA seems like a reputable company so far, providing tracking numbers and all.

Gonna play with them first before trying any SMC controller tests.

 

[Razor]

I think that if you get about 7 resistors and 7 pressure switches you can get a somewhat progressive control.

The more stages you add..the better it seems to work.

Go figure?

To vary the ramp then start twisting all the rheostats up kinda like a 7 band equalizer.

Sounds like fun






Resistors absorb power.. thats why PWM circuits exist.

 

[salvageV6]

Obviously your controller has more knobs, switches, bells and whistles than any rheostat or fixed power resistor.

Doubt you would ever need more than 3 stages which easy to do and a lot cheaper than a controller.

Works just as well too.

You don't vary any ramp, it's progressive in a digital way, told you that already, and works just as well in that whole 1.5 seconds you need to vary the alky. flow.

Resistors absorb power kinda like a Sponge right?

PWM limits power, gasp!

Nothing to add to DIY folks eh?

I'm sure you must have SOMETHING to sell them rather than alienating them.

 

[Razor]

Ohh I can feel the love

Ok..lets flip the burger, find me anywhere on the internet besides threads started by you that says using a resistor to limit pump voltage is better than using a PWM drive.

So your arguement is over what? 200 bucks for a controller thats been "figured out" Compared to other "gizmo's" out there available for our cars for the same amount.. it offers plenty of value.

Before I started doing this over a year ago look at the alky experience within the Buick world.

I dont have to list accomplishments to get the point across.. and whether you want to openly admit it... or not.. you cant argue the results that have been posted independantly.

Stay with your DIY setup. Thats OK. Its your 12 second sled. That cracks a high 11 once in a while with a 72 ball bearing turbo. Once you get your point to generate "RESULTS" then people will listen.. until then keep playing with fire.

You want cheap..

Cheap alky kit..two Trico pumps in series will give ya 45 PSI of pressure.. NOS nozzle..use a pressure switch..you can make a system with less than 50.00.

I love having fans

 

[salvageV6]

Not only are you a bad liar and salesman, you are a bad VDB moderator.



I am not asking for you or anyone using your limited thought process to listen to anything, it's you who always tags along on threads you don't comprehend too well with nothing important to add but the sales pitch.

Keep listening you may learn something.

 

[Razor]

Two points

One.. this topic we already discussed a year ago..

http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=96588&highlight=solenoid

Looks like way higher pressure were obtained than the tests you performed. Some how two others had experienced higher pressures bypassing the switch. Wonder if its that klotz your putting in the pump cuasing your pressure drop?

Two.. you called me a liar in this thread. Guess I educated you last year on PWM now show my lie.

Else do everyone a favor and just go away.

 

[salvageV6]

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