So close yet so far! CA Smog

[macatoni]

Trying to get the 87 WE4 smogged. All stock for the most part besides a down pipe, 42lb injectiors and LS1 MAF. Got an emissions chip in there today and got damn close but still little off. Got it real HOT for the test and these are the results:

The numbers got 100x closer when i through in the emissions chip but its still a bit off. I ordered a new O2 sensor and ill throw that in. Any ideas on other stuff to do? Play with the fuel pressure regulator (although i imagine the ECM will just try and adjust out whatever i set it to)

Any help appreciated.

Dave

 

[No disintegrations]

The egr valve helps lower no. Yours works ok? If not it may be the only thing throwing you off. Also how old is the cat? You barely failed. Sucks to miss it by a sliver.

 

[tlap]

Will it pass the visual with that MAF?
I live in CA also, it's a bear!

 

[Heskahoka]

...Also how old is the cat? You barely failed. Sucks to miss it by a sliver.

That would be my question also. The cat does most of the heavy lifting in cleaning most of those numbers.

 

[macatoni]

No idea on the age of the cat it was on the car when I bought it off the original owner. It's not the original it's an aftermarket high flow of some sort.

Somehow the maf slipped by I guess.

EGR is functional. I'll try the 02 sensor just wasn't sure if there was a fuel pressure tweak or something i could do to get it by

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[~JM~]

When was the last time that you changed the oil?

My car failed the sniffer test at first. New oil, plus fresh fuel & it passed.

 

[macatoni]

Oil about 1200 miles but that's a great idea I'll definitely do that as well

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[rodruckus]

I see you have a WE4, what model did the smog tech enter into the system? If he entered it as a Regal instead of a GN, that could easily be your problem right there. The allotted numbers are higher for a GN. All turbo Regals need to be entered as a GN, regardless of what it technically is. You really need to tell, then keep an eye on the tech to make sure they are choosing GN and the appropriate engine before they even begin testing.

 

[Heskahoka]

For your HC and CO readings:
-You are a bit rich, especially at higher speed.
-Change your O2 sensor.
-Make sure the emissions chip fuel pressure regulator is set to 38psi with the vacuum line off. Turbotweak emission chips are usually set 5psi less (down from 43psi). -You could even drop fuel pressure a bit more if need be.
-Also I would put a gallon or two of E85.

Your NOx is passing at idle and failing at higher speed.
-That is a sign that your EGR is not working as it should. Check the vacuum lines/system for your EGR.

 

[ravege]

Hi flow cats are 2-way (HC & CO), *legally* you have to have a 3-way cat (HC, CO, NOx). So getting the right converter might help (Magnaflow 93439). (My last smog run the guy didn't like that an EO number wasn't stamped on cat) That being said, my first run at smog was with a gutted cat (unbeknownst to me) and it passed NOx just fine. I ASSume you have the stock 233 regulator and your stock chip takes that into account.

This is my thread on smog results with gutted cat/new cat: http://turbobuick.com/threads/well-theres-your-problem.411999/ Check out those pass numbers - those are honest to God real Buick Turbo V6 smog numbers. Get your car running right and the sniffer part is a breeze - visual, not so much And not because of the stuff you might put on your car, but because techs are utter fscking idiots for anything that can't be passed simply by plugging in a ecm reader.

 

[ravege]

Oops, forgot to mention, you also have wrong car entered in system, your MAX should be higher. I'm guessing NA v6. You still would have failed though

 

[TType85]

A good working EGR and Cat along with an emissions chip should put a healthy car well in to passing. I passed last time with numbers similar (and somewhat better) to ravege using a working EGR, 500mi old stock cat, TT Emissions chip, lowering the FP to 38 and a good stock MAF. I also pass the visual using the stock airbox.

 

[gsgnnut]

Wow sure glad I don't live in ca. What a hassle. Here in mass 20 + yr old cars and trucks don't even have to open hood or get sniffed. Safety only. Have been failed for that pesky crack in the driver side manafold tho.

 

[gn87man]

Wow sure glad I don't live in ca. What a hassle. Here in mass 20 + yr old cars and trucks don't even have to open hood or get sniffed. Safety only. Have been failed for that pesky crack in the driver side manafold tho.

Yep, so glad I live in Texas. Safety only inspection here. Very easy pass. Any vehicle older than 20 years is safety only.

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[750H.P.V6]

Since you have high NOx and HC's I'd suspect the CAT isn't doing it's job. A 2 way CAT should clean up the emissions as long as they don't fail you on visual. BTW, you should check to see if the EGR is working since some folks like to block it. A non working EGR will cause high NOx also.

Neal

 

[jiho2]

The allotted numbers are higher for a GN.

No, they are not. Cutpoint numbers are based on range of years only. They have nothing to do with the make of vehicle, even, let alone specific model, let alone specific motor. Within a given range of years the cutpoints are the same, whether Buick Turbo, "VIN A", Olds 307, Ford police car, Toyota Corolla ....

EDIT: Alright, what I said here is correct for the 2-speed idle test that I'm subject to. For the "dyno" test that people in SoCal etc. have, it's considerably more complicated. For "dyno" they do indeed have elaborate tables that break down by make, year, model and engine displacement. There are even two different "dyno" types. What I can't find is anything to distinguish a GN or a turbo from any other Regal 3.8L for a given year, though. Forgive me if this has been explained already, but where does this come from and where is the info on this?

I've been lost in this BS for so long I've turned into a pathetic stickler for facts and detail.

Sorry.

 

[ravege]

The tech will enter a VIN in their computer and 3 options come up, Regal, Grand National, and something else, possibly for the v8. This is the point where you would want the tech to enter "Grand National", even though you're car may not be a Grand National. The labeling should have been something more akin to NA v6, turbo v6 and v8, but that's bureacracy for you.

 

[jiho2]

But the VIN specifies the motor already. There can't be any selection for the motor once the VIN is entered, unless you've had an engine change and then it comes from the referee sticker. And if you bring your registration renewal notice, the notice has a bar code on it, and the VIN and motor come up automatically after scanning the bar code.

Anyway, the BAR web site publishes the tables, which have different numbers for Regals with 3.8L and 5.0L for different years. Where are different numbers for turbos?

[ EDIT: Be sure to see the next post .... ]

 

[jiho2]

The tables, BTW, are at www.bar.ca.gov. Do a site search on "cutpoints" (without quotes), take the top hit, select make, select year.

I have to say, though, I just went back and looked more closely at more years. Was there an '84 Regal 3.8L with a manual transmission?

Oops. I think this is all starting to come back to me now, like I've seen this discussion before ....

 

[ravege]

You're implying intelligence and competence where none may exist - no, the tech should not have to specify car type when the VIN is scanned in, yet that's exactly how it works. Look at the smog report in the first post of this thread, then look at the smog report I linked to in my thread - the max's and ave's are different.