stock rebuild too weak for upgraded combo?

[OneLethal87GN]

After finally getting my car back a week ago I finally tested it out this morning. Hoses blowing off with anything over 9 psi has alot to do with how long I waited. After going WOT the tranny downshifted to second but didn't seem to be able to hold the gear. It slipped very badly and caused my scanmaster to show like 36 degrees of retard. I let out quickly. I tested it again a mile up the road but waited until I was high enough in gear that it would stay in that gear and not downshift. It held fine until about 10-12 psi when the i/c pipe blew off the car. I had tested it yesterday just part throttle with about 10 psi and it seemed to be slipping. I told the guys at AAMCO a stock rebuild wouldn't hold up. After replacing my valve body with a regular 200-4r one and using stock rebuild parts they thought it would be fine. I do have a racing type second gear band and hardened sprag in it. They also took out the shift kit because they couldn't figure out how to get it back in right. It shifts at the right rpms but the shift feel is very weak. It shifts softer than my 2000 Z24. My car has a TE-63-1, ported heads w/ bigger valves, front mount, cam, etc. Do you guys think a stock rebuild will hold up behind my combo? They told me if the tranny was built right it would hold up. I'm finding out that either they are misinformed or the tranny isn't built right.

 

[77 cruiser]

I'm finding out that either they are misinformed or the tranny isn't built right.

Sounds like both, I think you are going to make many trips back there.

Jim

 

[OneLethal87GN]

I already have. I've had to make several trips there just to get my point across about how much power the engine is making and that the tranny needs special attention to make it stand up. I also had to go up there to fix a problem. They blew the intercooler pipe off while "testing" the car. They thought they blew the engine. I told them if they built it back stock without the shift kit then it will not hold up. It seems to hold decently while in gear but if it has to shift gears then it just can't hold the next gear. It's been over 3 weeks and $2,000 and if it doesn't come back right this time then it's time to take it somewhere else and see about getting my money back. You can only have somebody do something so many times before you give up on them.

 

[jakeshoe]

I would say you were adequately warned ahead of time on this deal...

I hope you got your GN valve body back at least...

For $2K you could have had about any of the good builders here build you a decent unit.


I have a fresh BRF I would sell for $2K...

 

[OneLethal87GN]

Originally posted by jakeshoe
I would say you were adequately warned ahead of time on this deal...

Well, this is how it works at AAMCO. You get your car towed there. They tell you they will inspect it for free. If you decide not to have them do the work you are charged for the tow and about $500 for the "free inspection". By then your car is in a thousand pieces and you could be out $550 with no good coming from it so you end up having them do the work. They were told many times what kind of rebuild it needed. I do have a 3 year warranty and will use it to its full extent. I also told them to reuse the shift kit which I had to argue with them to put it back in and still warranty it. I will take it back early next week so I can have it back in time for my vacation. I didn't know it would end up being $2,000. If I had I would have sent my tranny to one of the vendors and have a race built tranny in my car as we speak. The car shifts fine just cruising around. It seems when you get on it and it has to shift a gear is when you have the problem. I tried to explain about shift kits and upping the pressures but it seemed to be Greek to them. The manual he used to go by to rebuild my tranny was dated 1978.

 

[jakeshoe]

Tell you what I can do...


I will contact a AAMCO regional guru I know ( he knows his trannys and is in charge of a fairly large region of the NE) and see what I can have him do for you.

Maybe he can get them to use some better parts.

 

[OneLethal87GN]

They told me they would use any upgrades that have became available since these trannies were produced. I told them the 86-87 trannies had bigger servos and to use one of them. Instead they just plugged a hole in my stock 85 servo. I also stressed the importance of using the stock BQ valve body and governor. They put some generic valve body in and I'm still unsure of the governor. I know at one time it had two springs on it and I told them a GN governor has only one spring. He said he took the other spring off. My money's tight right now after shelling out 2 grand for this rebuild. It's hard to even set aside money for some more denatured alcohol. They ran all of mine out of the tank "testing" my car. I had over half a bottle when it went in and now it's an inch from the bottom of the tank. I need more alky so they don't blow my engine doing more "testing". I can't turn the boost down because I need full power to make sure the tranny can hold up to it. They blew the pipes off my i/c while "testing" and now since they've blown off they keep blowing off. I'll need new hoses or some way to keep these on. Tightening the clamps isn't working. I plan on taking it back on Monday to get them to see why it's slipping after just one WOT blast by me. A blast that only lasted 2-3 seconds before I let out. It's the shop located just up the road from me. The address is: 4050 South Memorial Dr. Winterville, NC 28590. The phone number is (252)756-2111. The manager's name is Walt and the tranny builder is named Mark. The owner's name is Jack but he knows as much about cars as I know about turbine jet engines. I had to explain to him what a turbo is and what is does. He was asking because I told him I had my wastegate unhooked so people wouldn't be abusing my car. They had hooked it back up and it made me upset and he couldn't understand why. If you can get anything out of them please let me know. I've given them several tips to build a better tranny but all I get back is the ole stinkeye.

 

[chris718]

just my 2 cents

 

[OneLethal87GN]

Thanks man. I don't know who you got to call but it finally made the tranny builder realize these aren't your every day 200-4Rs. He wasn't happy at all that the guy called him but he learned a little something from it. He said he'd talk it over with the owner of the AAMCO I took it to and see what he wants to do. He said the owner probably wouldn't be too happy over what happened though. I'm not worried though because if they had listened to me from the start I'd have a tranny with the right parts and one that would hold up behind a little power. He said he is going to fix my valve body and put it back in. I told him to put the shift kit back in as well. I don't think they like me much down there but everything I have been telling them is true and that call made them realize I wasn't some know-it-all that don't know anything. I was also wondering if a GN tranny rebuild kit is different from a normal 200-4R rebuild kit. Are there different friction materials or anything that would be needed over a normal 200-4R tranny? It seems I have regular 200-4R tranny parts in my BQ case. Thanks again man. BTW, who was it that called?

 

[jakeshoe]

I had a friend of mine call that is a regional supervisor for AAMCO.
I'll leave him nameless. He's a super guy, has bailed me out a time or two and is super sharp on the trannies..

A TransGO kit will work well...
And it may be a better solution for you since AAMCO is building it.
MY guy will recommend the TG kit, as I would and it is VERY similar to the PTS anyway but has better isntructions, includes the larger boost valves, etc..

Stock friction elements are OK in most cases, reds are better in the directs if they'll do them, and not a bad idea in the 4th pack.

Without a doubt use the Alto red band, best thing going right now and I believe ever builder on thsi forum would agree.

Good luck.

 

[OneLethal87GN]

Thanks again man. I don't really have the money to buy another shift kit so he has concentrated on the PTS kit and thinks he knows how it goes now. I have one more question though. The tranny builder took my valve body home after talking with your friend. He said he took it completely apart but couldn't find anything wrong with it. The reason he took it out to start with is because the tranny had what he called a "stacked shift". It would shift to second fine but then shift immediately to third. It would stay in second for maybe half a second before shifting to third. He said he took out the shift kit and the valve body, then put the other valve body in and it shifted fine. He said he didn't see any broken springs in my valve body. Maybe he had the check balls wrong or something? If you could run this by your guy and see if he can come up with anything that would be great! My guy has no clue what the problem could be and is hesitant to put the valve body back in for fear the stacked shift will still be there. He said he could order me another GN valve body but I told him I didn't have that kind of money to replace the valve body after already spending twice as much as the original estimate. Thanks again and thank your friend for me. He was a great help in getting the correct info through to those guys. I tried my best but couldn't get through.

 

[jakeshoe]

I would have him re-install the GN valve body.
If it has a stacked shift from 2-3 still, and all oter shifts are correct, he will need to put a stiffer spring in the 2-3 shift valvetrain.

 

[OneLethal87GN]

Where can I find a diagram of a 200-4R valve body? I have one lying on the floor behind me and wanted to see what parts are what and where they're located. Thanks again for all your help man.

 

[jakeshoe]

An ATSg Tech manual would be your friend... I'll try to dig something up online...

 

[OneLethal87GN]

Thanks, but if I had thought before typing I would have found it. I did a search on here and found an old post with a link to a valve body diagram on gnttype.org. Thanks again for your help. I'm taking my car back tomorrow and will suggest to him to use a stronger spring in the 2-3 shift valve. Will a spring out of another valve body be alright in my valve body? Since I have a spare here I could just take him a spring. He probably has some lying around and may just use one out of a random valve body anyways. Maybe the extreme pressure of the engine being revved to the sky because of the shifter cable breaking may have damaged the spring in some way? I'll know tomorrow I guess. Thanks again.