Tuning Question

[54Rich]

I recently went through the motor and trans, just a bit of freshening. Here is what I have:

Stock block, Comp 980 Springs, DBl roller timing chain, new valve guides. Matched the heads to the gaskets (Very mild porting). Motor runs really well, thought vacuum was low, but my gauge is off. Idles at 15 mmHg. 170 degrees, 16 PSI oil pressure (Idle) when warmed up.

Stock Turbo, RJC Power Plate, Adjustable FP Regulator (Set to 42 PSI, vacuum off), 42 Lb injectors. RJC Boost controller, adjustable WG. SMC Progressive kit with 50/50 Alcohol/water mix. TT chip. 4” big mouth air intake, LS1 with a translator, ditched the EGR and the stock WG controller. New wires, gas filter, O2 sensor, plugs, etc. All the gaskets I put in the motor were GM gaskets. TPS and IAC set, BML’s 123, all looks very good, motor sounds great! No Leaks!

BFR Trans with a 2800 stall convertor and CK shift kit.

I’m having a few issues and don’t want to blow the thing up. Here’s the list:
Trans is not shifting correctly, seems to stick in first only when going really slow and then slams into 2nd. This only happens when slow speed. Get on it a little bit and it’s better, 1st to 2nd is a bit harsh. I’ve adjusted the TV cable and does not seem to help.

Also, the convertor will not lock up and I’ve confirmed that it is a lock up (Used convertor)? I have to say that both chips that I have (ALKY and 93 street chip) are burnt for a standard D5 lockup convertor (Does this matter?) Anyhow, I’ll be talking to Chris (CK) in the AM about the trans issues.

Getting back to the car. I put the Alky chip in first and notice that the boost comes on very fast, so fast that I can’t really get into the record mode of the Scan Master. I get knock with anything over 15 lbs, so I have been quick to get out of it. Don’t know what’s with waste gate, but can’t get it adjusted to under 15 lbs of boost? I’ll be pulling it and testing it with a compressor to make sure it works. (I bought it used, so who knows)

Not being able to control the knock, I put the 93 street chip in, thinking that it should be easy to get the car back to where it was last fall which was 16 lbs boost on 93 with Zero knock. Now with the Alky, I can’t stop the knock? I’ve verified that the SMC pump works. I did have one recorded knock and that was 1.2, my 02’s were 814? Could I be drowning this with the alky? This is one variable that I don’t fully understand.

So that’s where it sits, any help would be appreciated.

As always Thanks!

 

[scot w.]

I recently went through the motor and trans, just a bit of freshening. Here is what I have:

Stock block, Comp 980 Springs, DBl roller timing chain, new valve guides. Matched the heads to the gaskets (Very mild porting). Motor runs really well, thought vacuum was low, but my gauge is off. Idles at 15 mmHg. 170 degrees, 16 PSI oil pressure (Idle) when warmed up.

Stock Turbo, RJC Power Plate, Adjustable FP Regulator (Set to 42 PSI, vacuum off), 42 Lb injectors. RJC Boost controller, adjustable WG. SMC Progressive kit with 50/50 Alcohol/water mix. TT chip. 4” big mouth air intake, LS1 with a translator, ditched the EGR and the stock WG controller. New wires, gas filter, O2 sensor, plugs, etc. All the gaskets I put in the motor were GM gaskets. TPS and IAC set, BML’s 123, all looks very good, motor sounds great! No Leaks!

BFR Trans with a 2800 stall convertor and CK shift kit.

I’m having a few issues and don’t want to blow the thing up. Here’s the list:
Trans is not shifting correctly, seems to stick in first only when going really slow and then slams into 2nd. This only happens when slow speed. Get on it a little bit and it’s better, 1st to 2nd is a bit harsh. I’ve adjusted the TV cable and does not seem to help.

Also, the convertor will not lock up and I’ve confirmed that it is a lock up (Used convertor)? I have to say that both chips that I have (ALKY and 93 street chip) are burnt for a standard D5 lockup convertor (Does this matter?) Anyhow, I’ll be talking to Chris (CK) in the AM about the trans issues.

Getting back to the car. I put the Alky chip in first and notice that the boost comes on very fast, so fast that I can’t really get into the record mode of the Scan Master. I get knock with anything over 15 lbs, so I have been quick to get out of it. Don’t know what’s with waste gate, but can’t get it adjusted to under 15 lbs of boost? I’ll be pulling it and testing it with a compressor to make sure it works. (I bought it used, so who knows)

Not being able to control the knock, I put the 93 street chip in, thinking that it should be easy to get the car back to where it was last fall which was 16 lbs boost on 93 with Zero knock. Now with the Alky, I can’t stop the knock? I’ve verified that the SMC pump works. I did have one recorded knock and that was 1.2, my 02’s were 814? Could I be drowning this with the alky? This is one variable that I don’t fully understand.

So that’s where it sits, any help would be appreciated.

As always Thanks!

Hi, Rich,

Not really sure why your running 50/50 Water/Alky Mix but I would bet this may be a good part of your knock. These cars were well proven to like 100%
Alky- The chips were more than likely made with 100% Alky in mind with the timing added..

Your 1.2* Knock isn't bad at all..(But reguardless you don't want any). 814 o2's is fine.. Might want to eliminate false knock by rolling into WOT starting around 40mph- If it don't knock it's more likely false during the shifts.


SW.

 

[54Rich]

Hi, Rich,

Not really sure why your running 50/50 Water/Alky Mix but I would bet this may be a good part of your knock. These cars were well proven to like 100%
Alky- The chips were more than likely made with 100% Alky in mind with the timing added..

Your 1.2* Knock isn't bad at all..(But reguardless you don't want any). 814 o2's is fine.. Might want to eliminate false knock by rolling into WOT starting around 40mph- If it don't knock it's more likely false during the shifts.


SW.

Hey Scot! The 50/50 mix is off the SMC website and the fact that I didn't have any Meth, so I thought it would work There is one place to get it and it's a ways from the house. I guess I'll have to get down there and get some. All this time and effort, just don't want to screw it up.

 

[scot w.]

Hey Scot! The 50/50 mix is off the SMC website and the fact that I didn't have any Meth, so I thought it would work There is one place to get it and it's a ways from the house. I guess I'll have to get down there and get some. All this time and effort, just don't want to screw it up.

Getting some 100% ALKY is the first thing I would do and see if that fixed it (I will bet it does). rich the mix crap is just That! It's for people with very close to stock cars that are not looking for much out of it. Think of it this way- IF it's truly mixed 50/50 (Which you Truly don't know because you bought it already premixed) then your only getting HALF of Alky's benefit along with only Half the power benefits..

Using 100% Alky your getting 100% of the benefits and now you have more room to increase boost. Plus I would think the 100% Alky would even Cool just that much more..

After adding the Pure ALKY then I would contact SMC to see where your settings should be.


PS: Pick yourself up 4-5 gal of Alky (ask the purity). That should last you all summer in most cases.

SW.

 

[Audie1]

Just my 2 cents here........I just went through this with my SMC Alky kit. Denatured Alky is way too expensive compathered to Methenol...$15.00 a gal to $4.00 a gallon for Meth. Meth also runs cooler giving you even more power potential. Just about any place that runs Go-Karts, runs them on Methenol. Find out where they get there supply from. But like Scott said, run which ever you choose at 100% for sure.

 

[scot w.]

Just my 2 cents here........I just went through this with my SMC Alky kit. Denatured Alky is way too expensive compathered to Methenol...$15.00 a gal to $4.00 a gallon for Meth. Meth also runs cooler giving you even more power potential. Just about any place that runs Go-Karts, runs them on Methenol. Find out where they get there supply from. But like Scott said, run which ever you choose at 100% for sure.

Thanks Audie, I ment 100% Methanol. I get mine at the local Round Track supply and it's $3.00 and something a gallon..


SW.

 

[54Rich]

Scot,

Got the ALKY, put the ALkY chip back in and ran it, knocked I found that the intake plenum was not sealed correctly, I'll bet it was leaking under boost Anyhow, pull it and I was drowing it with ALKY, very wet. So cleaned things up and sealed it and took it for a ride.

I turned the start to inject up to 16 and max pump at 20, I must have bought an adjustable HD WG, cause it takes a lot to get it to stop boosting? I also bypased the RJC controller and went back to the stock controller.

The POS tranny or the shift kit I put in it is not helping, seems to show knock at the end of first. Shifts so damn hard, upshift and down. I followed the directions, put it into a perfectly shifting trans

So with the trans not being right, rolled into it in 2nd and was able to get the scanmaster to record 792 with .2 knock at 52 MPH. I think around 20 psi (It all happens so fast )

So got to get the tranny fixed, know anyone that can walk me through troubleshooting?

It's better, but need a track to really get it tuned in.

 

[jasjamz]

May need to lower the turn on point. Alky chips have less fuel in them than stree or race chips. You may be lean before the turn-on point. That could be giving you knock.

 

[Audie1]

May need to lower the turn on point. Alky chips have less fuel in them than stree or race chips. You may be lean before the turn-on point. That could be giving you knock.

I agree 100% with jasjamz about the chip and turn on point................Meth/Alky turn on was set by SMC at around 10# W/full on @ 20 with a single nozzel kit. That is right where it should be until you are really familiar with it. Just make sure everything else is in good running order before hammering it too much................Below is a link to some Basic Trans info.................Walking you through Tranny Trouble Shooting is a tall order. I would suggest you find a "Known Good" Trans Repair Shop and get with them about your transmission..................Good luck with however you handle it.


Transmission

 

[Audie1]

Thanks Audie, I ment 100% Methanol. I get mine at the local Round Track supply and it's $3.00 and something a gallon..


SW.

NP Scott................that's a good price for the Methanol, sure beats my $15.00 a gal, Ace Hardware Denatured Alky........Lucky I found out where they sold Methanol at a reasonable price. I bought 5 Gallons, which should last a long time.

 

[54Rich]

I agree 100% with jasjamz about the chip and turn on point................Meth/Alky turn on was set by SMC at around 10# W/full on @ 20 with a single nozzel kit. That is right where it should be until you are really familiar with it. Just make sure everything else is in good running order before hammering it too much................Below is a link to some Basic Trans info.................Walking you through Tranny Trouble Shooting is a tall order. I would suggest you find a "Known Good" Trans Repair Shop and get with them about your transmission..................Good luck with however you handle it.


Transmission

Thanks, I was drowning it before, looks like the turn on point should be moved a bit, I'll try that.

The transmission was perfect until the shift kit was put into it. One solution would be to return it to stock, then return the kit and buy one from a vendor that will support it. Sorry, can you tell I'm a bit pissed

 

[54Rich]

Thanks, I was drowning it before, looks like the turn on point should be moved a bit, I'll try that.

The transmission was perfect until the shift kit was put into it. One solution would be to return it to stock, then return the kit and buy one from a vendor that will support it. Sorry, can you tell I'm a bit pissed

OK, got to retract my last statment, talked to the vendor (He's busy, I'm busy and impatient!) and he was very helpful. Something was stuck somewhere, he had me drive the car slowly with the TV cable off, didn't really see a difference, then all of the sudden it worked:biggrin: First is still a little harsh, maybe a click out on the TV, but way better.

Still feel like I'm drowning it with ALKY. Can you have knock from not enough boost? Chip is a ALKY chip 23-25 psi with 23-24 degrees and I'm running maybe 18 psi right now. A touch on knock .2, but I can't tell if it's false or not

Should I go back to the non ALKY chip (15-17 PSI)and tune for that, get it perfect and then jump up to the ALKY chip or just stay with this chip? It will be hard because I'm convinced that I bought a HD Adj WG (Got it used). I know I'm not even close to a perfect tune, but I really do not want to hurt it either.

Learning as I go. Anyone up here in the Twin Cities that can tune a car or can prove first that they can tune a car

 

[scot w.]

I'm running maybe 18 psi right now. A touch on knock .2

Should I go back to the non ALKY chip (15-17 PSI)and tune for that, get it perfect and then jump up to the ALKY chip or just stay with this chip? It will be hard because I'm convinced that I bought a HD Adj WG (Got it used). I know I'm not even close to a perfect tune, but I really do not want to hurt it either.

Learning as I go. Anyone up here in the Twin Cities that can tune a car or can prove first that they can tune a car

Rich, Yes you should have your car tuned perfectly without any issues Before adding any Alky system! BUT that's your call. You will need to go back to the stock W/G Actuator because the one you have on there will be too much with just 93 octane. You really have gained ground already by dropping the knock from 1.2 down to 0.2 ... Now we just need to figure out for SURE if it's false or true knock. Now to figure out if it's False or True Knock, One would move your rolling start to maybe 50-60 mph and SLOWLY roll into WOT and hold it there for at least 3-4 seconds. What were looking for here is if you have any knock to see if it goes away or if it climbs. If it starts to climb at all LIFT out of it because that shows us it's not false! Alot of knock accurs at the Hit - between the converter flaring and the turbo kicking in things flex and may hit something under the car. False knock Will go away- True knock won't..

Also it would be wise to contact Steve at SMC to see if your system is working properly. You did buy it used right? That flooding just may be the reason it was sold.

Can you have knock from not enough boost? Well if your Flooding it at low boost then it's rich knock from the flooding and not from Not enough boost!

Rich you won't kill or hurt the engine at just 0.2 of knock if it was 2.0 you won't want that. take your time and I will try to walk you through this the best I can.

 

[54Rich]

Rich, Yes you should have your car tuned perfectly without any issues Before adding any Alky system! BUT that's your call. You will need to go back to the stock W/G Actuator because the one you have on there will be too much with just 93 octane. You really have gained ground already by dropping the knock from 1.2 down to 0.2 ... Now we just need to figure out for SURE if it's false or true knock. Now to figure out if it's False or True Knock, One would move your rolling start to maybe 50-60 mph and SLOWLY roll into WOT and hold it there for at least 3-4 seconds. What were looking for here is if you have any knock to see if it goes away or if it climbs. If it starts to climb at all LIFT out of it because that shows us it's not false! Alot of knock accurs at the Hit - between the converter flaring and the turbo kicking in things flex and may hit something under the car. False knock Will go away- True knock won't..

Also it would be wise to contact Steve at SMC to see if your system is working properly. You did buy it used right? That flooding just may be the reason it was sold.

Can you have knock from not enough boost? Well if your Flooding it at low boost then it's rich knock from the flooding and not from Not enough boost!

Rich you won't kill or hurt the engine at just 0.2 of knock if it was 2.0 you won't want that. take your time and I will try to walk you through this the best I can.

Thanks! I'll keep you posted.

 

[54Rich]

3rd gear

757 with 0.0:biggrin: at 57 mph

I'd say 16 lbs of boost. So now I start turning up the boost, I should have a ways to go, but will take it in little steps.

 

[scot w.]

3rd gear

757 with 0.0:biggrin: at 57 mph

I'd say 16 lbs of boost. So now I start turning up the boost, I should have a ways to go, but will take it in little steps.

Alky chip still OR the other one?

At any rate, Glad to see this..

Now just take baby steps on turning up the boost and when you start to see knock then turn the Alky up just a tad and keep doing that untill your at the desired boost you want. In the mean time I would find out wats hitting under the car to stop that false knock.

Have fun!

SW.

 

[54Rich]

Scot,

22 PSI, no knock, it's really running good. I'm sure there's more in it, but until I get it to the track this will work just fine.

Never had a car that hits 2nd and the tires break loose All that and 45 degrees out the center vent of the AC

However, it was short lived, blew the tranny line to the cooler on the way home. What a mess. What are you using for the tranny cooler lines? I think it needs to be hard lines? Rubber sure didn't last long.

 

[scot w.]

Scot,

22 PSI, no knock, it's really running good. I'm sure there's more in it, but until I get it to the track this will work just fine.

Never had a car that hits 2nd and the tires break loose All that and 45 degrees out the center vent of the AC

However, it was short lived, blew the tranny line to the cooler on the way home. What a mess. What are you using for the tranny cooler lines? I think it needs to be hard lines? Rubber sure didn't last long.

Sounds good Rich, Glad to hear it's running like it should! :biggrin:

My trans lines are Braided Stainless Steel lines and go to a monster trans cooler with a fan..

SW.