Update on adding a 2 stage to SMC, and more

[salvageV6]

I plan on using the 2 nozzle kit from SMC in stages. Turn it on lower to eliminate transitional knock and then kick on the big nozzle at a higher boost prolly around 15-16 psi.

Hope it works...

 

[Turbo__Tim]

SalvagrV6, Dyno stories just get ya in trouble!

What I need to is get the bung welded in for the 0-2 sensor and start using the wide band for tuning as well.

 

[salvageV6]

Trouble? Ya I guess so. They were good stories however.

I have done a Pilate and washed my hands of it all. Cleansed the soul too.

I prefer to keep a happy disposition and am a terrible teacher.

A good wideband O2 would be a great addition for me too. I don't use the O2 with the Maxeffort chip but still read the numbers on the Scanmaster even though Steve Y. tells me to ignore them.

Oh well back to tuning or some other reasonable fascimile...

 

[DMan]

Aquamist

Glad to see more and more Aquamist users out there! Their nozzles are outstanding. Atomization is key, as Turbo_Tim says.

I had to endure some criticism about Aquamist's 'plastic lines' a couple of years ago on this very msg board. From my experience, the lines are very durable, but to play it safe, I recommend you swap these lines out for new ones at the beginning of each season. Cheap insurance. I have gone 2 years with the same set of lines with *no problems* whatsoever.

On solenoids, Brad sells some beautiful small solenoids, cheap (like $50), complete with the Aquamist push-in line connectors on each end. Perfect for putting in a second stage.

Best of luck.

 

[Turbo__Tim]

SalvageV6 I could send you MY WB and let you try it out. I don't have the time to mess around with it right now. If you want to use it for a month that would be ok. The board needs an enclosure, but everything else is there. You will need your own bung for the wb 0-2 sensor of course.

Shoot me an E-Mail if you are interested...

DMan, the Aquamist set up is not bad at all. The barbed ends hold the lines so well I had to cut them off. Changing them once a year would be a good idea. With the push on connectors, it would amount to a 15 minute job, if that!

Well an update on my alchy injection....

I got my high boost solenoid located and put it in tonight. 95* and humid outside. Running (2) 1 mm nozzles (activating first at 5, and second at 15 psi) I could run 21# boost. What was happening was the boost guage would surge on it's way to 25#, but the knock sensor kicked in at 23 psi, and and dropped it back to 19 psi or so.

At that point I got popping through the exhaust. This never happened to me before, but then again I was running lots more alchy, and 100% denatured before. (right now I am injecting at the rate of 2.3 ounces per 12 seconds, before I was running 5-6 ounces per 12 seconds.

BTW after setting the boost controller so it would only go to 21 psi, the popping went away, no knock. Just accelerated cleanly to 21 psi, with the car pulling hard.

Tomorrow I will add a third 1 mm nozzle to the second stage and see what happens. I'll take the mixture to a 70-30 mix after that. (running 50-50 denatured now). Then I'll go to a 100% denatured and see what happens. I'll be cranking the timing up with all three scenarios as well.

After tomorrow's testing, it will be time to wait for the propane injection to get here sometime next week.

Should be interesting..

 

[salvageV6]

I'd keep tuning throughout the wide variety of weather we will be having soon. Tuning is fun.


Anyway does the wideband fit in a regular O2 bung or something different.

I don't need the stock sensor in my car with the maxeffort chip.

I could just swap them out.

If they have these for sale send me the info. and link for a complete one.

I prolly could get yours in a box too. We have them and a good toolmaker at work with little to do right now.

Thanks!

 

[Turbo__Tim]

Here is the link for the kit. I'm not sure they are selling completed kits yet.

http://www.techedge.com.au/vehicle/wbo2/wbo2.htm

Well crap! I lost the tap for putting the nozzles in. Grrrr. (painters working next door. I left it on my porch stoop, and it grew legs!)

Oh well gone is gone, so I'll need to order another.

I went to a 70-30 mix, and got a bit more knock (5) than with the 50-50 mix. Also I picked the knock up sooner than with the 50-50 mix, and had to get out of it. Of course I'm not injecting enough alchy mix right now, so we will see what the story is after another nozzle is installed.

Outside temps are 90*, 57% humidity, about the same as testing yesterday. Coolant temps got to 178*. My car runs very cool with the front mount, and new radiator...

Egt's were 1450 at 85 mph. That's all the faster I will go around here...

SalvageV6, you have mail...

 

[WFO]

Originally posted by Turbo__Tim

I went to a 70-30 mix, and got a bit more knock (5) than with the 50-50 mix. Also I picked the knock up sooner than with the 50-50 mix, and had to get out of it. Of course I'm not injecting enough alchy mix right now, so we will see what the story is after another nozzle is installed.

fwiw,i've been having similar results.i started with 100% denatured(cuz that's what everyone said to do)and had to really pour it on to keep the knock down.then it would be too rich in 3rd gear .

so i switched to 50/50 and it only needs about half as much to keep the knock down(save for 1-2 degrees transitional)plus it's a lot leaner up top with no knock.

anybody ever hurt anything from transitional knock?it's only right at the bottom of first gear(when the load is low?)and as long as there's no kr when winding out 3rd you'd think it'd be o.k.?


later,sean

 

[Turbo__Tim]

anybody ever hurt anything from transitional knock?it's only right at the bottom of first gear(when the load is low?)and as long as there's no kr when winding out 3rd you'd think it'd be o.k.?

I agree that it's third gear where tha problems occur WFO, where, as you say the load is much higher.

One can blow a hg in 1st, but first he would have to accidentially set his brand new translator+ to full toiming advance on pump gas, after doing 3 back to back runs, and since the extender chip ignores knock for the first three seconds, well, this makes all things possible.

You don't have to know how I happen to know this ...

That is good information WFO, what pump, and nozzles are you using? Full pump speed? What psi can you reach?

Inquiring minds want to know...

 

[salvageV6]

Mine is always between 20 and 45 mph. Usually 35-40 mph.

Goes up to 3.5 or so max. I assume it's enough to get the ECM to retard timing which isn't good. As to damage? I doubt it. My audible knock detector never goes off.

At the track real KR was hitting on 2 of 11 runs at 95mph. Not much there luckily.

Gotta hook up Direct Scan soon to see what transitional KR does to the tune.

 

[WFO]

Originally posted by Turbo__Tim

That is good information WFO, what pump, and nozzles are you using? Full pump speed? What psi can you reach?

Inquiring minds want to know...

it's a bone stock smc kit on my intercooled hotair.with 100% i was at ~8-9 pump speed,with 50/50 it's on ~5.5.

at this point i'm running on the leanest race setting on my 16 pos maxeffort (24*) and i'm creeping up in boost,at about 23-24 psi now.

i have a feeling that the strange(no plenum,long runner)construction of the stock hotair intake makes things a little different than the 87.

i need to get my egt gauge hooked up,right now i'm tuning with the knock gauge only.


later,sean

 

[Turbo__Tim]

Youn are doing well Sean. 23-24 psi is excellent!

Yes it's beter to get the egt guage hooked up. Once you know at what temperature you start getting knock, you ccan back off then, without getting dangerous knock.

Maybe Steve has two smaller nozzles that you can try?

Othere than that I would say you are doing fine, assuming you can click off an entire quarter at that psi level, hell, I would quit there!

I'd kinda like to see you get that pump speed up though. There might be room for improvement in track times there...