Which (non o-ring) headgaskets and why?

Which non o-ring type headgasket do you use?


  • Total voters
    80
1026

I used the 1026 FELPROs with no problem on my GN1 headed 109 block. I have ARP studs also. it has seen 30 psi of boost a few times and no problems. I guess the copper was supposed to NOT brinnel the aluminum like a steel fire ring would. I am going to use them this time around also. jeremy
 
tricks

TRICKS,,, in the early days,i worked in a buick pontiac dealer,, on many models we never removed an intake manifold to change a head gasket or even both gaskets,,we were payed on a flat rate system
Those nasty little, slopey tricks made me quit the dealer years ago. The warranty "slip and slide" we called it. Now I charge a fair price and do a textbook job. Come on, 3 hours to do a neon head gasket. Anyways, I talked to Tom at Champion, and he says he sells cometics 25 to 1 over any other type. I guess thats the route I'm taking. That's the stage my build is at, so thanks for doing the survey Blazer406!!!
 
cometics

No Problem....

I am still having a hard time turning loose of that much $$. I really would like to put that $$ toward a roller cam.:biggrin:
When I talked to Tom at Champion, I think he said he's getting $69 per side. I guess your supposed to use a sealer with them. If I don't hear of anything else, I'm going to use the mopar stuff that they came up with for their mls gaskets. We started using mls gaskets with that sealer for the neons and stratus's in the late 90's with really cured the chronic leak issues. Let me know if you hear of anything else that works. thanks, Dave
 
Of all you Cometic users....... How many have leaking problems? What kind of surface prep did you have? Did you have the recommended surface finish on both heads and block? Were you able to get the leaking stopped?



Of all you 9441PT users.....How many have blown them? Of these users.... how many were running head studs? and what torque did you use? what heads? what boost levels have you run?




I read where everyone hails the original stockers.... but say once you crack that original seal... they never seal up as good again...... why is that? Is it because people are pushing their cars past where they were with the stockers? i.e. the fuse Razor talks about is much shorter........???


So far.... great information from everyone.... keep it coming....
 
If you use RJC's, .030, is there a problem with intake port misalignment, push rods now too long? Are people stacking these together to get .060? Not that checking valvetrain geometry shouldn't be done anyway, but if you stick with the stock .060" thickness you won't have any issues there if you didn't before the gasket swap.
Mike
86 GN
 
I read where everyone hails the original stockers.... but say once you crack that original seal... they never seal up as good again...... why is that? Is it because people are pushing their cars past where they were with the stockers? i.e. the fuse Razor talks about is much shorter........???

The factory uses a machine that torques all 8 bolts to spec in one shot. This process no one can reproduce unless they have $$$$$$$$

Billy T.
gnxtc2@aol.com
 
You can use any head gasket mentioned, but remember, no matter what you do all of them will blow or leak if you have detonation, no matter what. Most of the problems i have seen in fast turbo Buicks are fastener related, most guys who complain of cometics leaking are probably lifting the head off the block slightly and causing the gasket to leak from this. If you lift the head with a 9441 fel pro it will push all the graphite filling into your engine if it blows in that direction. You won't see this problem often with a 14 bolt arrangement.

Just remember we only have 8 head bolts per bank and if you are making big power you will encounter "head lifting"(this is common with Ford's too). With a V6 if you want to make big power you will tax the engine and all of it's components harder, this causes the power per cylinder to rise. V6's can't spread the load like a V8 can.

Example: Turbo Buick with 600 fwhp = 100 hp per cylinder.
Small block chevy with 600 fwhp = 75 hp per cylinder.
 
Do you think the lifting is from detonation or is it going to happen anyways?
Mike
86 GN

It's bound to happen if you make enough power, no matter what. Most guys just blame it on detonation but it's likely not on a fast TR, it's just lifting the head. I think it could happen with detonation too but i think it would matter how severe it is. I never re use head bolts or studs when i pull the heads off and i use a special lube on the threads and surfaces of the washers. I also torque them a little further than they reccomend. I have found that the ARP moly lube is inconsistant. These things have helped me keep lifting the head in check.
 
Are the stage 2 owners shaking their heads in agreement? They are side-stepping this whole issue of head lifting and gasket popping once and for all when they purchased their block. Come on Champion, finish that stage 2 project. The 109 block is making life harder than it should be.
Mike
86 GN
 
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