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Why you should get your oil sampled and analyzed by a lab.

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Turbo6inKY

Short Guy
TurboBuick.Com Supporter!
Joined
Jun 18, 2001
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I got this oil report back after my last event of the season. Lead, copper and all the other metals spiked noticeably:

AP1GczOlisz_E0vzg0TjYUTp1f6TTixHKe8pFtRkgoaVizoRxJO5nl2eqfU7EvG1VaTIGy6tVZDBdNH8iG7EMLnC7dTi2s5IHbCahMr-uOz_PD14zKvkSCLQ=w1080


Now, there was no noise from the engine. Oil pressure was great, 80 psi+ on startup, 30 at idle warmed up. But that huge spike is a big red flag, so I dropped the pan and pulled a rod cap:

AP1GczOlMX1Q5lxITrcFw-4F4YJXSnPyL9If8rfWqArEQADZ5WhblyHX9uZGyL74O5c44IZ4_ZqGYUF9ju6sgR0jmF421ZNYDoheyxE8P1Ce77YHes89sLIo=w1080


So I pulled the number 2 main cap:

AP1GczNviJsaObbBA-jPv9mI02x8gTlhBvZnLTPFx3QFiU2X7Ff7r1VLvhLCyn6z718gl_NAbAaKQroDc8vNCagrLaHHvbvW9IRNyCKvShW9BFMQ5PUToxoV=w1080


Yeah, WTF?

Well, I went ahead and pulled it. First thing I noticed was the windage baffle was broken away from the oil pan on the passenger side:

AP1GczPlva4mbswXMIKzTenmabr36Bum7wqeW4V00IgtNjup30qqZH9q-hS-Wmm5u_aomhvcgELNljpp7AJkyp6RWyioiu4gDgKyS1gs1XXI6QJAi0EfVVrN=w1080


Concerning, but there were no chunks missing from the fractured areas. So maybe? But let's keep looking.

The oil pump took a beating:

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I found just a tiny piece of metal in the turbo filter, I think this is a symptom not a cause:

AP1GczOHmh1oOkAKVuJbjhQQm_o-8qSnED-FPwTDdL0jV-IPBm14j6QhtVO_pDIL9dvf_Sffm_ljuTd51M_Pjnx6b_bjQ7nl5mrL6Y4QrFCmEbhpqrUTYXUy=w1080


And I found several of these little chunks of something non-metallic (checked with a meter), but really hard stuck in the mesh of the oil pickup:

AP1GczN-5mm-smYUqO5XqlXhwavnmVIwT13jo3ifEEtAsZ9RKtStQDmPMhYHSCDDgRN3RuFFO85qGzGq7dfL17X_UHsPSQNAmA7R0TzytseBSjKKOLHPNcmz=w1080


Pulling the oil galley plugs, and I find this:

AP1GczNpCowGS5iM-B-5YZhOZKyvfOpdQT6buUdcZG583lmqGMSgIx6irsnaQgKRRvUxYSjGJFl6ND0Xpcv8-oIPm8iCMNt9cbTetl2ZE2iaZ9jM7KAl5Ubn=w1080


So, the best hypothesis I have is there was way too much loctite used on these galley plugs and some chunks broke off and went through the pump and out to the mains and trashed the bearings. The debris from the bearings went through and scored the cam bearings slightly, just streaks in the teflon. But the hard parts are unharmed. The crank is beautiful, the camshaft looks perfect. A $35 lab report saved this engine. Without it it would have run just fine while those bearings continued to disintegrate and eventually something big happened.

Now instead of a pile of machine work and months of waiting since every machine shop worth a hoot is backed up at least six months I'm looking at a new front cover, carefully cleaning the block inside and out, and putting it all right back together with fresh bearings and new gaskets.

Get your stuff tested. It's cheap insurance.
 
Great report, Andrew! :love: Shows preventive maintenance really pays off! Thank you!
 
Hi Andrew, Glad you're able to discover this now. Makes for a much simpler refresh over the winter months - on your own time and schedule. Engine machine/build shops now getting further backlog with all the sportsman racers doing refreshs this time of year for the off-season, hoping to get out in time for start of Lucas Oil division 2 and div 7 events beginning in second half of February.

Thanks for posting the data.
 
Was the block shotabraded when it was built? The pump and bearings look like that's what scratched them. Did you find any dark or shiny pinhead sized particles imbedded in the piston skirts with matching scratches in the cylinder walls?
If the bottom of the cylinders were not chamfered with a fine flapper wheel after boring, it could be small particles from there. Same with not flappering the mains if line bored or honed. We're the oil galleys ported/ corners radiused, and the sharp edges blended? Were the valley, heads, and crankcase areas deburred before cleaning? Metal particles can break off from any sharp edge, casting flash or machined corner. Cast iron and aluimum is porous and fine particles will imbed in the pores. These will work there way out from: heat, vibration, and "power washing" effect from oil throw off in the crank case. We thoroughly "wash" and wipe all of the machined parts with ATF before assembly because ATF contains a lot of detergents and dispersants, that loosen and "float" these small machining "fines" from the pores in the metal.
Attention to every detail, no matter how small is what separates the great shops from the rest.
Typically shops that don't have much backlog are the ones with these results. It takes TIME to machine, clean, and assemble an engine correctly.
TIMINATOR
 
All good tips!

The block was fully deburred the last time It went to the machine shop, and it wasn't shot braded or media blasted. Very little of the debris I've found would stick to a magnet. Nothing in the piston skirts, no scuffing on the piston walls. If you look at the iron in the oil report it's elevated, but by only by 30% over the previous sample. Lead went up 3400%, copper went up 400%, and aluminum went up 133%. But chromium didn't move, so the problem didn't make it to the rings. I don't think this issue came from the block itself. I'd expect to see more iron in the sample and the debris would stick to a magnet. Given no damage to the crank, I think most of that iron came from the oil pump gears. They were pretty rough.

A few chunks of busted sealant shouldn't have wrought this kind of carnage. There was an oil spot mixed with grit right below the PCV valve on the valley pan, which could mean dirt intrusion around an aged PCV grommet may have contributed to the problem. Maybe. It's kind of frustrating when there's no positively identifiable root cause.

As of right now, the block's cleaned up and mostly back together. I got the bottom end buttoned back up last night and cam and new cam bearings are in. I should have the valvetrain back in tonight and it might go back in the car tomorrow. We'll see how froggy I feel. It's pretty cold here this week.
 
What are your bearing, piston/wall, ring gap, rod side, and guide clearances? Are all things deburred?
TIMINATOR
 
Piston to wall clearance target from CP Carillo was 0.0045, ring gaps were ground by the machine shop to match CP Carillo's recommendation for the application, whatever they were at the time. I don't have any symptoms that would lead me to re-measure any of that.

The rods (Molnar) and crank (T6P Forged) were brand new and everything measured right down the middle when we put it together. No visible wear on any of the hard parts, backed up by low iron and no chromium in the oil sample.
 
The moly increase is the oil I used. The previous sample was regular synthetic, but I fill it with Motul 300V for track events. If you look at the past samples, you'll see increased moly, those fills were all 300V and those moly counts are consistent with the additive package in that product.
 
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