60's musclecars

[tracy]

In the past few years I have owned some really nice 60's musclecars. Big block Chevelles, 70 Camaro, a 340 Duster and a '69 6bbl roadrunner.

I cannot believe how prices have jumped in the last year or so! They are becoming out of reach for the average person.

I think we'll see more people looking to 80's -90's muscle cars. After owning my TTA for some time now and becoming spoiled with an O/D trans, A/C, nice stereo and good handling, I don't think I could go back. Besides it's about as fast as any of those other cars with the exception of my old roadrunner. I really love the older stuff, but they have terrible road manners, and by todays standards for handling and braking they are just plain scary. I can't tell you how nerve-racking it is driving a 400 hp car with bias ply tires on the highway.

 

[microELVIS]

Road Runner

Ya i used to love the 6 pack road runner. Never had the pleasure of going for a ride in one though. But I've always wondered, I hear of huge rumbling chevelles getting smoked, and ponder how fast a 6 pack road runner was. Its rare that someone would actually race one Im sure. But how would you compare that car to something more common in power ? Id like to hear a former owners opinion.

 

[tracy]

Re: Road Runner

Originally posted by microELVIS
Ya i used to love the 6 pack road runner. Never had the pleasure of going for a ride in one though. But I've always wondered, I hear of huge rumbling chevelles getting smoked, and ponder how fast a 6 pack road runner was. Its rare that someone would actually race one Im sure. But how would you compare that car to something more common in power ? Id like to hear a former owners opinion.

Compared to an LS-6 it's anybody's race really. I do know an original owner of a '69 6pack Superbee (basically same as the roadrunner), the car is all stock and original and he runs mid 12's on original style tires. He is one of the few people I know that really knows how to tune these cars. The pure stock events seem to be dominated by the Mopar and Buick owners. Surprisingly the LS-6 cars never mount a real threat. I think Super Stock magazine clocked a 6bbl 'runner at 12.91.

Personally I thought the roadrunner was more fun than my LS-6. It had a flatter powerband and was "right now" fast. The LS-6 was a deeper breathing motor and wanted to rev more, so it built power.

 

[wlaukaitis]

I have never really owned a musclecar. I have always wanted a GTO and will get one some day. I have had a '90 LX 5.0, a '94 Z28, that is about as close as it has come.

I have the '86 GN right now but it is not street legal yet.

I have been in many a muscle car (GTO, T/A's, Camaro's, supercharged '80 maulibu, nissan P/U with a SBC and ti-power) etc) and there is something about the frame twisting torque and a 4-speed that has always had me interested. I have driven a '80 Z28 with a 4-speed and the power is different than lets say the moostang I had. The mustang felt more "springy" cause it was lighter and injected.

I am not sure yet, I may keep the GN or sell it someday and help finance the GTO

 

[tracy]

Originally posted by wlaukaitis
I have never really owned a musclecar. I have always wanted a GTO and will get one some day. I have had a '90 LX 5.0, a '94 Z28, that is about as close as it has come.

I have the '86 GN right now but it is not street legal yet.

I have been in many a muscle car (GTO, T/A's, Camaro's, supercharged '80 maulibu, nissan P/U with a SBC and ti-power) etc) and there is something about the frame twisting torque and a 4-speed that has always had me interested. I have driven a '80 Z28 with a 4-speed and the power is different than lets say the moostang I had. The mustang felt more "springy" cause it was lighter and injected.

I am not sure yet, I may keep the GN or sell it someday and help finance the GTO

Bring $$$ for the GTO, nice 67's are bringing huge $$. I see them going for 40k.

 

[wlaukaitis]

I know, I should have bought one in the '80s when I had a chance. I'm a dope. Not only that but I think you realy have to know what you are looking at. I am sure there a lot of Lemans out there parading around as GTO's. There is a guy around the block from work that has a beat to crap '65 with a 4bbl and 4-speed. the quarters are completely pushed in along with other bodywork (I don't do bodywork) and he wants $5000. But if it is original......

The guy that welded my GN header had a tri-power setup on a shelf, I told him they were fetching $2000 on ebay, probably shouldn't have told him that and offered him $300. Once again, my dopeness prevails.

 

[tracy]

Originally posted by wlaukaitis
I know, I should have bought one in the '80s when I had a chance. I'm a dope. Not only that but I think you realy have to know what you are looking at. I am sure there a lot of Lemans out there parading around as GTO's. There is a guy around the block from work that has a beat to crap '65 with a 4bbl and 4-speed. the quarters are completely pushed in along with other bodywork (I don't do bodywork) and he wants $5000. But if it is original......

The guy that welded my GN header had a tri-power setup on a shelf, I told him they were fetching $2000 on ebay, probably shouldn't have told him that and offered him $300. Once again, my dopeness prevails.

Sometimes a clone is a good way to go as long as it is represented as a clone. A Tempest will be less money. Then you can modify the car to your liking, paint it any color, etc. and not have the guilt of hacking up a clean original.

 

[84GNPILE]

Agreed. After watching the Barrett Jackson auctions the past few years, it is painfully obvious the average Joe won't be able to get their hands on a 60's Musclecar very much longer.I got my 68SS Chevelle about 4yrs ago and I'm amazed at what some of these are bringing now.

What's really cool to me is all the technology that has come about for these cars in the past few years.Suspension upgrades,EFI,Disc Brake setups,etc.

Scary handling and bias ply's??? not anymore

Also, the reproduction industry has exploded to the point you can pretty much start with a frame and build a complete car....

Now is a good time to start picking up the 80's cars.............BUT I'm not so sure they will be worth anything in the future.(Exception being GN's,TTA's,ZR1's,)Any other's????

 

[tracy]

Originally posted by 84GNPILE
Agreed. After watching the Barrett Jackson auctions the past few years, it is painfully obvious the average Joe won't be able to get their hands on a 60's Musclecar very much longer.I got my 68SS Chevelle about 4yrs ago and I'm amazed at what some of these are bringing now.

What's really cool to me is all the technology that has come about for these cars in the past few years.Suspension upgrades,EFI,Disc Brake setups,etc.

Scary handling and bias ply's??? not anymore

Also, the reproduction industry has exploded to the point you can pretty much start with a frame and build a complete car....

Now is a good time to start picking up the 80's cars.............BUT I'm not so sure they will be worth anything in the future.(Exception being GN's,TTA's,ZR1's,)Any other's????

Yes I think the "newer" 80's muscle cars will go up also. In addition to the cars you mentioned I think it's possible that 1LE camaro, Hurst Olds 442's and possibbly evensome of the turbo/intercooled Chrysler stuff might be desireable. The 80's were not comparable to the musclecar era of the 60's, but nevertheless there were still some noteable cars.

Who would have dreamed an A-body 340 Mopar would bring the big money they command today.

 

[1ARUNEM]

I've had several myself and am starting to find them out of reach as well.

That being said, maybe I shouldn't be selling this one..

http://www.racingjunk.com/vc/213142/classifiedad.html

Email me at pier1122@bellsouth.net if you're interested..

Thanks..

 

[tlturbo]

I can give you a 1/4 mile comparison.

I bought a new 69 vette convertible in Sept of 68. It was a 427, 435 hp tri power car and ended up with Kustom chrome side headers and 456 rear end.

On street tires, it would run very high 12's and the best I ever got with slicks was a 12 flat. And that was with a 6000 rpm clutch dump. Scarey!!! But those were the days that an 11 sec car was very imporessive and not something you saw every day. ESPECIALLY on the street. I never had a problem with hemi chargers, 440's, etc. Got killed one time on the street by a VERY trick small block 66 Nova SS - one of the 375 hp 327's I think. Lots of work done on it.

So I basically had a very loud 13 sec flat street car that got 7 miles per gallon.

Terry

 

[chevyII]

Most dont know but in 63 the fastest car was a 63 nova with a 327. I have 2 years of hot rod mags from62,63 and the time slips for the car was slightly faster than a 413 long ram belvidere in the quarter. By the way I have one pro street 2x3 full frame/650 stage 1. hoping to be on the road next spring.

 

[charlloots]

check this out guys it lists the fastest 50 musclecars of all time www.musclecarclub.com

 

[dhauser]

I think you do a disservice by comparing muscle cars of the 60s and early 70s to the cars of today. 25-30 years of technology and progress has forever changed what a muscle car is. The original intent was to put a big block engine in a mid-size bodystyle. End of story. Today, "muscle cars" do everything well, because customers and competition demand it, and time and history have paved the way for these new innovations, and thus, new expectations.

IMO, being in a "real" muscle car is all about your senses, not about track times. They were a marketing gimmick, designed to appeal to the testosterone-rich of the day who had wallets deep enough to afford the biggest big block, the loudest colors, and the widest tires. It was about the sounds the engines made, the feeling of really "ripping" through the gearbox, throwing the car sideways and the feeling of being on the edge of control. It was almost cartoonish at the end of the era, but it was all about the right audience at the right time and place. We'll never see anything like it ever again, and IMO, we really shouldn't. It was special, and that's what makes the legends of muscle cars continue to survive and thrive today---because it'll never be like that again.

Cars like our TBs are wonderful for many different reasons. Heck, I love driving the twin turbo Stealth in my sig---it has all wheel drive, blistering acceleration, and handles like a go-cart, but a muscle car it ain't, nor will it be no matter what I do to it. In a way, it's apples and oranges, and I like the taste of both!

As for prices, I think in large part muscle car prices (outside of the idiotic and non-representative world of Barrett Jackson) run in parallel to the prices of new vehicles today. I mean, most people can't afford $52k Corvettes, or $50k SUVs, or, can they? It's all a matter of choices. Personally, I'd much rather drive a $10k daily driver and spend the rest on a couple of bitchin' muscle cars or other toys. But people make choices.

I just sent the 1970 Boss 302 packing to Massachusetts this afternoon. It is a mint condition, well sorted muscle car, but when you think about it, it's no more expensive than a new loaded up Ford Pick up, and considerably cheaper than a Lincoln Navigator. For the same money, I'll drive a nice used car AND have my "Boss 302" in the garage.

Prices for everything are going up.....Gasoline, on the other hand, is not going up naturally....that's a whole 'nother story.

 

[Captain Mark]

92 Stealth Twin Turbo, AWD, 21k miles, MINT! FS
69 Mustang Mach 1 428 CJ mint--FS
70 Boss 302 Concours mint--SOLD!
63 Impala SS 409/409 4spd--FS
55 Chevy Pro-Street--super mint--FS
76 TA 400 auto--wht/wht/red--FS
72 Chevelle SS BB 4 speed convertible--FS
69 Chevelle SS clone red mint--FS
68 GTO-red/blk 400/335hp Mint--FS
73 Dodge Challenger-Plum Crazy--FS
86 Ttype, 16k original miles--FS
87 Turbo T--46k miles--blk--non-WE-4--SOLD!!
93 Mustang LX 5.0 5 Spd Coupe--FS
97 Mercedes SL 500 Roadster, both tops, 37k miles, perfect! FS


And just what would you know about muscle cars anyway!

Just kidding.....nice collection sir.

 

[dhauser]

The bad thing is I want to keep them all!!! Hehe, but eating is good, too....

 

[Gn-ing]

I'm 50,and owned quite a few muscle cars..some of my faves were, the 70 Buick GS stage 1 convert 4 speed...rare when new..510 ft lbs of torque,stock..70 olds 442 W-30 convert..
We now have 701/2 Trans AM RAIII...fun car,makes all the cool V8 sounds...
The prices for good cars are so high now,everyone know about muscle cars,heck they are on TV almost any nite,in discovery channels and others..
Hold on to your turbo regals..They are collectible right now!

 

[Nick Micale]

Originally posted by chevyII
Most dont know but in 63 the fastest car was a 63 nova with a 327. I have 2 years of hot rod mags from62,63 and the time slips for the car was slightly faster than a 413 long ram belvidere in the quarter. ............

There is no way in hell a 327 Nova was faster than the '63 Mopars.!

The Dodges and Plymouths were short ram 426's in '63 and NO Chevy could touch them in the quarter mile. In '64 Mopar upped the ante with bigger carbs, better cam and the alum front end that kept them unbeatable.

 

[myclone]

Originally posted by dhauser
I think you do a disservice by comparing muscle cars of the 60s and early 70s to the cars of today. 25-30 years of technology and progress has forever changed what a muscle car is. The original intent was to put a big block engine in a mid-size bodystyle. End of story. Today, "muscle cars" do everything well, because customers and competition demand it, and time and history have paved the way for these new innovations, and thus, new expectations.

IMO, being in a "real" muscle car is all about your senses, not about track times. They were a marketing gimmick, designed to appeal to the testosterone-rich of the day who had wallets deep enough to afford the biggest big block, the loudest colors, and the widest tires. It was about the sounds the engines made, the feeling of really "ripping" through the gearbox, throwing the car sideways and the feeling of being on the edge of control. It was almost cartoonish at the end of the era, but it was all about the right audience at the right time and place. We'll never see anything like it ever again, and IMO, we really shouldn't. It was special, and that's what makes the legends of muscle cars continue to survive and thrive today---because it'll never be like that again.

Cars like our TBs are wonderful for many different reasons. Heck, I love driving the twin turbo Stealth in my sig---it has all wheel drive, blistering acceleration, and handles like a go-cart, but a muscle car it ain't, nor will it be no matter what I do to it. In a way, it's apples and oranges, and I like the taste of both!

As for prices, I think in large part muscle car prices (outside of the idiotic and non-representative world of Barrett Jackson) run in parallel to the prices of new vehicles today. I mean, most people can't afford $52k Corvettes, or $50k SUVs, or, can they? It's all a matter of choices. Personally, I'd much rather drive a $10k daily driver and spend the rest on a couple of bitchin' muscle cars or other toys. But people make choices.

Couldnt have said it better...

 

[Buick From Hell]

Originally posted by chevyII
Most dont know but in 63 the fastest car was a 63 nova with a 327.

I'll let you & Mick debate the 'fastest' claim, but I can tell you this: the SLOWEST car in '63 had to be the Nova SS with a straight-6 and a powerglide. I had one in '76-'77. I did a zero to 50 test with my newfangled digital watch with a built-in stopwatch.

24 seconds flat.

Yup, dead stop to 50. I would've gone to 60, but I ran out of friggin' road!

I have owned some faster wheels:

'67 Coronet R/T, 440 magnum, auto w/2-something gears in back. Complete dishrag off the line, BUT it would do a 2 mile burnout (or more, depended on when the tire finally went! ), and from a 35 mph rolling start, only 2 cars ever beat me: a '56 Nomad wagon drag car (that was a fair race, uh-huh) and a fiberglass '23 T-bucket (1400# car with a very healthy 327). I never did race any hemi's though!

'70 Coronet R/T, 440 six-pac, slapstick, 4:10's in back (only pic I have of it)

Only mods I did: a set of 2-1/8" Casler headers, and I yanked the 6-pak in favor of a pair of 4's! It ran so much better with 2 AFB's it wasn't even funny. Was hard to get races with this car! Never won anyway, cuz the only thing this car was really good at was sliding sideways! L-60-15's would NOT grab the asphault! At ANY speed in first or second gear, all I had to do was mash the gas and it was zamboni time! (funnest car to drive I ever owned!!)


Had a '70 Mach I mustang, but it was totally trashed when I got it. It never felt all that fast. Was REAL easy to figure out how much gas I burned, as it always got EXACTLY 10 mpg...

I guess my 1970's cars can be called "60's" musclecars, since they actually started BUILDING them in '69!