67dbb with....basically stock everything, times?

fbodlovr

1/4 Mile Freak
Joined
Aug 14, 2005
I am currently switching over to the 86-87setup, and I am not going to do ANYTHING until this engine is in and everything is running correctly(so I can verify things are right before I start modding.) But, after it is in, say I change over to the 67dbb, with a 3000 OR 3200 with 60lb injectors, TT chip. afpr, hotwired pump, walbro pump, and 3in downpipe, what times could I see, and would there be much difference between those two stalls?

Also, after that is done, THEN I did ported heads, and front mount intercooler, what would I see? I want a turbo I can grow into, and I have heard a LOT of good things about this turbo, this is why I am choosing this turbo.
 
I'll chime in on this one.

My current combo has 98K miles on the clock.
Motor is bone stock except for an RJC power plate, valve springs and a double roller timing chain.
The good parts are,
PT6776RHP with a Heavy Duty actuator and a .63 A/R PTE turbine housing.
RJC 375 FM Intercooler
3" Terry Houston downpipe with test pipe
2 3/4" dual exhaust with Welded Ultraflow mufflers
60# Mototron injectors
Turbo Tweak race chip (80% duty cycle for default WOT fuel and 26* timing across)
3000 10" l/u Coan converter
RJC boost controller
Buickgn Big Mouth 4" MAF pipe cold air setup
Toasted tranny as of tonight
Adj FP Reg
Hot wired Walbro 340 pump
Kirban 8mm plug wires on Autolite 23 plugs
And the basic Spring Cleaning baby stuff

This combo with a TE-60R turbo and a PTE stock location IC ran a best of 11.73 @ 115 at Bowling Green this year.
Tonight was the first time I have been able to make it to the track with the new turbo and intercooler. Check out my race report in the Turbo Lounge for a blow by blow results.
This turbo, even though it's a dual ball bearing turbo, needs a converter that will stall to 3200-3300 at zero psi to really spool it up good. I would not hesitate to spec this turbo on a stock motor car with bolt ons similar to mine. Very street friendly and a monster on boost. Spool up with my current 3k converter is slow to say the least. So slow in fact that on my second pass, the car was so rich that it was bogging during spool up. She needs more stall.
I say, if the combo is sound, don't hesitate on the 6776R DBB turbo.
I'm going to install my Art Carr 9" 3300-3400 stall that's sitting on the shelf, replace the tranny and try again. This combo will definitely run 11.30s after what I saw tonight.
Hope this helps.

Patrick
 
If you have the proper converter for each...

Will the bb version make more hp and yeild better et's than the non-bb 67?
 
I saw a post that said 99% of these cars are driven on the street and 1% on the track. I agree with that and was wondering how a 3200 stall would act on the street, and highway cruising long distance. Wont it have to rev up a LOT more from stop light to stop light to get moving? Also, on the highway, does it just lockup, and then its just like driving normal?

And last question for this post. Im kind of stumped as to the zero psi at 3200 rpm. What exactly does that mean? Is that where the car starts to want to spin the tires, but the turbo isnt spooling yet? And about what rpm DOES the turbo start to build boost?
 
I'm running a 3400 LU convertor. It takes a little more rpm to get it rolling from a dead stop. It locks up and revs at about 2000 RPM at 60 mph.
 
To answer the first question: More horsepower is based on your combo and with the two turbos(DBB vs. Standard journal) the converter is where you will notice the difference and daily drivalbility. A BB version has less resistance by not having oil circulating in the shaft area. The enclosed BB cartridge uses water as the heat transfer mechanism and therby has ALOT less friction to overcome like oil. The result is a monster size turbo that does not need a very loose converter to work effectively. You dont have the negative effect of a super loose converter stalling to 4000 rpms just to cruise around with. The BB version gives you the best of both worlds.:smile:

I had to get my converter which was orginally a 3000 stall loosned up to 3200 and it is dead on. There is no hesitation...its insta spool to 25 psi. I hardly notice the converter driving around town. I see no drawbacks to it. It might burn a little more gas(I dont keep track of it) but I didnt buy this car to get fuel economy.;)
 
Not too long ago I got my trans rebuilt and put in a Pat's 10" nonlock converter, advertised as 3200-3400 stall. I certainly DO notice the higher RPM it takes to get going from a stop but it's not awful either. Just enough that I do notice it.

As far as ball-bearing vs traditional for the same turbo, as long as you matched the converter to either style, I don't think you would see much difference in overall horsepower. Don't take my word for it, I'm no expert, but that's my understanding from what I've read. The main difference is spool up. If you run a loose enough converter to spool the journal bearing turbo or a tight enough converter to spool the ball bearing turbo, the end result overall horsepower should be close to the same.

Im kind of stumped as to the zero psi at 3200 rpm. What exactly does that mean? Is that where the car starts to want to spin the tires, but the turbo isnt spooling yet?

Yes my understanding of "at zero psi" is that you can footbrake the car for a launch and get the RPM up to 3200 but not have any boost built up yet.
 
Just for more info in this post...

Here is a video of my car stalling with a PTE70GTQ DBB w/.85 hsg. This is from idle to foot-on-the-floor.

http://www.turbomalibu.com/videos/PTE70GTQ.85_stall.WMV


Here is how it stalls RPM wise...BUT it isn't from idle to foot-on-the-floor. It was gradually mashing the throttle down as shown by the TPS.

Right Click and "Save Target As" ---> Here is the data log.

strokerstall.gif
 
Im kind of stumped as to the zero psi at 3200 rpm. What exactly does that mean? Is that where the car starts to want to spin the tires, but the turbo isnt spooling yet?

Zero boost stall is how many RPM's the engine is turning at 0 boost. If you look at my last post you can see my engine turns about 2700 RPM's at 0 boost.


And about what rpm DOES the turbo start to build boost?

That depends on the engines combination of performance parts.
 
So, if i got a 3200 stall, I would be sitting at 0 psi, and anything after that, the tires would start to spin?

Also turbo1dr, what your car starting to spin the tires, because it looked like your boost went up to 20psi or something like that. Will a tranny brake let you mash the gas at the line, and built as much boost as possible?
 
So, if i got a 3200 stall, I would be sitting at 0 psi, and anything after that, the tires would start to spin?

Also turbo1dr, what your car starting to spin the tires, because it looked like your boost went up to 20psi or something like that. Will a tranny brake let you mash the gas at the line, and built as much boost as possible?

Just because your stall converter is 3200 doesn't necessarily mean you can get to that high of an RPM without already having built some boost. That's why we've been specifically saying "RPM at zero PSI" because you might be able to get your car up to a higher RPM without spinning the tires, but the turbo will be boosting already. So you might have a 3500 stall converter but your turbo might start building boost at 3000.

And yes a trans brake will let you build as much RPM/Boost at the line as possible and the car will not move.
 
So, if i got a 3200 stall, I would be sitting at 0 psi, and anything after that, the tires would start to spin?

Forget about the tires spinning. Tires spinning is the function of how well the brakes hold. It has nothing to do with stall speeds.:)


Also turbo1dr, what your car starting to spin the tires?

When the brakes are hot the tires start to spin at about 5psi. That video of the turbo stalling was with the e-brake on and I was holding the foot brake at the same time. The brakes were also cold.
 
what times could I see, and would there be much difference between those two stalls?

So, what times could be seen?? Im curious about the times myself, I just put a PT6776 journal bearing on mine. Havent had a chance to drive it with the new turbo yet, but its a stock motor
 
Will try to go on Sunday NOV 4 to the the track and give some real results for u guys on the fence about the 6776dbb. I HATE to be one of those guys that make butt dyno predictions but I can tell u from having owned these cars for 12 years now...this combo is gonna fly. I have a stock cam and that is going to be my achilles heel but it feels good enough on the street for some 11.30's. With a good sixty foot that is.

We shall see...
 
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