ball bearing?

[Cleaner13]

ok this is probably a dumb question to the turbo gurus

but what companies make ball bearing turbos? or ceramic or both (if thats possible?)

is this an option you can get on any turbo or just a certain range?

the reason I ask is that when I order my turbo I would like to get the ball bearing or ceramic option as well

I am looking for a turbo to support about 600hp and be stock appearing or atleast be able to use my terry houston downpipe and such

any turbos out there?

thanks

Carl

PS I called PTE and after I told them my planned combo they suggested the PT54 which I am thinking on going on at this time as I cannot think of anything else, but I never asked about ball bearing

 

[Two Lane]

Ball-bearing Turbos
Regarding the BB question, give Jack a call!

www.cottonsperformance.com

Jack's a true resource on BB-turbos!!

(Plus being a great fellow to do business with)

HTH

 

[Ormand]

Turbonetics

It's an option on many of their turbos. An expensive option, IMO. Would be nice to hear from those who have tried them, to get a better feel for the actual improvement. Are they worth the money? My impression is that the quick spool of the BB would let you run a little bigger turbo than you might otherwise use on the street, but how to do you put a value on that?

 

[salvageV6]

I'm looking at the CPT-66 turbonetics ball bearing turbo from Cottons. Gonna use a 3K stall Vigilante with it on the street.

Scott GN1270 used a similar combo. in his low 11 car on the street. Spooled well when I rode in it.

Gotta come up with the big $$$ before I call Jack to order it.

The PTE51 will go on the GN.

 

[KendallF]

Originally posted by Cleaner13
ok this is probably a dumb question to the turbo gurus

but what companies make ball bearing turbos? or ceramic or both (if thats possible?)

is this an option you can get on any turbo or just a certain range?

the reason I ask is that when I order my turbo I would like to get the ball bearing or ceramic option as well

I am looking for a turbo to support about 600hp and be stock appearing or atleast be able to use my terry houston downpipe and such

any turbos out there?

thanks

Carl

PS I called PTE and after I told them my planned combo they suggested the PT54 which I am thinking on going on at this time as I cannot think of anything else, but I never asked about ball bearing

Turbonetics offers roller bearings (not ball) on the compressor side only. You can get them on about any turbo up to the thumper size. They claim greatly improved thrust load capability and some increase in spool time. Jack Cotton has been selling these for a couple of years; Two Lane put a link to his site above.

Innovative Turbo (Rick Head's new company spun off from T'netics) offers dual ball bearing options. Duttweiler is using quite a bit of Innovative stuff now, apparently.
http://www.innovativeturbo.com/cgi-bin/htmlos.cgi/00159.12.120740996070271471

Garrett has been doing true ball bearing centers on both the compressor and turbine side for a while; they are just starting to trickle down to the aftermarket turbos. Apparently PT&E will offer these soon..call Harry back and ask so you can report back for us.

The ball bearing option is expensive..on turbos similar to the PT-54 (TE/TA-6x, T'netics 60 series) that have big compressor and turbine wheels with a small shaft, it may be worth it just in terms of improved durability as it's usually thrust failure that kills these, in my experience.

I don't have any real durability data to report other than the fact that the 2 or 3 ball bearing turbos I know of in use locally are doing fine and I have personal experience in breaking a number of non-ball bearing 60 series turbos. I have a great blown-up parts collection..

 

[NJTurbo]

After speaking with Jack over the fall, he feels no benifit running BB's not to mention it is very pricy. Jack also told me his other Turbo with no BB spooled just as quick. Keep your money Carl.

 

[jmidolo]

No benefit to running a BB turbo?? Last I heard or read from posts of his, they were the best thing since sliced bread??

I still don't know of anyone running one, nor have I, so I have no 1st hand experience...

Joe

 

[Two Lane]

Another Resource For You

http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarrett/jsp/index.jsp

Has all the info on the GT-Series by Garrett that PTE will hopefully make available for the Buick community in 60-90 days.

Also, type in GT-Series in the Search box for some good info on these turbos from an early December thread.

Like me ol' Pappy always says: "Son, youse pays yo' money, youse takes yo' choice."

HTH

Happy Holidays!!

 

[tazgn]

I have a T-72 BB turbo that I run on the street. I will never own a non-BB turbo again unless it's really small!! This 72 spools WAYYYYY quicker than my TE-62 did (same converter, etc.). Plus, it may be just coincidence, but I blew up the 62 3 times. The 72 has run strong for 2 years without a wimper. Yes, it is expensive (about $700) for the ball bearings, but I think it's the only reasonable way to get a big turbo to work on the street without going with a 4000+ stall converter. This is just my opinion, but I do have one, and have had many other non-BB turbos. Worth every cent in my opinion (unless non-BB turbos have magically grown 100% faster spooling in the past 2 years).

Derrick

 

[V8KILLR]

AGREE WITH DERRICK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I was scared that I was going too big with the 60, that the spool up would take all day long. All I can say is don't worry. I don't even know what turbo lag is any more. My 60 spools like a mad man!!!!!!! I wish I had gone with a 72 BB. You can't go too big with a BB turbo, even with a low stall.........look down, running a 60 with a 2800 stall and it works great. If any one out there would like to trade a 60 BB for a 72 BB, let me know Like Derrick, I will NEVER go with a non-BB turbo ever again, worth every cent!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jason

 

[jmidolo]

Um..that was the whole point of the ****in post dip****!

he claims he does not feel the difference

Oh, so you mean, you have no 1st hand knowledge then either..very good

 

[tazgn]

At the track, I don't think there is much of a difference because you are already building boost off the line. But trust me. There is a HUGE difference for street driving. I have the same converter with the 62 and the BB 72. The 72 spools on the street WAY faster than the 62 ever dreamed of spooling. This is just my actual experience... Is it worth the money?? I guess that depends on the person and how much lag they want with a larger turbo. For me, I happened to have the money at the time and and very thankful I did.

Derrick

 

[JCotton]

Ok, here I go again. Little bit of miscommunication. NJ, when I spoke to you in the fall about my DBL BB turbo from Innovative, that was the one I was referring to. I was very disappointed with the performance of that turbo. My Turbonetics 80 non BB spooled better. Now with my 76BB from turbonetics, I could spool that off the foot brake in the blink of an eye. So I have gone back to Turbonetics, testing completed and new turbo on the way!!
To sum it up,
it's like Derrick said, once you go BB, you'll never go back. For those that have missed the many statements by members here everytime this thread comes up, check the archives. Ask the winner of TSM< TMS at Bristol this year, but then again, the faster guys don't advertize, for obvious reasons what their "edge" is. While your at it, ask him whose frt mnt IC he uses now!
Happy Holidays

 

[jmidolo]

Derrick? Used to live in MA right? I think it was MA. Moved to Hawaii about 4 yrs ago? How's it goin? What's the GN running these days?

 

[tazgn]

Joe,
Yep that's me... Still stuck in Hawaii. Damn sunny weather and warm days all year . The car is a little different from when I was back there now. But still not running like I would like. When will this damn thing be able to run down John Force on the big end of the track .

Derrick

 

[NJTurbo]

Jack,

Sorry i misunderstood you my fault. What is the average price let's say on a T76 BB verses non BB

 

[jmidolo]

HAHA..yea, warm weather just reallly sux, I feel for you. Buddy of mine just came back from a 4 mth vaca in Hawaii..not sure what part, but he loved it and didn't want to leave.

Well, when you want to sell that heap of parts and that car you got, I got 3500 bux here w/your name on it!!

 

[V8KILLR]

Jack is on the money!!!! Have LOVED all the parts that he has helped me with. The two best things that I did to my car, BOTH came from him........................HUGE Front Mount Intercooler and the 60 BB turbo. Thanks as always for putting up with all my dreaming of every combo and the endless questions.

Happy XMass,
Jason

 

[Two Lane]

Thanks For Clarifying, Jack!

Originally posted by JCotton

To sum it up, once you go BB, you'll never go back.

Happy Holidays

==========================================
Whether it's testing/using the latest in turbos, or building improved intercoolers...

Jack is a real "Trailblazer", not stuck in concrete in doing things the same old way when a better part/procedure or improved technology is available...and he's always stretching the envelope!

Personally, Jack is a good role-model for "going-the-extra-mile"
for his customers. Jack's noticeable appreciation & respect for his customers is mirrored back to him, by them.

You may meet Jack as a customer, but you'll leave as friends.



Thanks and Happy Holidays, Jack!

 

[Turbonetics]

Hi Guys,

Kendall said most of it already, but I wanted to put my two cents in

Basically, the purpose of our ceramic ball bearing turbo was not to decrease spool up time in anyway. It was originally created to increase durability at higher boost levels.

But one of the side effects ( which happens to be a desired one ) is quicker spool up. Since you cannot feel the durability ( well maybe in the pocketbook ) most people describe the spool up instead.

BTW, our bearings are a ceramic ball bearing not a roller as previously described.

Any other questions, let me know.