Complete Engine Build step by step

[Razor]

Ok, I checked 2 Chiltons and 1 Haynes book. They all say .0003-.0018 on the mains. I should be well within tolerances. I spun the crank and looked at the bearings, they look fine.

Ya know its been so long since I look at this spec since they way i've been tought to build them has been on the looser side and .0015-.0020 is typically my target and never had an issue.

Guess I understand the spec being there, but dont know anyone whose had success at .0005 for example. I do know that I hear horror stories of spun mains and such. That is to me my greatest fear building one of these motors. Next fear is a spun cam bearing..

My GM book lists the same spec.. wonder if those horror stories are from machine shops building the motor at .0003-.0005 Even tho it is acceptable accoring to the books. :redface:

 

[Razor]

hey razor i see the sludge hammer in the back ground. i guess ever buick owner has one when his car makes him mad. :biggrin:

Thats the 5hit better fit hammer or Daddy's gonna make it rite

The blue box are my mic's

 

[jhef83]

You had me more than a little worried. Mine were all right at .0015 except thrust which was at .0010. Rods bearings were at........well lets just say there OK :biggrin:

 

[49-blues]

Every viable engine builder i spoke to swears by .0015- .0020 on all the bearings- no tighter than .0015. I think you should call a couple qualified turbo engine builders and make an inquiry. ( nick micale, RPE, grooms, weber,DLS, etc) Is the chiltons specifically for a turbo engine or for a naturally inspired carbureted motor? i wouldnt trust chiltons on this. Tighter than .0015 id be worring about spinning a bearing .

 

[Razor]

Look at your GM books.. they list that spec. I made an off the hip comment +1 disagreeing with the spec posted, but it is in the books.

What we all have learned to set the clearances to and what is listed in the books is two different things.

Just an observation

 

[Buds87GN]

hey razor i see the sludge hammer in the back ground. i guess ever buick owner has one when his car makes him mad. :biggrin:

Atleast his is in the back ground, mine protrudes from the windshield

 

[87we410877]

Ok. The engine shop said my mains were .0003 too tight without the bearings in so they are going to align hone untill the clearences are met. This may be why my old bearings all looked like pennys. I'll post updated as soopn as i know them. Thanks alot.

 

[jhef83]

When checking rod side clearance, does it matter which side of the rod you check? I seem to be out of spec on the inboard side and within on the outboard side. Or I'm just

 

[87we410877]

Ok. $1200 later the motor is done, crank and gurdle on, .0023-.0026 clearences and .006-.0065 crank end play. Now, I was thinking of installing the cam (hydraulic roller) and double roller chain and gears first before installing the pistons and rods since it will be easier to turn the crank and position my timing marks w/ them out. Is this ok or is there a prefered method? I will post pics of the install this weekend.

 

[49-blues]

What did the machine do for the $1200?

 

[87we410877]

What did the machine do for the $1200?

I know its alot but the guy is amazing. I know its right now. Heres what he did.................. Installed mains with gurdle(4x)to get proper clearences, enlarge holes in main cap to get proper thrust bearing alignment, hand champfer main bearings for fillet on crank (This was even with the H-series bearings w/ the champfer)Boil block, remove and replace galley plugs and cam bearings, line hone mains, polish crank(2x) check crank straightness, Remove and install crank to get proper crank endplay, install rear main, install crank, install gurdle seal, new washers. .

 

[87we410877]

I got the rods and pistons in tonight. Heres some pics. I forgot, my camera is a POS!!!!!!!!

 

[49-blues]

Looks good- good luck with it.

 

[87we410877]

Heres the head install. I used ARP 190,000 PSI bolts on this side. Heres how i did it and correct me if im wrong. First start by removing the coating ARP puts on the bolts at the threads using a wire wheel. Next i soaked the bolts in laquor thinner to remove any foreign debris or oils. Next, i took some more thinner and went over the deck to remove any oils. I used a cometic head gasket so you will want your deck as smooth as possible. All of the head bolts on the block go into the water jackets so your going to want to seal that up really good so you have no leaks around the bolts/studs. Use a high heat and pressure thread sealant with teflon such as Loctite 567 or equivalent good for 10,000 PSI and 500 degrees (Is what i got. Doesn't necessarily have to be exactly that high). I used a small brush to put the sealant in the bolt holes since i am using bolts not studs. If you were using studs, which i will show when i do the other head, you can just put the sealant on the threads. I also put a little sealat on the threads of the bolts anyway. Next, make sure your head mating surface is clean a free from debris. If using champion GN1's make sure the locating dowels are not above the deck surface more than .300" as the Champion directions state. Mine were about 3.4-- so i had to push them down a little using a high speed lateral compensator (hammer). Next, i lightly sprayed the cometic gasket both sides with Hi tac gasket sealer/maker. I was hoping this would help seal leaks that some people get with cometics. I then put the head on making sure the gasket didnt move and the head goes all the way down over the locating pins. Put ARP moly lube on both sides of the washer and under the head of the bolt. If using studs, both sides of the washer and under the nut. Torque according to champions diagram and re-torque according to champions instructions.

 

[87we410877]

1 more.

 

[49-blues]

I ve heard that the black rtv works better on head bolts so thats what i used.

 

[87we410877]

Sorry its taking so long but thats what happens when you try to build a custom engine. First i was stuck on the crank key. The stock one is too tall and not wide enough for the CAT cranks. Im not sure if this is also the case with the eagle or scat cranks as well. But, heres what i did. Called around and found out that Weber racing had the information i needed. They sent me a pre-machined key which comes with a .005" shim placed in between the key and the keyway. Not to mention his instructions and tech support was exellent!!! So i solved that problem. Next up was the timing chain. Way too loose. I took a measurement (which weber explained to me how to take) and called Weber again. I just ordered my .010" under chain which should do the trick. But, of corse its special order. hahah. The snowball continues to roll. Anyway, heres a picture of setting up TDC (Top Dead Center) on cylinder #1.
I used a dial indicator and a base stand on the deck of the head and watched the needle. To get TDC, watch the needle go in one direction as the piston is coming up. When the needle stops, just before it starts going back down, you have top dead. I was amazed how accurate this actually was. It was on TDC to the .001"!!! Whenever i get the timing chain, provided it fits correctly, i will post that install and continue the build, pushrods, rockers etc etc.....Enjoy!!!

 

[Woody]

I used a dial indicator and a base stand on the deck of the head and watched the needle. To get TDC, watch the needle go in one direction as the piston is coming up. When the needle stops, just before it starts going back down, you have top dead. I was amazed how accurate this actually was. It was on TDC to the .001"!!! Whenever i get the timing chain, provided it fits correctly, i will post that install and continue the build, pushrods, rockers etc etc.....Enjoy!!!

Hmmmmm........I don't understand why you were checking TDC? Was it to determine how much the piston extends into the combustion chamber for valve clearance? If so, did you account for the head gasket thickness? I know the procedure for degreeing the cam, but you need the cam installed with the timing chain in order to degree it in........

Please understand, I am not an experienced engine builder and was curious about this procedure you took....

Thanks,

Woody

 

[87we410877]

Hmmmmm........I don't understand why you were checking TDC? Was it to determine how much the piston extends into the combustion chamber for valve clearance? If so, did you account for the head gasket thickness? I know the procedure for degreeing the cam, but you need the cam installed with the timing chain in order to degree it in........

Please understand, I am not an experienced engine builder and was curious about this procedure you took....

Thanks,

Woody[/QUOTE]

I was just setting TDC so i could put my cam, cam gears and chain on and have the correct timing. 0 degrees. I wasnt reading the indicator, just watching the needle.

 

[MSDGN]

Doesn't really matter if you find TDC now...the cam gear can only go on one way and has a timing mark on it...the crank gear can only go on one way unless it has mult keyways...but it's still has timing marks...after the cam is in...just put the chain on by lining up the marks up on both gears...then you find TDC to degree the cam...IMO I wouldn't use a dial indicator to find TDC...you should use a piston stop along with a degree wheel...the piston stop can be made very cheaply and easily with a rectanglular piece
of alum(1/4" thick)...drill 3 holes...2 to bolt it to block using the bolts holes for the head and one in the middle to act as a stop...the alum piece just needs to be long enough to go across the cyl...