Effects of Alcohol and Race Gas
- Thread starter bishir
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I have run Xylene added to the gas, and alcohol.. and was a great mix. Good results if you cant flow enough alky.
Race gas requires high timing to burn properly..alky usually works better on lower timing.. I have run them both together..didnt fair well for me..... they are different tunes. may work if you get some detonation with the race gas..whats the worse that could happen..zero benefit.
Race gas requires high timing to burn properly..alky usually works better on lower timing.. I have run them both together..didnt fair well for me..... they are different tunes. may work if you get some detonation with the race gas..whats the worse that could happen..zero benefit.
TT/Ameasap
The White Blur
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2002
- Messages
- 5,374
Ya, I thought I seen you mixing a little bit of the sweet stuff with your 93 'N' alky the first time I met you Julio.
So, that didn't help any because of the low timing in your chip?
Well actually when I had the SMC kit on pump speed 10 and on the edge of knocking..so adding some race gas or xylene to the tank would take the edge out..kinda like a safety.
Out of experimentation I decided to run straight race gas and the car with the low timing chip wasnt happy..I then ran a high timing chip..at the same boost level as I run with alcohol..was worse..Finally dropped boost down three PSI and the race gas worked..but alky didnt/wasnt taking the edge out of the detonation.
See if your intake air temps go to 170+ degrees..its very hot and will ping with whatever gas you use. Hence why I can run those air temps..cuase the alky cools the charge down big time...in this particular case alcohol works better than racegas...
And the 170 was on a 70 degree day. I dunno..i'm kinda getting stuck in my ways. Wont go back to race gas unless the car becomes a 100 percent track car. You risk popping something playing with high boost and knock retard.
I havent mixed anything in my tank since April this year. Ran 7.55 at 93.3 with a 1.80 on drag radials in the heat mid June..Sunshine Dragway. Pure 93
Out of experimentation I decided to run straight race gas and the car with the low timing chip wasnt happy..I then ran a high timing chip..at the same boost level as I run with alcohol..was worse..Finally dropped boost down three PSI and the race gas worked..but alky didnt/wasnt taking the edge out of the detonation.
See if your intake air temps go to 170+ degrees..its very hot and will ping with whatever gas you use. Hence why I can run those air temps..cuase the alky cools the charge down big time...in this particular case alcohol works better than racegas...
And the 170 was on a 70 degree day. I dunno..i'm kinda getting stuck in my ways. Wont go back to race gas unless the car becomes a 100 percent track car. You risk popping something playing with high boost and knock retard.
I havent mixed anything in my tank since April this year. Ran 7.55 at 93.3 with a 1.80 on drag radials in the heat mid June..Sunshine Dragway. Pure 93
Looking at it as an octane only issue..no..since alcohol is a little different. But the cooling effects of alcohol cant be touched by racegas.
I dunno... I hate trying to retune my car after its working rite..if it requires work no-one is lazier than me .. if it aint broke..dont fix it.
makes ya think..116 is hard to burn..alky is easy to burn..but 116's benefit is the timing needed to burn it...
I dunno... I hate trying to retune my car after its working rite..if it requires work no-one is lazier than me
.. if it aint broke..dont fix it.makes ya think..116 is hard to burn..alky is easy to burn..but 116's benefit is the timing needed to burn it...
That's it Razor, that's what I was thinking. I want to get my car in the 7s in the 1/8th and the next time out I thought about putting in my chip with high timing, running race gas, and turning the alky kit off. Though, I ran the car @22lbs boost w/ alky and 93 and there isn't a knock problem, but when I put in the race chip with high timing there is a problem of course. I was wondering if I could run that kind of timing (unknown on chip) and that boost? I guess there is only one way to find out eh?
James
James
salvageV6
Daily Driver
- Joined
- May 25, 2001
- Messages
- 20,965
You might want to try some Sunoco GT100 unleaded before going to all out race gas.
Keep the alky. on high and use the race chip and test.
Might work out well.
I use a bit of it with my 94 at the track and can bump the timing up a bit with the translator if need be.
Keep the alky. on high and use the race chip and test.
Might work out well.
I use a bit of it with my 94 at the track and can bump the timing up a bit with the translator if need be.
Your better off running higher boost than higher timing...there is more power to be made on boost than timing. Stock head gaskets if "YOU DONT DETONATE" are good to probably 30 PSI..if you detonate/..they'll pop at 16.
I bet if you left the street chip and upped the boost, you would see your 7's assumming traction. If its not knocking..keep the pedal to the wood.
Higher timing chips have a higher tendency to detonate...which is counterproductive. run 23-24 PSI and watch your knock guage..if zero..you know the answer..
Play with fuel pressure , increase the alky volume, watch your KR and O2's.. get that car into the 760-770 zone on zero KR at 23-24 PSI I will bet a dozen donuts it will dip into the 7's no pronlem with a decent 60 foot. Not great..decent 60 foot.
Lastly, dont run your car with chips of unknown origins..its a recipe for disaster...what I mean by origins..what timing, injector constant, etc.. dont assumme
The Xylene cant hurt..
HTH
Julio
I bet if you left the street chip and upped the boost, you would see your 7's assumming traction. If its not knocking..keep the pedal to the wood.
Higher timing chips have a higher tendency to detonate...which is counterproductive. run 23-24 PSI and watch your knock guage..if zero..you know the answer..
Play with fuel pressure , increase the alky volume, watch your KR and O2's.. get that car into the 760-770 zone on zero KR at 23-24 PSI I will bet a dozen donuts it will dip into the 7's no pronlem with a decent 60 foot. Not great..decent 60 foot.
Lastly, dont run your car with chips of unknown origins..its a recipe for disaster...what I mean by origins..what timing, injector constant, etc.. dont assumme
The Xylene cant hurt..
HTH
Julio
Razor,
Thanks for the advice. I really need to sit down with someone and discuss tuning issues with these cars. The chip is for 40# injectors.... that I know... but I have no clue about the timing. It came from a TB.comer's car in Jacksonville that recently sold the car to a buddy here in Milton, FL. Will a stock turbo be okay at 23-24 lbs or is that out of the efficency range?
Thanks,
James
Thanks for the advice. I really need to sit down with someone and discuss tuning issues with these cars. The chip is for 40# injectors.... that I know... but I have no clue about the timing. It came from a TB.comer's car in Jacksonville that recently sold the car to a buddy here in Milton, FL. Will a stock turbo be okay at 23-24 lbs or is that out of the efficency range?
Thanks,
James
James,
I would run my stocker 23-24 on 1st and 2nd and pull it down to 21 in high gear. My times were in the 12.1-12.3 range very consistently. I did get a 12.08 once. I have heard some using a bleeder and getting the boost on third up 1-2 PSI and those cars went into the 11's on a stocker.
If you want , I can read the chip for you and tell you whats up on it. It will require you mail it to me
No charge except for mailing it back..usually a buck in a padded envelope.
Yes on the heat generated..but thats the beauty of alcohol..it seems to stretch things..
Julio
I would run my stocker 23-24 on 1st and 2nd and pull it down to 21 in high gear. My times were in the 12.1-12.3 range very consistently. I did get a 12.08 once. I have heard some using a bleeder and getting the boost on third up 1-2 PSI and those cars went into the 11's on a stocker.
If you want , I can read the chip for you and tell you whats up on it. It will require you mail it to me
No charge except for mailing it back..usually a buck in a padded envelope.
Yes on the heat generated..but thats the beauty of alcohol..it seems to stretch things..
Julio
Razor,
>>See if your intake air temps go to 170+ degrees..its very hot and will ping with whatever gas you use. Hence why I can run those air temps..cuase the alky cools the charge down big time...in this particular case alcohol works better than racegas...<<
Thats what I find on my car... ie, once the car is well warmed up, I find the temperatures at my IAT sensor is usually around 100 degrees F over ambient, since I have no intercooler. After I spray my water/alky mixture, the IAT usually drops to somewhere around 125 - 135 degrees, which isnt as cool as if I had an intercooler, but nevertheless is a far sight better than if i had nothing.
>>See if your intake air temps go to 170+ degrees..its very hot and will ping with whatever gas you use. Hence why I can run those air temps..cuase the alky cools the charge down big time...in this particular case alcohol works better than racegas...<<
Thats what I find on my car... ie, once the car is well warmed up, I find the temperatures at my IAT sensor is usually around 100 degrees F over ambient, since I have no intercooler. After I spray my water/alky mixture, the IAT usually drops to somewhere around 125 - 135 degrees, which isnt as cool as if I had an intercooler, but nevertheless is a far sight better than if i had nothing.
