Girdle

[postal]

P.S. for the last time....you have 5 more lbs. to go before you are plural...prasad not prasads.

that blow was about as low as "motor number????"

HEHE

 

[TT/Ameasap]

Is there anyone going to try this girdle thing? I may step up to the plate and attempt this. My car is pushing the stock stuff so far now that if I went with a bigger turbo, It would be a ticking time bomb.

I am interested in this conversation and would like to see something happen. I know there are only 1500 of us and a hand full on this board, but girdling the stock motor would mean huge potential for a pretty much stock car.

Bo

 

[Lunkan]

Check out my webpage at www.turbolunkan.com

Well, here´s a direct link http://www.turbolunkan.com/pics(motor).htm

/Andreas

 

[postal]

The stage 1 block I'm putting in my car has 4 billet caps and a girdle. It will probably be a couple months before I try to put the motor in though.

Jason

 

[mark b]

Jason - Interesting... I don't think I've heard of anyone doing a girdle on a stage block before. Not that it can't be done of course. Just curious if you know others that have done it....

 

[postal]

This is a stage 1 block, not a stage 2. Stage one is like the prototype for the stage 2. Stage 1 blocks have some extra beef in them, can be machined for 14 head bolts, but they had 2 bolt iron main caps. The stage 1 block I have has all four main caps replaced with billet ones and also a girdle installed.

The stage 2 block I have has billet 4 bolt caps that are "splayed" which means the outer two bolts on the two middle caps angle outwards. This ties the bottom end of a motor together kind of like a girdle. Plus the front and rear caps are cross bolted which means the outer two bolts actually go through the side of the block. You can see these main cap bolts with the oil pan installed.

Stage 1 blocks are nice because they are off center and are set up for stock style oiling system. They are basically a heavy duty replacement for a stock block.

Jason

 

[trading t/a]

Hey postal you think we can get you to measure the thickness of the main webbing with a caliper. Interested in seeing how thick it is compared to the 109 block and the L67 3800 seies II blocks.

 

[postal]

Hey postal you think we can get you to measure the thickness of the main webbing with a caliper. Interested in seeing how thick it is compared to the 109 block and the L67 3800 seies II blocks.

Sure but I won't have the stage 1 block in my possesion until this weekend. I could also measure the on center stage 2 block I have.

You guys want to here some thing crazy....
One of the best things about a stage 1 block is that you can run all stock or stock style components. I'm going to be putting stage 2 heads on this motor and that is the single biggest pain in the butt, complication adding , hair pulling, custom fabricating nightmare you can get into with a stage motor. Number two is an oiling system. Stage blocks with the exception of stage 1 and early off center stage 2 don't have any provisions for wet sump oiling. I could put an off the shelf high volume front cover on this motor and away I go. People pay good money to try to set up a wet sump oiling system on stage motors. . . ME THE RETARD. . . I'm going to take this no brainer easy to set up oiling system and instead spend money to make it dry sump! K.I.S.S: keep it simple stupid. Appearantly I'm too stupid or too simple to stick to the wisdom in that concept.


Remind me in a week to measure that block.

Jason

 

[Louie L.]

I thought Id bring this back from the dead.

I took a job of swapping a stock motor for a girdled built one for a customer. The motor has JE pistons , Ported Irons, Roller 210 with a TE45a. I also used the HR parts motor mounts and threw in a THDP for good measure.

The problem is that the pan does hit in this TTA. If the stock mounts would have been on the car i would have known for sure as there would be no way that the mount bolts would have lined up.

I started the car and found the TH had plenty of clearance every where. But the pan hits. I had to clearance the pan and gained some space , but not enough in my opinion. A simple boxing mod to the pan would gain a mile of clearance but i dont know if the pan will come off even jacking up the motor.

If i was going to do one to my own car i would mod a stock pan ahead of time.


I guess this teaches me to stay out of TTA's

 

[Razor]

Originally posted by Louie L.
I thought Id bring this back from the dead.

I guess this teaches me to stay out of TTA's

Ok.. so then how did it fit in the one you pulled it out of? Maybe Cal needs to look at it

hehe

BTW, been meaning to call ya.. just been bizzzzy.. i'll try tommorrow..

How bout sum washers? hehe

My buddy Ivan in Illinois made some motor mount brackets for the one he did. And had todo something with the crossover as well.

So that motor finally found a home. Great. Is it your job as well doing the stage in Oscar's car as well?

TTYL

Julio

 

[Louie L.]

Originally posted by Razor
Ok.. so then how did it fit in the one you pulled it out of? Maybe Cal needs to look at it
hehe

BTW, been meaning to call ya.. just been bizzzzy.. i'll try tommorrow..

How bout sum washers? hehe

My buddy Ivan in Illinois made some motor mount brackets for the one he did. And had todo something with the crossover as well.

So that motor finally found a home. Great. Is it your job as well doing the stage in Oscar's car as well?

TTYL

Julio

As a matter of fact he will be looking at it tommorow.!!!
I think the both of yous must be playing a joke on me...

We did explore the metal spacer theory.... that may be the only way to get this right.

Yes this motor found its home. Its a nice one but this pan issue really brings me down...

No i was not contracted out to do Oscars install. This is my last one unless I buy my own TTA.

Nah just kidding ... I kinda find the engine swap slightly easier than a Buick.

Sorry I missed you call. Ive been putting some major hours trying to get this car and my own Stage 2 money pit done before the Nats.

 

[mojilla]

Would a tubular k-member give more room for oil pan clearnce. I was thinking about a girdled motor but if it is that tight it would not be worth it.

 

[89ICBM]

Originally posted by trading t/a

Hey postal you think we can get you to measure the thickness of the main webbing with a caliper. Interested in seeing how thick it is compared to the 109 block and the L67 3800 seies II blocks.


Hi Trading,

I got the measurements from my stage 1 block, a 109 and a SG1 109 block. The main bearing webbing on my stage 1 block is 1" (one inch thick). The 109 and SG1 109 is 1/8" (one eigth (0.125") of an inch thick). Major difference but, that's not the only area that is stronger on the stage block. The rear main has extra webing externally in the bell housing area. If you want to see some pics of these blocks go to
http://www.gnttype.org/techarea/pictureguides/blocks/blockguide.html

 

[89ICBM]

Originally posted by postal

The stage 1 block I'm putting in my car has 4 billet caps and a girdle. It will probably be a couple months before I try to put the motor in though.

Jason



Jason,

Why would anyone girdle a stage 1 block? I really can't see doing a stage 2 build up for a street/strip car, to me, that would be
strictly for professional racing but putting a girdle on a block that will support around 1500 hp already just doesn't make any sense to me. No flame intended here, I'm just trying to understand the point. By thu way, I have all 4 billet steel bearing caps on my stage 1 block along with an Eagle crank and Carrillo rods. I think I've lost my mind! This hot rod has become an obsession! Take me to a bar room driver!

 

[Hi-psi]

Ok, so this is "return of the living dead" thread....

Anyone ever come to any resolution on the easiest/best way of running a girdle in a TTA?

- Poly mounts?

- Clearance the pan?

- Notch the crossmember for clearance?

- What about shimming/spacing the stock mounts up a bit?

Interested to hear everyone's experience.

 

[Razor]

Robert, I didnt know you bought another one. Bob had bought yours couple years ago..

I modded my pan. Perfect hood and crossmember clearance using stock motor mounts.

Many ways to skin a cat I guess.. they all get you to the same place.

 

[Hi-psi]

Robert, I didnt know you bought another one. Bob had bought yours couple years ago..

I modded my pan. Perfect hood and crossmember clearance using stock motor mounts.

Many ways to skin a cat I guess.. they all get you to the same place.

I didn't buy another TTA. Same old number 799 I've always had. You're probably thinking of my longtime buddy Mike (MisterGN10). He had #1399 which was taken out by a deer, then bought another one a bit later, which is the one that was sold to Bob. I believe that car ended up somewhere out in Cali?

I got burnt out on the whole gearhead thing for a while, and had a lot going on in my life to take my time & resources in a different direction. Now I'm ready to get back to my roots.

I'll be working towards dropping the motor back into mine soon and I'm bouncing the whole caps vs girdle thing around trying to decide...

 

[Razor]

Yup.. that one was the one Benny had. Bob sold it to a guy named Larry. Larry then sold it to someone in Cali.. it then snapped the crank.

Girdle is easy.. but the 4.1 takes a special one. The pan mod is a piece of cake. Probably less headache then any of the other mods... and the line bore issue with caps.. good luck.

The crossover will need to be modded as well with the girdle. Ivan Antich in Illinois did mine.

Good luck.. lets see some new numbers.. maybe a showing at Reynolds latter this year.. i'll bring my game face..

 

[Bobtempest]

The crossover will need to be modded as well with the girdle. Ivan Antich in Illinois did mine.

So the crossover needs to be moddified along with the pan?

Thanks,
Rob H

 

[Razor]

I know some guys say no.. but with the modded crossover it barely clears. I cant see how it would work without. The GN crossover is different.

What was added was 1 inch spacer on both sides rite below the flanges. Two inches down from the flange, pipe was cut.. and a section of SS was added.