How can I improve my 60 foot?

[Justa231]

I'm getting horrible 60 foot times. I have M&H Racemasters with 11 lbs of air in them.
I have upper and lower control arms, pinion snub and a passengers side air bag.
My 60 foots are 2.2 or 2.3.
What am I doing wrong?
Any suggestions are appreciated.
I'm leaving the line with no boost - 4 lbs of boost with no difference.

Thanks
Nick

 

[azgn]

are you spinning the tires? What are you 1/4 mile speeds?

 

[KEVINS]

You need to leave with boost. Boost is horsepower. The more horsepower you have on the line the harder it is going to accelerate. Unless you are spinning..

ks

 

[Super6]

me too

I have southside lift bars,bfg dr's and everything else is stock. Best i have done is 1.90 60 ft's. I think my brakes have something to do with it. can't hold but 2 psi boost at the line before the tires start to turn over. I am stuck between a wolfe sway bar setup or air bags. can't decide I have heard that the wolfe sway bar setup keeps the front tires on the ground but i think i want to lift the fronts tires I like to show off

 

[Justa231]

azgn,

My 1/4 mile speed is 104 and my time is 13.1.
Just got a new set up and trying to get used to it.
I don't believe that I'm spinning the tires.

 

[WICKED TURBO T]

hey nick, try putting more air in the tires. i get 1.8 60' with no airbags at all. i have stock springs, 8 cyl springs in front, pinion snubber & thats it. i left with 18 lbs in both rear tires on that 1.8 60'

 

[azgn]

well, if you are not spinning the tires, try leaving with more boost........you need to power brake the car...stand on the brake and hit the throttle until it feels like the tires will spin and let the brake go.....if you can get traction, your 60' times will get better...listen to the guys that use the brakes to launch...I am spoiled because I use a trans brake

 

[QuickSixx]

Hey Nick, Sounds like you need to do some brake work so you can leave with more boost. Get some new shoes for the back (some guys buy two sets and use the 4 biggest) also s-10 wheel cyl. will help out. Hope this helps. Good luck

 

[WhoNds8]

I would say to start that you may want a little more air pressure in the tires than 11 psi, that seems very low......I would almost say you shouldn't need to go under 18-20 psi on your tires or really any tire...that would probably give you the most amount of contact surface (tire to surface). I will also agree that you are probably due for some upgraded rear brakes, I had mine done and man what a difference! I held 15psi of boost on the line but the tires didn't appreciate that and spun like mad. My car only has rear seat braces in it and is absolutley 100% stock suspension and I've cut several mid 1.7's. And KEVINS says it all "Boost is horsepower" the more you can leave with and keep it glued to the track the faster you will go.

 

[Justa231]

Thanks for all the comments, but it appears that the solution to my problem is to launch with boost.
I'm a bit weary about this. I had my motor rebuilt due to a bad thrust bearing. I was told that the thrust bearing went bad due to the fact that I was sitting on the line building boost and heated up my stock converter. I was told that a heated converter expands and that's what damaged my thrust bearing.
Is this true?
If yes, I don't want to do that again and that's why I decided to start off with no boost.
Are the majority of the racers launching with boost?
I know that I can sit at the light and build boost, therefore, my brakes are not the problem, but its something that I was trying to avoid.
It appears that if that's the only solution, I may have look into a transbrake.
Still looking for a solution.

Nick

 

[KEVINS]

Power braking causes the torque converter to balloon which pushes the converter into the tranny. When it starts rubbing on the tranny pump, it would push the crank inward. But I can't see it causing that much dammage considering how much it has to balloon, but I am no expert on converter designs. That's why good converters come with anti-ballooning plates.

You will have to leave with some boost to get good 60' times or use a stall converter and just FLASH the converter, which still balloons, but maybe not as much.

A T-brake makes it even worse!

I launch with 15psi. Am I worried about it? NOPE..

We need an expert to give us some more info, but I don't see how your going to launch without some boost...

KS

 

[TurboJim]

As we of the JCC Racing crew say....

"Drive it like you HATE it"

 

[WhoNds8]

A good investment to have would be a trans cooler as well if you do not already have one...that will help keep the temp down a little bit in the trans. I will give you an example on how I approach the starting line. First I'll just get the tires wet in the burnout box and then throw it in low gear and apply the line lock. Next I proceed to spin it up until I see a little smoke off the tires then I shift to 2nd (which I am probably at 3/4 throttle through all of this) then to 3rd and I let off the line lock and start to roll out, BUT I only let it roll 5-6ft before I let up totally on the gas and then roll up to the line(this whole process should take about 10-15 seconds) If the other person is already staged then I will pull in and stage then mash the brake hard to the floor and begin building boost. By all means don't pull up and start flooring it trying to build boost while the other person isn't even staged or anything, more than likely you'll kill a tranny quick that way. Heat is definately a transmissions worst enemy.....this is obviously just an example and some may disagree and some may not, but it has netted for some decent 60 ft's.

 

[azgn]

you should be able to build enough boost for a decent launch AFTER both cars are staged...that means you are on the gas for 1.5 secs or less.......shouldn't hurt a thing....if that is not the case, you need a higher stall converter...it is bad news to sit there at the line building/holding boost for more than a sec or so.....stuff will break!

you will not run any decent 1/4 mile times launching without boost unless you have a Stage motor.......or something that makes 700 hp +

 

[Buicksx2]

Originally posted by TurboJim
As we of the JCC Racing crew say....

"Drive it like you HATE it"

>>> No truer words were spoken Jim. Nick the guys are right you are gonna have to leave with some boost to get the 60's down. I appreciate your concern about the thrust bearing but take this for what it's worth. I got about 60,000 miles and 300-350 passes on my stock trans and convertor over an 8-9 year period before my thrust bearing/crank moving/ my 1st engine rebuild as a result....lol.

So if you get only half as lucky as I got and get abput 150 plus runs in before the thrust bearing goes you should be fine....lol.

Let me know about saturday maybe we can work on those 60's.

Talk to you soon.

 

[Justa231]

Ha Ha JCC Racing club. I have a sticker now. lol.

I got the hint. I will build boost before I launch.
Rich, you are telling me to do this, right???? : ) (just in case anything brakes) lol.

Saturday is not going to work for me.

Hopefully we can get together before the track closes.

I'm going to do some tunning hopefully tonight.

I'm going to increase the boost and if I'm not happy, I'm going to try Jim's racing chip.

Hey, Jim? I taped my first run on Tlink and wanted to send it to you. The problem is, I have no idea how to do it. Maybe you can email me directions?

Nick

 

[HRpartsNstuff]

If running your best time and not heating up the trans are both more important than winning the race, then this is what I would do:

Leave your car idling while both cars stage. Wait until the tree gets activated, then start mashing down the gas. That will cause the least heat & won't make you stick around unexpectedly.

Also, you will get a quick idea where your car starts to "level off" with the boost on the line. Don't hold it there, Let it rip! You don't want to hold it at a certain boost level. Let's say it boosts up to 8# fairly easily, but it takes a long time to build any more boost than that. Then when you launch, start mashing the gas and let it rip just before 8#. This would be as the boost & rpm are still climbing. This will always be better than letting it level off or holding it at a certain #.

I also agree that 11# is not enough. I would try to stay above 13# with them, and more like 16# would probably work well too. It will be more stable at high speeds too with more press. I assume they are 26" too. If you have 28" tires, that will slow your 60ft at your level. And you didn't say what press was in your airbag. Unless you have tire/body interference, you shouldn't need much press in the bag until you get below 1.7's. I wouldn't go over 8# for now. If you are too rich on the fuel curve, that will make it harder to build boost also. Hope that helps out. Remember, a tenth in the 60ft is almost 2 tenths in the 1/4 mile

 

[TurboJim]

Originally posted by Justa231

Hey, Jim? I taped my first run on Tlink and wanted to send it to you. The problem is, I have no idea how to do it. Maybe you can email me directions?

Nick

Just attach the saved "ECM" file and hit send

 

[Two Lane]

Always a great topic!

 

[Chuck Leeper]

My $.02 worrth..

First! lose the snubber! All it does is upset the action of the suspension.. It was put there so you could haul your 300# mother-in-law around!!

Next, follow the suggestions already posted, regarding brakes, boost levels and rich/lean tuning....
I agree w/ the tire press comments. I did alot of tests for M/t and found the suggestions of the 14 to 16# range worked best w/ the 26" tires.
Next is the burnout.. If the car does not have a line-loc, get one. Holding the car in the burnout with the brake pedal, overheats the rear brakes and then they won't hold on the start line..
The tires need to be 10 to 20* hotter than the track surface.[Per Jerry Francis of MT] anything more only cooks the oils out of the rubber and shortens tire life.
I always drive around the water and then back in.. I see no reason to drag water out in ft of the burnout area and then run the slicks thru it after the burnout is completed.
Ft sway bar needs to be unhooked for this exercize.. Max wt transfer is necessary.
Video tape the leave and see if tire spin is occurring.. Go from there...

Back under my rock...