Introduction and question

[cooperSG]

Howdy, names Cooper, and if all goes well i will soon be the owner of a 1985 Buick Regal T-type. I would like to start by saying ive never owned any GM vehicle and know virtually nothing about turbo Buicks. That being said, im no greenhorn when it comes to cars. I can turn a wrench as good as anyone, but i fear im jumping in a little over my head with this car.

So first of all, if there is a "Newbs look here first!" thread, could someone point it out? i looked for one but didnt see it. This forum layout is a little different than what im used to.

Now, about the car. Has 125,000 miles. Body on it is very strait, it has had a repaint but it looks like they did a great job on the body work and there is zero rust to be found anywhere, other than some very minimal surface rust around the bottom of the doors and the trunk lid edges. According to the owner, the car has a 1987 Grand National computer, as apposed to the stock '85 T-type compy. It also looks as though the motor has been out of the car before because they did a fairly sloppy job of rerouting the wiring and werent very meticulous when it came to keeping the engine bay clean. The car also has an aftermarket boost gauge that reads 9psi at WOT, which im assuming is more than what the car made from the factory.

I guess my main questions are:
1: are there some particular things i should be looking for that could be problematic in the future, that are specific to these cars?
2: When i get the car, what kind of preventative maintenance should i look into? other than the typical oil change, tranny fluid change, coolant flush, etc.
3: this car is Mass Air, did it come that way? or did they convert it from speed density when they put the '87 computer in?

thanks in advance for any knowledge yal deem me worthy of.

 

[OvaBoost]

This is a good site to do some reading: http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/

Also, check out the Hot Air forum on this board: http://turbobuick.com/forums/forums/hot-air-non-intercooled-tech.9/

Good luck!

 

[OvaBoost]

One more: http://www.gnttype.org/resources.html

 

[cooperSG]

Thanks for the quick response. My previous assumption has been confirmed, im probably in over my head lol. Ive spent the last couple years in the world of Gen 1 Ford lightnings, which require a vast knowledge base to operate consistently, and it has taken me this long to learn half of what there is to know about them. It would seem that im about to start the same adventure all over again, but ive done some cruising around the site and it looks like this is the place to bone up on all things turbo buick.

 

[highboostgn]

87 computer? does it have the 87 engine too?

 

[Rafs-T-Type]

I guess my main questions are:
1: are there some particular things i should be looking for that could be problematic in the future, that are specific to these cars?
2: When i get the car, what kind of preventative maintenance should i look into? other than the typical oil change, tranny fluid change, coolant flush, etc.
3: this car is Mass Air, did it come that way? or did they convert it from speed density when they put the '87 computer in?

thanks in advance for any knowledge yal deem me worthy of.

1. Every car will have a different set of problems. Some more common ones are the fuel pump going weak/dying (you should get a new one and hot-wire it), MAF going out, cam sensor, exhaust leaks, and other things being out of spec such as TPS. You should get some sort of scantool. I am not sure what works with the hot air cars. Is your car still a hot air or did they change the engine to an intercooled one? Also if the bushings in you car are original they are due for replacement.

2. Preventive maintenance should include a spring cleaning http://www.gnttype.org/maint/basics.html. Also you should get some sort of knock gauge. If you detonate the engine you could cause some serious damage to the engine. Like enough to break the crank and block. You shouldn't have any at 9 PSI (stock for intercooled cars is 13-15 PSI, not sure on hot air cars), however that's assuming your aftermarket gauge is accurate.

3. Yes the cars came with Mass Air.

Lastly you may want to try your questions in the before black section(http://turbobuick.com/forums/forums/hot-air-non-intercooled-tech.9/). That section is dedicated to hot air cars and you will probably get more/better answers to any questions you have. Also you may want to have someone who lives close to you come check it out and they may be able to point out things that may become problematic in the future. It was hard for me when I started to reach out for help from other members in person, but I sure am glad I did now. It really is a great community with a lot of people willing to lend a hand for the price of a hamburger and a six pack. Try reaching out to the people in your region.

Best of luck - Jason

 

[highboostgn]

A wise long time GN owner once told me this when considering getting a GN. "Donnie, do you know why they call them Grand Nationals?" No..."because every part cost a Grand".... lol I came to find this as moslty true

 

[lightningdan]

Hey buddy, u look familiar!! Welcome to the site, like others have stated vortex site is awesome I have spent countless hours reading and re reading that site

These guys here are just like out fellow lightning brothers, very knowledgable and always willing to help. I haven't done much posting yet but have been doing allot of back searches

Being in the truck scene for so long I can't Believe how cheap is it to get a GN into the high 10s!!

Welcome aboard!

 

[cooperSG]

it is still a hot air car, so it would appear that the only thing from the '87 is the computer. i will take a look at the sections mentioned, like i said, still trying to get my bearings around here.

Being in the truck scene for so long I can't Believe how cheap is it to get a GN into the high 10s!!

Welcome aboard!

what do you know, another lightning guy on a GM forum lol, small world. It is kindof a slap in the face to see how easy it is to make these cars go fast after struggling to get my Lightning into the 14's lol.

 

[lightningdan]

it is still a hot air car, so it would appear that the only thing from the '87 is the computer. i will take a look at the sections mentioned, like i said, still trying to get my bearings around here.

what do you know, another lightning guy on a GM forum lol, small world. It is kindof a slap in the face to see how easy it is to make these cars go fast after struggling to get my Lightning into the 14's lol.

Can u believe the little bolt ons it takes to get a gn into the 11s!! Wish it was that cheap and easy on the lightnings!! Did u read this site yet? http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/ it's full of knowledge and allot of my questions were asked by reading!

 

[cooperSG]

Can u believe the little bolt ons it takes to get a gn into the 11s!! Wish it was that cheap and easy on the lightnings!! Did u read this site yet? http://www.vortexbuicks-etc.com/ it's full of knowledge and allot of my questions were asked by reading!

well, from what i read, it seems that the "hot air" cars take a little more work to get fast, but it is still crazy how easy it is. I did do alot of reading on that site yesterday (about three hours of it) and DAMN theres alot of info.

 

[lightningdan]

and DAMN theres alot of info.

i know i freck'n love it, i wonder how hard it is to convert over to the 86-87 intercooler setup?

 

[3-5.0]

Now, about the car. Has 125,000 miles. Body on it is very strait, it has had a repaint but it looks like they did a great job on the body work and there is zero rust to be found anywhere, other than some very minimal surface rust around the bottom of the doors and the trunk lid edges.

they did a fairly sloppy job of rerouting the wiring and werent very meticulous when it came to keeping the engine bay clean.

1: are there some particular things i should be looking for that could be problematic in the future, that are specific to these cars?

Fine.Tooth.Comb.

I myself would probably put a different engine in there, and save the 3.8 on a stand in the corner of my garage. Unless you like tinkering/originality.

 

[cooperSG]

I myself would probably put a different engine in there, and save the 3.8 on a stand in the corner of my garage. Unless you like tinkering/originality.

why is that?

 

[3-5.0]

why is that?

Reliability,cost. Not that these engines can't be reliable...but I dunno,maybe I've been spending too much time reading everyones problems. I'd rather drop a fuel inj crate engine in there and sleep better at night...err while cruising too.

 

[cooperSG]

Reliability,cost. Not that these engines can't be reliable...but I dunno,maybe I've been spending too much time reading everyones problems. I'd rather drop a fuel inj crate engine in there and sleep better at night...err while cruising too.

i would agree that ive seen some horror stories, but do you have any first hand experience? not questioning the merits of your opinion, because one of the first things i thought of doing was a sbc swap, but ide like to keep the 3.8 for as long as possible for originality purposes and because i like the sound the turbo makes lol.

 

[Jerryl]

. . . . . one of the first things i thought of doing was a sbc swap, . . . . .

Are you trying to slow the car down?
If you are going to swap the V6, swap to an LS and leave the SB alone . . . LOL

Seriously . . . read the stiky in the HA section.
Welcome and good luck.

 

[3-5.0]

i would agree that ive seen some horror stories, but do you have any first hand experience? not questioning the merits of your opinion, because one of the first things i thought of doing was a sbc swap, but ide like to keep the 3.8 for as long as possible for originality purposes and because i like the sound the turbo makes lol.

I may be just a tad wee bit bitter lol...its mostly unfounded and a little bit kinda pokin' fun. I have a super low mile car and dropped a pretty penny on it,and the things gonna nickel n dime me. I thought I'd do an oil change-apparently only a certain oil filter is acceptable-oh and then I had to order some ZDDP. $50 for oil and filter and some antifreeze to top off,$50 for 5 bottles of ZDDP cause I don't want to order it again.

Then the engine light came on,had to check everything and it looks like the coil pack,jeez which one to buy? $$ok I'll take 2 because the burn out semi regularily. I'm not even certain it is that and maybe the module went too,those things are expensive. Or could be the computer or chip-I'll see soon. Damn need to get a Scan Master they're like $300 bucks. Also apparently low voltage causes coil packs to burn out so I need a new battery -$100...and a rewired ground or something cause they are not adequate from the factory.

You should also change the valve springs(weak),possibly the timing chain,spark plugs,wires(age),fuel pump and hot wire,MAF cause IT WILL GO and a factory replacement is difficult if not uneconomical...hmmm what else?...oh yeah just change the whole motor while your in there because squeezing HP out of a hot air car is...50/50.

Oh the brakes should be changed on my car because thats all I'd think about when driving-the dreaded light and coasting into traffic. I haven't even driven my car yet I don't even want to go look at the thing,25k sitting in my garage WHAAA,I know its my fault I just don't have the energy to tinker and its going to cost me a couple grand to get this thing to where I'm somewhat in a piece of mind state driving,it pisses me off. You asked lol. Ahhh cathartic.

 

[GullsGN]

I may be just a tad wee bit bitter lol...its mostly unfounded and a little bit kinda pokin' fun. I have a super low mile car and dropped a pretty penny on it,and the things gonna nickel n dime me. I thought I'd do an oil change-apparently only a certain oil filter is acceptable-oh and then I had to order some ZDDP. $50 for oil and filter and some antifreeze to top off,$50 for 5 bottles of ZDDP cause I don't want to order it again.

Then the engine light came on,had to check everything and it looks like the coil pack,jeez which one to buy? $$ok I'll take 2 because the burn out semi regularily. I'm not even certain it is that and maybe the module went too,those things are expensive. Or could be the computer or chip-I'll see soon. Damn need to get a Scan Master they're like $300 bucks. Also apparently low voltage causes coil packs to burn out so I need a new battery -$100...and a rewired ground or something cause they are not adequate from the factory.

You should also change the valve springs(weak),possibly the timing chain,spark plugs,wires(age),fuel pump and hot wire,MAF cause IT WILL GO and a factory replacement is difficult if not uneconomical...hmmm what else?...oh yeah just change the whole motor while your in there because squeezing HP out of a hot air car is...50/50.

Oh the brakes should be changed on my car because thats all I'd think about when driving-the dreaded light and coasting into traffic. I haven't even driven my car yet I don't even want to go look at the thing,25k sitting in my garage WHAAA,I know its my fault I just don't have the energy to tinker and its going to cost me a couple grand to get this thing to where I'm somewhat in a piece of mind state driving,it pisses me off. You asked lol. Ahhh cathartic.

And , then, there is the other side. Mine is a well maintained beauty that I have driven every day for 8 months a year since I bought it new in 1987. 145,000 miles of pure enjoyment. The only things that have failed and HAD to be replaced is the stock turbo at 75k, the accumulator ball at 100k, and the radiator at 125k. The rest of the tweaks or parts replacement were for horsepower or upkeep like valve springs and timing chain. Remember, you are driving a 25+ year car. If these were not maintained during it's life then you will have to do it. The car is probably an alchy kit or a good tune with slicks away from 11's. Mine is at the other end of the spectrum. You will probably fall somewhere in the middle. I consider these cars easy to work on and a whole lotta fun!

 

[3-5.0]

And , then, there is the other side. Mine is a well maintained beauty that I have driven every day for 8 months a year since I bought it new in 1987. 145,000 miles of pure enjoyment. The only things that have failed and HAD to be replaced is the stock turbo at 75k, the accumulator ball at 100k, and the radiator at 125k. The rest of the tweaks or parts replacement were for horsepower or upkeep like valve springs and timing chain. Remember, you are driving a 25+ year car. If these were not maintained during it's life then you will have to do it. The car is probably an alchy kit or a good tune with slicks away from 11's. Mine is at the other end of the spectrum. You will probably fall somewhere in the middle. I consider these cars easy to work on and a whole lotta fun!

Sounds great man,exactly what I want my car to be like.A reliable cruiser and I'm trying to approach it like that. But I'm starting from point A and its Keeeling meee. Naw I know I just need to get over this minor hump and keep a positive attitude.