Need advice on my system. HELP!

[Black Box]

OK Guys I need some help. I bet you audiophiles may get a good laugh at this but I need some advice. 2 years ago I put a system in the GN, using the product advice from Crutchfield and Circuit City, but a stupid mistake resulted in a blown amp. I’ve since had it repaired, and want to put the entire system back in the car. Here’s what I have; (CC means I got the components at Circuit City; CR means I got them at Crutchfield):
CR Kenwood KDC-217 head unit, 45Wx4
CR Kenwood KFC-6908 4-way 6x9 read deck speakers, 220W max, 55W RMS
CR Kenwood KFC-1368S 2-way 5 ¼” door speakers, 110W max, 28W RMS
CC Infinity Reference 3012cf 2-way 3 ½” door speakers, 90W max, 25W RMS
CC MTX Thunder 4122 Amp, details: http://www.epinions.com/614165_Kenwood_30W_x_2_Thunder_4122/display_~full_specs
CC MTX Thunder 8302 Amp, details: http://www.epinions.com/614193_MTX_Audio_75W_x_2_Thunder_8302/display_~full_specs
CC Infinity Reference 1020w subs (2), details: http://www.epinions.com/Infinity_10__Subwoofer_1020W__Subwoofers_REF1020W/display_~full_specs
CC Q-Logic sealed enclosure

I have all the power wiring, amp wiring, speaker wire, fuses and such to connect everything together. My only question is, how should I run it? In my opinion, when I had it hooked up originally, it didn’t sound anywhere near as good as I expected. I tried adjusting the settings on the amps, but I just couldn’t get it to sound that great. I’m thinking I did something wrong (installation), or this stuff just doesn’t match up and work well together. Keep in mind that I’m not looking for symphony-hall sound, but I’d like it to sound better than the stock 6-speaker system in my Grand Prix, which it didn’t.

So, my question to you guys is, how would you hook this up to sound the best with the equipment I have? I had the dash and door speakers running off the head unit, the 6x9’s running off the 4122, and the subs running off the 8302. Is this a good setup, or should I hook it up differently? Do I have enough amp to run the subs? What pieces would you recommend adding to improve the performance? Caps? Bass blockers? Or, in the worst case, another amp? Do I have something I can work with here, or is this just a horribly mismatched pile of parts?

Would appreciate your help!
Steve

 

[grocerygetter]

ditch the 3.5 and 5.35s. Buy a 5.25 and tweet component set. put the tweets in the 3.5 location. Put your two channel amp on your front stage. the 6x9s are rear fill. They should never pull your ears to the back of your car. put a baffle under the 6x9s to keep bass from distorting them.
crossovers....
set the sub lowpass at 75hz or less...maybe even 55 if it were me.
buy caps for the 6x9s to play 150 hz and up.
set the hp crossover on the front stage amp as low as the 5s will let you. Most sets will break up if set below 75hz..unless really high end.
setting the head unit..
leave the bass no more than +1. Never max out the treble. Add on a subvolume for your subamp unless the amp came with one...thats where you will get your bass output...not the bass adjustment on the deck.

 

[SGRIM]

grocerygetter me and you could hook up one h*ll of a system! I agree with everything you said. I would not have even though about the baffle under the 6x9's!
Few more things to think about!
Are you running your subs 2 or 4ohm? If you bridge down to 2ohms that MTX will give those subs all they can handle and then some!
Make sure your power wire is capable of handling the load it needs to carry. Make sure you have a GOOD GROUND!
A small capacititor wound not hurt either!
If want to keep 3.5's in dash could use suggested componet set and put tweets in corners of windshield aimed at the center or put them in the doors! They even do good on the rear view mirror facing the windshield!
Far as adjusting the tune on other suggestion I could add is to keep your gain on your amps as far down as possible!

 

[Black Box]

Thanks for the replies gentlemen!

I didn't think that MTX 8302 had enough power to run both of those subs, I thought I didn't have enough wattage (of course, I was told this by a CC salesman! ) I was running the subs 2ohm, but had mistakenly had them facing towards the front of the car (enclosure was positioned right behind the rear seat). But I'll point them towards the back of the car this time.

So you guys are saying run the front speakers off the 4122 amp, and run the 6x9's right off the deck, but with caps installed? What size caps? I do currently have foam baffles on the speakers.

The other problem I may have is that the head unit only has one set of amp outputs....can I runn the amps parallel (i.e. head unit outputs to 4122 amp, then 4122 outputs into the 8302, then adjust the bypass on the 4122? Or should I just spring for a new deck with more outputs?

Time to invest in a component set for the front.

Thanks again guys.
Steve

 

[SilverSleeper]

Changing the way the box faces with just make it sound different. When you aim the subs to the rear, you will get more low freq response, but at the sacrifice of some definition. Plus, you will also rattle the crap outta everything back there (trunk lid, license plate, gas tank, etc) so some good sound deadening will be needed.
As for your deck output, how are you running both amps now? Are you using speaker level outs for the second amp? It would definately sound better if you were running all pre-amp outs to your amps.
I am wondering what you found to be wrong with your system yourself? What did you expect from it that you were not getting? If you tell us what is lacking, maybe we can point you in the direction to fix that. Was it lacking bass punch, frequency response across the whole system, bass extension, high frequency definition? Only your ears can decide whats missing. Musical preferences are as individual as a custom car. What one person may hate, another may love about a system.

 

[soundguy]

I agree on ditching the 3.5" . Get yourself a nice 5.25" component system. Put the tweeters in a corner angled to face you. You may also want to look into getting a nice electronic crossover. MTX use to have a nice front/rear/sub crossover for like $40-50. Will make a huge difference on how much power you can pump to the front speakers so the high's match the low end. Filtered good, you can more than triple the power than the speakers are rated for. I've run 200 watts to my front infinity components rated at 70watts for over 10 years. And definitely get a stiffening cap on the sub amp unless you're running digital amps (love those infinity class-D amps) .

 

[Black Box]

Jason,
I was considering facing it backwards because I found the bass to be way too weak. Before I installed the system, I took into consideration the possible rattling issues, so I removed it, lined the edges with 3M 1/4" foam tape and re-installed it. No problems so far, but I haven't realized the potential of the system yet.

I just didn't think it had anywhere near the bass that I thought it would. The highs and mids were "OK" (to my uneducated ear), but the bass was lacking. I usually listen to rock (hard/alternative/industrial), so I like punchy, strong bass.

I was running the 4122 from the deck, then the 8302 out of that with the crossover (on the 4122) set to low pass (as I asked about in my last post). Gain on both amps were always set as low as possible below the distortion level. The speaker outs on the deck were used to power the front speakers. I hooked this all up as the CC salesman suggested when I bought the amps/subs.

I will definitely get the component set for the front. I found this Kenwood KFC-P505ie set on Crutchfield:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-brpGtZh2Sl4/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=76300&I=113KFCP505

As far as caps, what size should I get for the 6x9's? What about the subs? 1 farad? I'm surprised (not doubting anyone's knowledge) that this 8302 150x2 amp will power both these subs, which are rated at 250W RMS, 1000W max. What am I not understanding?

Thanks to everyone for all the help.
Steve

 

[Dean]

Buy a 5.25 and tweet component set.

...Get yourself a nice 5.25" component system.

Sorry to hijack the thread, but what 5.25" component system? I just started searching around today and have only come up with Infinity Kappa 50.7cs. (Other infinity systems looked good too, but I think the woofer is too deep.) I'll continue searching this w/e.

 

[Powder]

I recently installed a cerwin vega 5.25 component set in Q-form kick panels with a much improved sound over Infinity Kappas in the door pods. I also run Infinity reference 3-ways in the rear shelf backed down just for rear fill. With a single 10" sub riding where the original back seat used to be, its not the greatest but beats my Escalade factory system.
When you get your system installed I suggest you find a stereo shop that will tune it for you for a reasonable fee. I just spent the best $40 ever by having a local installer spend about 1 1/2 hours dialing it in and giving me bass and volume I couldn't find. I was ready to buy another amp, change my sub box, whatever and he got rid of a hideous alternator whine that had me stumped also.
Just a suggestion that might save you a lot of time and money.

mlh

 

[daddyed73]

Try the 5.25" component sets from Cadence. I have been selling these for a few years and they sound great. Tthey have like four dif models from 2.25 deep to 2.5" deep check out there web site and you can probubly find a dealer near you.

heres the link:
http://www.cadencestore.com/Product....asp?idCategory=37&prodsort=&page=&ipagesize=

 

[Dean]

Thanks folks. I've been out searching and have actually found MANY non-mainstream systems. So many, in fact, that my heads-a-spinning! I am currently trying to get a set of CSII lowers to open up my options even more, and once those are secured, I'll procede.

Thanks again,

Dean