Never meet your heroes! '86 Grand National

[1986 Buick GX1]

I don't remember, but it's possible that I disconnected the rod to diagnose the 16psi problem. I was initially concerned about the puck arm getting seized in the elbow again. That might have been why it got stuck in the first place, but I know I only adjusted the actuator rod after discovering the stuck puck.

Wild indeed. It's great to know that the exhaust should blow the puck in a more favorable angle though!

I discovered the exhaust puck alignment solution after trying to build up enough boost to do the same.
Unfortunately not a good idea in town. Thankfully I pulled over before the officer turned his lights on, he let me off with just a warning.

 

[Jon Early]

Jon, if you'd like to experiment with a remflex gasket I'll send you one if you PM me your mailing addess. Years ago I used it for literally a few minutes then took it off. I have no use for it.
View attachment 399369

Glad you decided to keep her and continue this thread!

Thank you! That's generous, but I have one on the way already. If you don't mind me asking, what prompted you to remove it so quickly?

 

[626gn]

Thank you! That's generous, but I have one on the way already. If you don't mind me asking, what prompted you to remove it so quickly?

With my old motor, on E85, I had a very small condensation leak at the turbo to downpipe connection, due to my exhaust housing being slightly pitted. We're talking just a drop of water at start up, but my OCD hated it. I put a remflex gasket there and it did help with the condensation leak but it caused the wastegate puck to not seat flush on the turbo housing, resulting in slow boost, so I removed it after the first test drive.

 

[Jon Early]

With my old motor, on E85, I had a very small condensation leak at the turbo to downpipe connection, due to my exhaust housing being slightly pitted. We're talking just a drop of water at start up, but my OCD hated it. I put a remflex gasket there and it did help with the condensation leak but it caused the wastegate puck to not seat flush on the turbo housing, resulting in slow boost, so I removed it after the first test drive.

Ahhhhh good to know. That all would bug the hell out of me too. My turbo housing is pitted too, so I worry about having any sort of gasket there. Hopefully everything just works as-is during my test drive this evening and I'll only have to throw those parts in the trunk for Nats. I'm feeling more hopeful after what 1986 Buick GX1 was saying about his puck.

 

[Jon Early]

Just got back from a couple test drives. The car went back to making 16 psi on the first ride which I guess is better than 0. I just don't know why it isn't making the full 23.

I then yanked the vacuum hose elbow to the solenoid and put a cap on it. The actuator plumbed straight to the turbo made 12 psi as I expected, so the solenoid must be doing something.

I'm at a loss. I'm going to test the boost solenoid to see what it's commanding. I don't necessarily know what I'll do with that information regardless though.

 

[Jon Early]

I do not quite understand how this solenoid works, but it doesn't seem to be doing what it's supposed to.

With the key on and engine off, I have 12v across the solenoid. I thought that at least that was a good sign. Then I disconnected the wastegate hose and installed my compressed air regulated up to 30 psi and felt nothing come out the other side.

I thought that once again made no sense, so I switched ports.

Suddenly it bleeds. I found that odd because I didn't think that the solenoid was directional.

I continued on with my testing by slowly regulating the air down to below 16 psi. Once I roughly crossed that threshold, the solenoid stopped bleeding pressure.

So what gives? I have 12v on my DVOM at all times so there must be a pulse or something that a can't see? Should I be asking Eric at TT what's up? Is there a better way to test this system or is the fact that it only works one way a sign that the solenoid is going bad?

 

[Jon Early]

I just retested with the key off and it acts exactly the same way.

To summarize, this solenoid bleeds at roughly 16 psi no matter what. I know a manual boost controller would be the answer, but I'd really like to know what's wrong with this thing before I ditch it.

Any help would be appreciated! Thanks!

 

[1986 Buick GX1]

I just retested with the key off and it acts exactly the same way.

To summarize, this solenoid bleeds at roughly 16 psi no matter what. I know a manual boost controller would be the answer, but I'd really like to know what's wrong with this thing before I ditch it.

Any help would be appreciated! Thanks!

Jason has a good description how it works.

Boost Controller

rjcracing.com

 

[Jon Early]

Jason has a good description how it works.

Boost Controller

rjcracing.com

That is a good write up, but it also leaves me with some more questions. I think my chip is basically commanding the max boost that the solenoid can make, so 100% duty cycle? Is it supposed to do that all the time, or are there other inputs that will change the duty cycle?

I made a post on the turbotweak support group. I'm sure Eric will set me straight. Until then I'm thinking about retesting the car with the solenoid line removed. Then I know I'll have the maximum bleed. I assume that this would result in an unlimited amount of boost so I'll have to be very careful with the throttle. It should tell me what I need to know before buying a manual boost controller though.

 

[1986 Buick GX1]

That is a good write up, but it also leaves me with some more questions. I think my chip is basically commanding the max boost that the solenoid can make, so 100% duty cycle? Is it supposed to do that all the time, or are there other inputs that will change the duty cycle?

I made a post on the turbotweak support group. I'm sure Eric will set me straight. Until then I'm thinking about retesting the car with the solenoid line removed. Then I know I'll have the maximum bleed. I assume that this would result in an unlimited amount of boost so I'll have to be very careful with the throttle. It should tell me what I need to know before buying a manual boost controller though.

Amazon has some inexpensive MBC’s.
This one boasts a light weight ceramic ball. Similar to the Hallman pro.
It doesn’t have detent clicks.

Amazon.com

Just a suggestion for mounting.

Bracket.

Mounted to back of turbo.

View from top side.

 

[Jon Early]

T

Amazon has some inexpensive MBC’s.
This one boasts a light weight ceramic ball. Similar to the Hallman pro.
It doesn’t have detent clicks.

Amazon.com

Just a suggestion for mounting.

Bracket.
View attachment 399380

Mounted to back of turbo.
View attachment 399379

View from top side.
View attachment 399378

That is very similar to what I had in mind! That looks good.

 

[V6sleeper]

That is a good write up, but it also leaves me with some more questions. I think my chip is basically commanding the max boost that the solenoid can make, so 100% duty cycle? Is it supposed to do that all the time, or are there other inputs that will change the duty cycle?

I made a post on the turbotweak support group. I'm sure Eric will set me straight. Until then I'm thinking about retesting the car with the solenoid line removed. Then I know I'll have the maximum bleed. I assume that this would result in an unlimited amount of boost so I'll have to be very careful with the throttle. It should tell me what I need to know before buying a manual boost controller though.

I have a couple mbc's laying around if you decide on the Rjc unit i will send you one Free of charge..

 

[Jon Early]

I have a couple mbc's laying around if you decide on the Rjc unit i will send you one Free of charge..

Pm incoming

 

[Jon Early]

Test drive went exactly as I hoped. I got the engine warmed up, disconnected the hose to the solenoid, saw over 20psi on the boost gauge, kept the engine in one piece, and drove it home.

I took up V6sleepers offer on the boost controller. That should fix the boost issue! From there I can start figuring out why my O2 mv is still in the 500s.

 

[V6sleeper]

Test drive went exactly as I hoped. I got the engine warmed up, disconnected the hose to the solenoid, saw over 20psi on the boost gauge, kept the engine in one piece, and drove it home.

I took up V6sleepers offer on the boost controller. That should fix the boost issue! From there I can start figuring out why my O2 mv is still in the 500s.

Controller is in the mail

 

[626gn]

I took up V6sleepers offer on the boost controller. That should fix the boost issue! From there I can start figuring out why my O2 mv is still in the 500s.

Might want to solve the low o2 issue before cranking up the boost. Slap on a fuel pressure gauge and see if you're getting 1:1 rise with boost. Did you ever get around to changing your fuel filter? The ethanol could have cleaned the inside of your gas tank for you and clogged the filter in the process.

 

[Jon Early]

It's hard to look at the boost, fuel pressure, and road at the same time while having the pedal mashed, but it looks like the regulator is doing it's job. When it was only at 16 psi I saw the fuel pressure go somewhere past 50. I turned the fueling up a little in all gears just to see what would happen and that brought the o2s from low 400s to solid 500s.

I just bought a K&N PF-1000 fuel filter. There were none available in my area, but amazon had it cheaper with same day delivery anyway!

I really wish I had my wideband hooked up right now so I could log it instead of narrow. Where are people putting their bungs? I worry about putting mine in the downpipe since it leaks out the wastegate arm hole. I'm not sure if it's enough to throw it off, but I suppose it would help keep me on the safe side!

 

[Jon Early]

Even without the boost controller or a way to keep tuning, I had other items on my pre-Nats to-do list to takle.

Oil change.
Check.

Saggy damaged headlight buckets that have looked awful since the day I bought the car....

I've been looking forward to this for a long time!

Making these kind of changes on such a dirty car kinda ruins the reveal, but I'm in a time crunch!

Highway Stars did good

Check!

While the car was still off the ground, I figured I'd go retorque the exhaust u-bolts because I started to hear them rattle.... and now I'm ready to burn this thing to the ground again.

So I'm extremely disappointed in this Pypes exhaust system. I bought it because I had only ever heard glowing reviews about how well it fits and the price was right. I found this one in the Nats swap meet last year for $540 and couldn't resist. Maybe I should have. I spent days wrestling this thing, taking it on and off a thousand times, making a few cuts, and apparently wasting my time.

I'm still weighing my options, but I know one thing is for sure. When this system gets removed, it is not going back on. I never even liked this y-pipe style dual exhaust system and it adds a lot more opportunity for fitment issues over a factory routed dual outlet muffler or a single shot. I've heard that a lot of the nice stainless options available to us have some fitment issues as well, but I'm a lot more open and willing to modify and fit a nice stainless system than a Pypes. The door is wide open for new exhaust (and hanger repair/replacement) suggestions. Just don't say Pypes.

I really don't know what to do right now though. If the mid-pipes are so bound up that they can break the hanger then who knows what kind of stress it's putting on my unobtanium downpipe right now! I might end up driving this car to KY with an open downpipe or a single Pypes muffer hanging off the down pipe with bailing wire.

 

[Jon Early]

A buddy of mine says he has a strip of conveyor belt that would work well as an exhaust hanger. He's cutting off a piece and bringing it to the nats for me.

Fuel filter showed up so I tossed that in too.

While I still don't ever remember being here, the fuel filter is the brand I would have chosen at the time I would have done it. Maybe it's not as old as I thought. It certainly wasn't plugged either, so I'll probably be continuing to figure out this fueling problem tonight.

That's right. TONIGHT! My boost controller came yesterday. Thank you @V6sleeper !! That was fast.

The size of this thing is perfect. It's tiny enough to not be obvious and hide behind turbo. It'll also still accessible when I need to adjust! Best of all, I don't even need to make a bracket. I have just the thing in my toolbox at work, so I'm glad this thing showed up before the weekend.

Yes! I had the perfect P-clamp. I also have enough vacuum hose and adapters hoarded to get it plumbed just right. I can't wait to throw it together and test drive it tonight. Let's hope I don't blow it up now!

 

[Jon Early]

I got the controller thrown on after blasting and painting part of it. I temporarily had to use a spare longer bolt and nut as a spacer, but it'll do for now.

I wish we could just say that we rode off into the boosted sunset, but somehow I managed to make the car worse.

With the knob turned almost all the way down the car only made 15 psi. The lag was almost nonexistent which was really cool, but it only did that once. Every time I tried after that, it took about 10 seconds of having the pedal mashed to build 15 psi. If I stayed in the throttle the car would eventually just fall completely on it's face for seemingly no reason.

So I gave up for a couple hours and decided to fix my mower while the car was out of the garage. I was already feeling l like a complete failure as a mechanic and wondering if I even wanted to attempt the Nats, so I figured feeling a some sort of repair win would rekindle some confidence and clear my head.

It worked a little. I went for an angry test drive to the gas station and filled the half empty tank with fresh E85. It didn't really do anything. Then I came back home and played with the wastegate again.

I think I have no choice but to ake this elbow off again, and finally fix it the same way as everyone else. I need to not get so bent out of shape over creating an exhaust leak because it already leaks as-is. It's just a lot of work considering that I'm taking care of the baby all day today. My wife has very graciously given me her first Mother's Day to work on the car, and I'll probably be taking Monday off too.

Confidence is still low though. Why did I only make 15 psi with this manual boost controller turned most of the way in? Why is the engine still running lean with good fuel pressure? What part of a fuel filter swap and manual boost controller install could have casued the engine to start randomly falling on its face? I'm starting to think that selling the car when it was still running nice at 16 psi was a better decision. This car hates me.