Real opinions on alcohol injection

[turbosam6]

My opinion is it works, and I was an avid naysayer for years. I bought Razors kit after seeing Geno try it. When the FAST guys do something, I watch and learn. I still run 116 at the track, partially because alky is outlawed in TSM, and also for insurance. One thing worth noting is I still run my alky with 116, for the cooling effect. Many fast guys are doing the same. On pump gas, when I floor the throttle, my coolant temp drops, because of the methanol! No air to air ic is going to do that.

 

[madhat]

I would love to get alky so I can run on 91 octane without getting 8.8 degrees of knock @ 13#s! But, as you will see in my thread, I dont have the money or the time right now with my new baby and all!

 

[Tin Man]

I have been running 29 #'s for about 6 months on 93 octane and Razors kit. No knock. I will be pushing it real hard next month to try and pull low 11's. I want to go with ported heads but have been hesitant about touching the factory "wonder" seal.

 

[V6UnderPressure]

Originally posted by sixgun86gn
Razor doesn't have just alky.He has heads and stuff too.The alky is not the only thing letting him go that far.

11.93 on pump only for your motor is probably not the best it can do.

I like your sig on how you push NO ALKY. I also see that your signature says you have a TA block in the works. Well if this is true, then you obviously have alot more free money than the most of us who try to get the best bang for the buck. Alky IS THE REAL DEAL when it comes to the best bang for the buck. There is no denying that one. In fact, you are one of the VERY few I have seen AGAINST alky. And race gas??? How much is that per gallon? When you can buy some 93 (or 91 for you west coast boys) and a gallon of alky for around 7-10 bucks that will be MUCH more cost effective than race gas, AND you won't ruin sensors. I have read numerous posts regarding alky. Hell, I've probably read all of them. And after all that, I think I come up with 99% pro and 1% con. Just my 2¢

Scott

Scott

 

[VernLee]

Just buy the alky system, there's NO way you will be disapointed,
got mine from razor.

 

[salvageV6]

For those that can't afford it build the DIY system and have fun.

FAR more threads on opened "built" motors with bad work being done by owners/shops/backyard mechanics with blown headgaskets than by some clueless, tuning wise, people with stockers using an alky. kit.

The greedy however will always blow headgaskets.

Running dry would be a very rare occurrance since even the DIY kit can easily be made with a low level light.

SMC kit is very easy to tune.

Going the DIY route saves a ton off the kit prices as well.

Enough to stock up parts for a few headgasket jobs.

 

[GNVAIR]

I ran an early single nozzle SMC kit with straight denatured on my 87 GN for over 2 years without any problems. This was a BONE stock long block with unported everything and stock cam and 130k+ miles. I used 94 octane sunoco, Extender chip with 23° in low and 21° in high gear. combo also included a TE45a, 9x11 convertor, 15 row stock location intercooler, single 340 pump, 72's, translator and just some good tuning. I ran between 28 and 30lbs of boost (depending on temperatures). Car had been in the 11.10's-11.20's like this. Sure the car probably could have gone faster with race gas and more timing, but this was my daily driver for awhile. I drove it EVERYWHERE!
When I finally lost a head gasket (after 2+ years like this) it wasnt because of the alky but because of a failing trans that over revved on the 3-2 down shift. I duplicated this combo as well as adding ported heads to my father's car. I am VERY confident it will go into the 10's this year on less boost.
I have nothing but good things to say about the alcohol injection. It worked well for me and many of my friends. The best thing I can say was that it allowed me to go pretty darn fast with strictly bolt on's without ever going inside the engine.
I plan on installing a progressive set up on my super charged 89 Mustang.

 

[ShouldIBuy]

I'm not going to get into an arguement with some of the non alky guys here, but I can definately say it was the best mod I did. 25-26#'s of boost with 93 and one of razors kits here. Best thing I've ever done. The car runs SO much cleaner now, and I don't have to spend 3.50 on up for gas if I want to drive it on the weekend, and wonder if I'll run into somebody that wants to play.

 

[Red Regal T]

I thought everyone has given up their "old school" ideas about alcohol injection, but I can see by this thread, even though proof has been shown to be in the pudding, for years , people can't get past their purist tendencies. I'm just proud of you if you can do it without it.

Over five years ago, I found out I could run 24lbs of boost without race gas. Did I say, "no, I wanna buy race gas? I said, "HELL NO! " GO DIY!

Come on guys...........P-L-E-A-S-E..............REPEAT AFTER ME.....

THERE IN NO DOWNSIDE TO ALKY INJECTION.

 

[Not Avg 6]

Very, very interesting.

 

[BLACK6PACK]

All the people against alky are saying its better to set it up to run without alky.

I have a fairly stock motor, I've been running alky for 5 years. With the money I've saved on c-116 and sensors, I could have bought multiple alky kits, and multiple rebuilds for my motor.

1 night at the track = $

$80 for gas
$20 sensor

$100 total just in gas and sensors.

Do this twice a month for a year and you're looking at $2600 and you haven't even driven it on the street with c116. Alky is only burnt while you are WOT.

So, I don't see where you're saving money by building it right and not using alky. I save enough in gas alone to rebuild the motor each year.

 

[2QUIK6]

I just finished my install of Razors kit, still need to do some tuning, I've worked it up to 25# with zero knock, but its running on the fat side. I'm going to tune it down to 23-24#. As far as blowing head gaskets, doesn't matter what fuel your running, after 25# thats a lot of pressure, keeping knock from occurring doesn't mean the pressure in the cylinder is not rising, eventually there is a limit no matter what.
The progressive kits of today are light years ahead of those from years past. Most failures have to do with the pumps, all thats needed to resolve having a head gasket blown if your alky pump fails or you run out of alky is 2 pressure switches, if boost is past x level and alky line pressure falls below x level, then cut the spark to the motor...makes it fail safe.
Most blown motors are due to trying to push the limits of your motor and failing to tune properly. The alky kit is not a bolt on and go kit, you need to know how to tune or you will be playing with disaster.
Also, once tuned, make sure all of your boost settings and the alky controller settings are marked inc ase you happen to hit the controller with your knee and turn down the ramp multipler of the alky.
Also, using methanol over the old school rubbing alchohol is a very big benefit of the new kits over the old ones.
If anything else, it s great insurance even if not running the high boost #s.

 

[madhat]

.

 

[Nocooler]

Alky doesn't kill head-gaskets the idiot tuning it does........

Keep knock, egt, afr, and your personal greedy in check and you'll never have a problem.

I've broken my fair share of stuff - and it's always been my fault, not the alky injection kits fault.

 

[2QUIK6]

It was beautiful weather today so I took the afternoon off and went to the dyno instead of waiting. After getting it tuned in, with 24# boost and 22 degrees timing it produced 405rwhp/484rwtq with dump open, 389rwhp/463rwtq thru the muffs with pump 93 and methanol, had 2.1 degrees KR with a 13 AFR. Turned up the control knob and the knock was gone.

 

[BLACK6PACK]

2 quick,
Looks like we have similar combos and put down similar #s.

I put down 405 hp and 545 tq through the mufflers on 23* timing and about 23-24 lbs of boost.

 

[Not Avg 6]

Looks like I might be ordering an alky setup soon.

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

Originally posted by Not Avg 6
Looks like I might be ordering an alky setup soon.

'bout time friend!

BW

 

[Razor]

Originally posted by sixgun86gn
Bruce,once again I HAVE used it.

I am done arguing.This guy asked for opinions...I gave mine.Nuff said.

You havent used my kit, you havent run 150+ PSI of pressure, you havent had your motor running using methanol injection.. you havenat a lot of things.. ..

Its like saying the hamburger sandwich you just had is the best sandwich you ever tasted and I go and tell you filet is a lot better.. Or a new york strip.. but after having vommitted the burger all beef products are bad.

To make this point you cannot argue..

What will be faster race gas by itself or race gas with alcohol?

Or pump gas by itself or pump gas with alcohol?

Will the motor knock more or knock less with alcohol?

Will the charge air temps be higher or lower?

Lets see your product knowledge?

 

[Razor]

Originally posted by Nick Micale
If that statement is true, why is it that there are many blown head gaskets using alchy, and the owner swears NO knock retard ever?

I do not know, but there are a couple more factors like extreme cylinder pressure and pre-ignition that enters into the mix.

Motor will run lower EGT's and make the same power. Now the issue with greed and tune-ups comes into play. See when your at 16 PSI you get some knock.. its no biggie. Your at 26 PSI.. you get knock.. then its a bigger biggie.

The biggest issue is the ability to turn the wick up to the moon and not have a handle on tuning. Its too easy to turn up the boost with alcohol.

My first HG went from a flare on my 2-3 shift at 29 PSI. It hit 6100 RPM's and the limiter kicked in.. shutting the fuel off.. and leaned out cuasing the HG to push out. Was it the kits fault, yes.. cuase I was running 29 PSI

All my chips now are burned without the rev limiter feature.

Would the HG have blown had I been running C16.. absolutely.

If the pump is going bad on the system.. yes you can have issues due to an insufficient amount of alcohol was being sprayed in. Just like if the pump in your fuel tank starts to go out.. you will have issues. How many cars have lost head gaskets due to theyre Aeromotive pump going south.