safe knock numbers???

[rwrows]

Hey guys,

I'm still learning a lot about turbo cars. i just put the rjc boost controller on my car, and i have a ta 49 and a scanmaster. i'm getting 6.6 degrees of knock when i mash it and it hits 15-18 lbs of boost. what are the safe knock numbers? can anyone school me in knock 101? the scanmaster paperwork says 3 or less for pump gas...... i assume 6.6 is bad??? will i pop a gasket? any help is greatly appreciated.

r

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

Turn the boost down and tune for 0 knock, any knock is bad.

If it doesnt knock on your best tune, later that night once the motor is getting really hot from street duty, i could possibly knock more since all the parts are not as efficient once warmed up. (turbo & intercooler)

Ive always ran my cars on the rich side and had great luck with them lasting longer on the rich side than running them lean and mean where they seem to break apart sooner.

How much timing are you running on pump gas, how stock is the car?
BW

 

[rwrows]

shouldn't there be a little knock during shifts??? i'm also running the stock intercooler, 206/206 cam, 2800 non lockup, and a 93 octane street chip. just keep backing the boost off? until i' not getting any knock? or is 3 degrees acceptable?? thanks

 

[XLR8]

I would tune for 0 KR. That being said, my car always ran the fastest at the track when I got 0.7 KR on the 2-3 shift.

 

[rwrows]

so by tune do you guys mean keeping the boost controlled or should I be looking at other numbers?

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

shouldn't there be a little knock during shifts??? i'm also running the stock intercooler, 206/206 cam, 2800 non lockup, and a 93 octane street chip. just keep backing the boost off? until i' not getting any knock? or is 3 degrees acceptable?? thanks

No, there shouldnt be any knock at all if you dont want to blow it up.

If the timing is low enough in the chip you shouldnt get detonation, since you didnt specify the timing your running in the 93 street chip, i cant really give you a boost number where to shoot for.

If you want to get the car to its maximum performance, 0 knock is the best.

3° on the shift means its probably more than that if your using t-link or a scanmaster.

One time, i knew a guy who tuned his car for 6° of knock, when the crank broke that summer he ended up with building a new engine.

BW

 

[rwrows]

No, there shouldnt be any knock at all if you dont want to blow it up.

If the timing is low enough in the chip you shouldnt get detonation, since you didnt specify the timing your running in the 93 street chip, i cant really give you a boost number where to shoot for.

If you want to get the car to its maximum performance, 0 knock is the best.

3° on the shift means its probably more than that if your using t-link or a scanmaster.

One time, i knew a guy who tuned his car for 6° of knock, when the crank broke that summer he ended up with building a new engine.

BW

yeah i've already had to do a whole motor because i didn't pay attention to knock. what kind of timing should i have. all i know is that my paperwork says i have a 93 octane street chip. i don't know anything about the timing. how do i figure that out?

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

so by tune do you guys mean keeping the boost controlled or should I be looking at other numbers?

Yes, what amount of timing is set in the chip for wide open throttle?

Is your maf getting close to 255 at WOT?

What spark plugs and wires are you running?

How heavy is the car?

Id be happy running 16-17psi of boost with a 3500lb car on pumpgas if the car had enough injector and the timing was below 20°..

BW

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

What brand chip is it? Can you pull it out and let us know?
BW

 

[rwrows]

i'm running 42.5 lb injectors. the car is full weight plus my 210lb tubby self. i think it has aluminum bumper braces but i'm not sure how much weight that takes off. has alum turbine wheels as well. how do i read the maf numbers? is that the number on the left next to KR on the scanmaster?

 

[rwrows]

i guess i could pull the chip out and see what it is. i will also check my paperwork.

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

Without touching the pushbuttons on the scanmaster, the numbers on the left are your 02 sensor values. At Wide Open Throttle the scan master will read the lowest value and then you press both buttons after a pass it will display at which MPH those values were recorded.

So if you make a pass and you see 777 and 1.0 knock retard ,... then you press and hold both buttons and it shows 032 032 that means 777 was the lowest 02 value at 32MPH and you had 1.0° of knock at 32MPH....


Next pass you do from a 55MPH roll and see 800 and 6.7, press both buttons and it shows 800 at 55MPH and 6.7° at 98MPH just goes to show that the car needs more fuel or less boost on the top end, just depends on if there is boost creep.

So if you scroll thru the parameters of the scanmaster, you should see

AF = MAF
Once the cars tune is fine, scroll to that parameter and view it at WOT, it should peg near 255 at anything over 15psi of boost.

BW

 

[rwrows]

quick,

i was just checking out your links and i was reminded that my car also has the MAF translator. should i making adjustments on that?

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

If you had a trans plus you could adjust WOT fuel and timing, if its a standard translator, i dont think you can do much with it.

Let us know which chip you have, then we can suggest timing.

Why not get a alky kit and turn the timing and boost up?

BW

 

[rwrows]

actually i am seriously considering an alky kit. i was gonna do a bigger turbo and stock location intercooler first, then alky, and then ultimately heads and a looser lock up converter... all of which will hopefully get me in the 10s. but as for now i'm not in a rush since i've already spent thousands on this car after blowing a motor 2 years ago. was hoping to maybe hit the track and get a high 11 with race gas and a little more boost. can i do that with my current chip? or you need to know what my chip is still??

 

[johnnyttype]

just a testament to 0 knock being better. i ran a 13.3 @ 106 at the track on 20/18 degrees of timing with about 3 degrees of knock, turned the timing down to 19.2/16.4 degrees and ran a 13.069 @109!!! 0 degrees knock!!! same 60ft. times on street tires of 2.08sec.

 

[rwrows]

i just pulled the chip and checked it. it's a R93H F9 59. what does that mean?

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

I believe its a red armstrong chip, here is what my reds 107 octane chip looks like.

Is your red sticker that large?

BW

 

[rwrows]

yup that looks just like mine but the numbers are different

from top to bottom it reads

F 9

R93H

5 9

 

[Quick6'n'-K.C.]

Yes sir! Im positive you have a red armstrong chip in your car, i believe it usually has anywhere between 20-23° of timing for wot. Works pretty good, but id get the boost down to about 16 and see if the car never knocks.

The 93 means its for 93 octane, and i forget what all the other numbers represent. If you find out, let me know, id like to figure out the reds chips ive got stacked up from over the years.

BW:biggrin: