Smog time in California, test only

[TRBON8R]

My CA smog certification is coming up in less than 3 months. I found out I have to go to a test only station.
So what will I need to pass without a problem?

Please tell me there is an alternative to removing my THDP, adjustable FP regulator, 50 lb injectors, etc. and replacing them with stock parts that I don't even have anymore??? Not to mention I have no idea what I'm going to do to construct that breather thing that goes from the passenger side valve cover to the turbo, which of course my TA49 has no provision for!?!? I know some of you guys have been through this, so please lend a brother a hand. Feel free to email me if you local CA guys have any ideas.

 

[TurboDave]

You shouldn't have a problem with the THDP, 50's, or even the adjustable regulator.
I didn't anyway. Where the problems arise is the obvious visual stuff that most of those idiots look for. You'll need to put the stock air cleaner assembly on.
As for plumbing into the turbo, yours is easier than mine since you have a TA49. All you have to get ahold of is the stock inlet bell, and stock plumbing from valve cover to turbo. You'll also want the stock oil filler tube assembly.
I went in with a THDP, MSD50's, afpr, and front mount intercooler.

Fortunately I had the other stock air filter stuff and the plumbing from the valve cover.

My biggest problem was that I have a TE44, so hooking the plumbing up was a real
But I fabricated a device that goes onto the 44's inlet bell and allows the stock MAF hose to hook to that. They never noticed a thing

OH, almost forgot. You'll need a good working CAT, and good smog chip. Dont' worry about having a 160 thermostat, the higher fan temp parameters in the smog chip will run the enging good and hot because the car's not moving during smog checks.

Both of my GN's were getting hit for test only Once you're on that list, you're screwed and can't get off of it.

BTW, I guess I should tell you, I just left San Diego, CA about 5 months ago which is how I know all this stuff

 

[gofstbuick]

'87 GN, TA49/w PT&E housing, THDP, Hooker exhaust, test pipe, Big Neck IC, Power Plate, 50 lb injectors, PT&E 100 octane chip, Cold Air Kit, WAL Fuel Pump, Stock D5, Nitto DRs, Direct Scan, Weld Rodlites, bunch of other stuff, blah blah.... Personalized plate.... "A V6 8U"

As TurboDave says, you'll need a cat. In your case, you'll need a three way cat. The dyno test emissions at 15 mph and 25 mph. At 15mph (in drive), the tranny will probably only see second gear, so the EGR will not function and NOx control is totally reliant on the cat. At 25 mph you have the cat and EGR system to control NOx. Did you drill your powerplate for EGR function? if not, it should be. Nobody will notice the 50 lbs injectors, the prom or fuel pump. Is your turbo sheild over the DP? If not, it should be (will draw less attention). If you're called on the adjustable fuel pressure regulator, the next obvious choice would be a bosch 237 regulator. Do not make your emissions chip excessively lean, or you'll drive HCs though the roof (it will lean misfire. The intercooler is category 1 (items not of concern) in the smog check manual. If called on the intercooler, tell the smog tech to refer to the category 1 list in appendix K of their smog check manual.
Now, since TurboDave left CA, the major change in the program is addendum 8 for the smog machine. Addenum 8 eliminates fast pass. This means the vehicle is subject to the full blown ASM test. But the software change will not go into effect until all BAR97 analyzers are updated to addendum 8, so you better hurry (I wouldn't wait the 3 months) in getting your car modified. Addendum 8 will affect NOx more than any other emission. The current version, if the emission are in during a specified portion of the test, it fast passes.
If you want more info, email, or call 916-255-4217

 

[TurboDave]

gofstbuick
Since you seem to be our go to expert on CA emissions, can you answer me this? The last time through in Sept of 2000 my GN's blew the following numbers at the Test Only station:

86 GN
HC - 45 @ 15 mph... max allowed 151@15
HC - 46 @ 25 mph... max allowed 101@25

CO - .08 @ 15mph... max allowed .79@15
CO - .09 @ 25 mph... max allowed .59@25

NO - 5 @ 15 mph... max allowed 1118@15
NO - 5 @ 25mph... max allowed 978@25

My 86 is the more heavilly modified car with the THDP, MSD50's, TE44, AFPR, and CAS Frontmount.

87 GN
HC - 29 @ 15mph... max allowed 135@15
HC - 26 @ 25mph... max allowed 85@25

CO - .01 @ 15mph... max allowed .71@15
CO - .04 @ 25mph... max allowed .71@15

NO - 7 @ 15mph... max allowed 1025@15
NO - 2 @ 25mph... max allowed 885@25

The 87 only has Blue Tops and a TA49 for mods.


How do you think the above numbers will look by the present standards? I know the "allowables" are dropping every 6 months on our cars, and have no idea how low they are now. the max allowables even changed in between the two smog check above and they were only a week apart.

As can be seen, the HC max allowables are dropping like a stone. IMHO it's their way of getting our cars off the road, one way or another

Thanks for any help.

 

[Ken Cunningham]

I also got called to the "Test Only" station. I got my TE44 thru inspection by simply buying a plug for the p/s valve cover. I forget what its called, but it is rubber that compresses between two washers when you tighten the screw in the middle. Looks pretty stock when installed. My tech was pretty savvy too, he even knew turbos to the extent that he knew that boost would go up if the vacuum was removed from the wastegate. My bluetops, 'stealth' adj. f/p regulator, 160 deg. thermo, atr downpipe, etc. were all on the car when it passed with flying colors. BTW, when I asked him why I was called to test only, he said that California compiles statistics about what makes/models are most likely to be 'gross polluters.' Apparently, 87 Regals do not have a good track record.

 

[gofstbuick]

TurboDave
Those readings look pretty good. I cannot get my NOx numbers down that low. Mine are still in the 200-400 ppm range. Take a look at your CO2 and O2 results, because CO2 tells you how efficient your engine is running and O2 is a measure of mixture. CO2 because the byproducts of the imaginary perfect combustion is CO2 and H2O. Therefore, if your CO2 numbers are over 14.0%, your chances of passing the emissions test greatly increases. The cat uses O2 to complete combustion, so it should be burned to less than 0.3%, and you'll know your cat is working efficiently. But O2 in front of the cat will provide a good indication of a/f mixture.
Ken,
BARs current response is as follows: In determining which vehicles to send to test-only, BAR focuses on vehicle groups, families and model-year that contribute sighnificantly higher emissions thatn others. Studies consistently show that vehicles ten model-years and older contribute significantly high levels of emissions to CA air pollution problems. Having a vehicle that req a smog check at a test-only station is not necessarily an indication that your vehicle is a high polluter. It is only an indicator that your vehicle family (make, model,year, etc.)has a higher probability of producing excessive levels of pollution, as compared to other vehicles. This is an excerpt from a 2 page document.
From past experience, I've been told that most performance vehicles have a very hard time federal emissions requirements. This is probably why a auto manufacturer will build thousands of non perfromance low priced model to the small number of performance oriented models. The thinking is if I can build a disproportionate number of nonperformance low priced vehicles that will meet the FTP, then I can produce a performance vehicle that touches the edge of the FTP and still meet govt regs for clean air
I'm getting good typing practice today, sorry for the length

 

[TurboDave]

Ok, I see. I looked at the CO2 and O2 numbers for the two cars.

The 86 showed CO2 of 14.9% and O2 of 0.0%

The 97 showed CO2 of 15.0% and O2 of 0.1%

 

[gofstbuick]

TurboDave
The results coupled with the CO2 and O2 results yield great readings, and thanks for the kudos

 

[TRBON8R]

First of all thanks to TurboDave, gofstbuick, and Ken Cunningham. There's lots of good info here. A couple more questions for you:

You'll need a good working CAT, and good smog chip

I've got the cat that came with my THDP, as well as the stock airbox, oil filler, valve cover breather, etc. I'll be sure and bolt all the stock stuff and the new cat up before I go for the test. Where do I buy a smog chip for my car? How much do they cost?

In your case, you'll need a three way cat

Is the cat supplied with my THDP a three way? By the way, to answer your question, yes I did drill out my Power Plate for EGR function.

I got my TE44 thru inspection by simply buying a plug for the p/s valve cover. I forget what its called, but it is rubber that compresses between two washers when you tighten the screw in the middle. Looks pretty stock when installed.

Ken, do you remember where you bought this plug?

 

[CaPPY]

TURBON8R.....Yep, the cat with the THDP is a three-way. I passed with it in L.A... I used the stock oil breather for the drivers side. The passenger side was taken care of in a similar way...ala TurboDave.

Since the test. 1 1/2 years ago, I've added alcohol/water injection and have 4 lines going to the uppipe. I'm assuming I'll have to change it back to stock for the new test next year.

gofstbuick,
Will they let water injection pass?

 

[gofstbuick]

CaPPY,
when I talked to ramchargers, I was told the cat that is supplied with the THDP is a two way cat and was told I would have to purchase a three way cat separate. Maybe a call to terry huston is in order. As far as the water injection, I think the're legal, but I don't have access to a smog check manual at home. I'll answer for sure on Tuesday.

 

[TurboDave]

I'm not sure if the THDP CAT is a two way or a three way. I don't know the difference. Internally it looks identical to the stock converter, except it's shorter. I can tell you this, I run the THDP CAT on the 86, and a stock one on the 87, which may or may not account for the small differences in the HC readings. Don't know.

BUT, and it's a big but, before I took the 86 through, I went to get a pre check (knew of a place that would do that for cheap). The pre test is sorta like the old method before the dyno's showed up. Couldn't get it to pass the idle test at all.
The reason for that is (I'm quite sure) that the cat wouldn't "fire". Wasn't getting hot enough at idle to even work, and barelly made it through on the high rpm test.

I did notice one thing on both the 86 and 87 pre-test to real test. A lot of people should be thankful for the new dyno testing method 'cause in looking at the data, both cars ran MUCH cleaner with the dyno loading them down!!!

 

[Ken Cunningham]

Pep Boys and Auto Zone, for the valve cover plugs. I bought a second one because I couldn't find the first when I needed to go in again. They're only a couple of bucks.

 

[terryk]

How do stock 86/87 cars do on the standard tailpipe tests (assuming the cat is good)?

 

[tyndago]

Originally posted by TurboDave
The pre test is sorta like the old method before the dyno's showed up. Couldn't get it to pass the idle test at all.
The reason for that is (I'm quite sure) that the cat wouldn't "fire".87 pre-test to real test. A lot of people should be thankful for the new dyno testing method 'cause in looking at the data, both cars ran MUCH cleaner with the dyno loading them down!!!

We have found this too. Turbo cars at idle - all the heat energy that is required to light off the cat is sucked up by the heat sink we call an exhaust housing...

Turbo cars like it on the dyno - produce a bit more heat - the cat lights off - and works.

I work in importing and legalizing cars - and part of what we do is FTP testing on cars. Couple of pre cats -close to the cat - for quick light off for the FTP test. Then a good sized main cat.

I had problems getting my Syclone and Typhoon to pass idle /2500. Neither would pass the idle check....

When I set the idle to just under 1000 rpms in my Typhoon it passed the idle check.

New cats will make the test easier. The newer the better. Old - partially pluged - or melted down cats dont help much.

I will have a smog check coming up on my GN , once I get it back on the road.

It will have new plugs , stock thermostat , cleaned injectors ,new cat , and I dont think I will have any problems.

 

[CaPPY]

gofstbuick...I guess I was thinking of one of the other cars in the family. The one with the LT1 engine is a three-way cat for sure. Like TurboDave, my THCAT worked fine at the last test.

 

[WE4]

SCREW CA!!!

Move the friggin car out of state. DO NOT give CA another blasted dime. SCREW THEM!!!

Soon they will be walking only in CA cause they are just succeeding in pissing people off with their bullshiiit rules. Did you know no other state has an ozone eating problem? YEA RIGHT!!!!!
Only the bureucrats in CA could be this friggin stupid!
You will spend more money trying to oppeese the friggin idiots. Just do it now... Move it outta state. Turbo Dave is the only genius here as he flipped them the bird and left!!

HUGH FRIGGIN KUDOS TO TURBO DAVE!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey Dave, Can I live there?


Bruce
WE4

 

[gofstbuick]

terryk
The turbo regal blows clean numbers on the two speed idle test. Skyline college (San Bruno, CA) has one and it consistently blows zeros at idle and 2500rpm test.

Bruce, welcome back, how was the get away. I'm trying to borrow a lab scope to test some of the sensors on your car. Will contact you next week

 

[TurboDave]

Re: SCREW CA!!!

Originally posted by WE4
Move the friggin car out of state. DO NOT give CA another blasted dime. SCREW THEM!!!

Soon they will be walking only in CA cause they are just succeeding in pissing people off with their bullshiiit rules. Did you know no other state has an ozone eating problem? YEA RIGHT!!!!!
Only the bureucrats in CA could be this friggin stupid!
You will spend more money trying to oppeese the friggin idiots. Just do it now... Move it outta state. Turbo Dave is the only genius here as he flipped them the bird and left!!

HUGH FRIGGIN KUDOS TO TURBO DAVE!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey Dave, Can I live there?


Bruce
WE4

SURE! Got over 1,500 sq/ft in the basement. Just have to build your own bedroom

 

[terryk]

Thanks for repsonding gofstbuick,

I have three Buick SC cars on top of my TT and they all blow 1 and 1. Amazing. I was hoping my TT would pass without issue.

Thanks again,

Terry