Stock ECM VS. F.A.S.T

[TurboBuRick]

I notice allot of peeps making the move. I have a system waiting to go in my car as well but I've been hesitant to switch because the car runs so well with stock ecm and tpro. Honestly I don't think there is much to gain wot. It has a bunch of stuff to play with but wot is pretty cut and dry. You have fuel, timing and boost.

I don't see it unlocking hidden horsepower. Maybe I'm missing something........

 

[BEATAV8]

The difference is really in the access to the maps.

For example you will be able to tailor your timing vs. RPM. Instead of having a flat adjustment, you will be able to make a custom map. For example using 22deg @ 4500 wot and 24deg @ 5500 wot.

 

[TurboBuRick]

Good morning Steve,

Shouldn't that be 24 @4500 and 22@5500?

 

[CGASTON]

The difference is really in the access to the maps.

For example you will be able to tailor your timing vs. RPM. Instead of having a flat adjustment, you will be able to make a custom map. For example using 22deg @ 4500 wot and 24deg @ 5500 wot.

But he can already somewhat do that that with trans pro. One thing I feel that the XFI has over stock ecm, is that you have better control over O2 corr, better target A/F (and can per cell and not over all like stock ecm), sensor calibration is so much easier, the ability the change tunes as car is running, and much more

 

[TurboDave]

Ya, a lot of people are making the move, but I suspect a goodly number for the wrong reasons. Running the Translator Pro is a good part of both worlds, and I personally wouldn't make such a move, nor do I see the need. I mean after all, you have all the complex overhead being taken care of by the stock ECM for idle, cruise and general driveability issues, and when it comes to WOT, I don't see how the TPro can be bested. After all it has a huge VE table that you can play with just as the FAST systems have. And if you don't like playing with individual cells, then there's the user tune tables that can adjust larger sections of the VE table. And don't forget the TPro allows you to control a second fuel pump if needed, can adjust boost at two levels (mine is gear based) with the aux input, and another level of fuel control with the aux input if desired. ETC. ETC. ETC.

Now, with all that said, the one thing that I've noticed that the stand alone SD systems have as a huge advantage would be their software implamenatation. We have to use TunerPro which is extremely limited and weak kneed compared to the other stand alone systems like XFI, and Mega Squirt 3. I've had the chance to play with MS3's software (can't remember the name) but it's really slick when in comes to making changes on the fly to the VE table.

If anything were to drive me away from Translator Pro it would be the TunerPro software, but..... I don't see that happening simply because I don't want to be strapped with the misery of having to make all the other dozens of adjustments in overhead stuff to try and get the car's street manners as perfect as I like them. I demand perfect driveabilty because mine is a street car, not a dedicated race car. I have that perfect driveability with my present system.

Now, if you need some of the fancy Buck Rogers stuff that the standalone systems offer, like traction control and stuff, then maybe it's worth a look. But is your car that serious a drag racer that it needs any more fancy stuff that what you now have with Tpro??

 

[TurboDave]

The difference is really in the access to the maps.

For example you will be able to tailor your timing vs. RPM. Instead of having a flat adjustment, you will be able to make a custom map. For example using 22deg @ 4500 wot and 24deg @ 5500 wot.

Ya, we can do that with the Pro.

 

[TurboDave]

But he can already somewhat do that that with trans pro. One thing I feel that the XFI has over stock ecm, is that you have better control over O2 corr, better target A/F (and can per cell and not over all like stock ecm), sensor calibration is so much easier, the ability the change tunes as car is running, and much more

We've got a 17 x 15 VE table to play with, how much better does the control need to be? An yes we can make changes on the fly.

IMHO, a lot of the folks that POO POO the Translator Pro and what it can or can't do is a matter of perception and not really based on any personal experience, or having seen the Turner Pro software. Does the TP software have limitations? sure, but it certainly does a lot more that what most folks think based on what they "think" the TransPro can or can't do.

 

[TurboBuRick]

Thanks for your input guys.

People make the change to a fast for the same reason they tried the tpro. They think it will fix all the problems and/or unlock some horsepower. It's just not reality.

Yes there are allot of cells to play with but most of them get passed up when going wot.

At the end of the day we still have injector pulse, timing and boost that makes the power. IMO It does not matter what device is making these things happen when the end result targets the same numbers.

 

[kidglok]

I like the logging capabilities and fine tuning that's possible with xfi.

 

[Nick Micale]

..................................

.............At the end of the day we still have injector pulse, timing and boost that makes the power. IMO It does not matter what device is making these things happen when the end result targets the same numbers.

That is a good statement, BUT it needs to be qualified because of another factor that must be considered, and that is how the vehicle is going to be used.

My personal experience with my cars and many other turbo Buicks is that in the field of competition, a 30 year old computer is not adequate to perform as well or quick as a 21st century engine management system. This applies also to reliability, not only in making instantaneous corrections on the fly, but provides much more and better data for instant tuning and reliability.

Most street cars will be fine with a stock computer, but with a $15K engine build, it will be better protected with an aftermarket computer.

Many customers have invested more in add-ons to their stock computer than investing in an aftermarket modern system? Trying update the computer I had on my desk in the late 80's would not be practical to do what I now accomplish, and the one in my stock car does the job well for what it was designed to do.

I am not a computer freak, so I do not understand why some owners invest as much as the computer they carry in their pocket as it would be to update the computer in their TR to help performance and protect that investment?

 

[CGASTON]

Nick, Your are an Apple guy..... I am surprised that you don't own a iPhone.

 

[kidglok]

Nick, Your are an Apple guy..... I am surprised that you don't own a iPhone.

Wish I could get the fast to connect to my iphone

 

[CGASTON]

Wish I could get the fast to connect to my iphone

Well as you probably already know, the iPhone is more than capable. But there is no functionality or support. Now the Windows phone running windows 8 Pro, should run the comp XFI software. Just have to figure out haw to connect the two!!

 

[HighPSI]

I don't claim to know everything the stock computer is capable of, so would hate to start comparing the features of each. I'm sure there are things it can do that an aftermarket can't. I also know that an aftermarket isn't for everyone. With that being said, the XFI adaptive learning has made things much easier for the novice tuner.

IMHO, a lot of the folks that POO POO the Translator Pro and what it can or can't do is a matter of perception and not really based on any personal experience, or having seen the Turner Pro software. Does the TP software have limitations? sure, but it certainly does a lot more that what most folks think based on what they "think" the TransPro can or can't do.

The same can be said for an aftermarket computer: Most people are unaware of its capabilities. Usually the guys that say the stock computer is just as good have never owned an aftermarket setup. There are quite a few guys that have owned both, perhaps they will chime in?