Street Legal TV Magazine Might Take On A '87 GN Project Car!

Welcome!

By registering with us, you'll be able to discuss, share and private message with other members of our community.

SignUp Now!
A few things to think about. Even if there was a 10 HP gain in some part of the power band (or the entire thing), it would take you longer to reach those power levels with the turbo lag. Whether you were road racing or drag racing, this loss of performance would most likely cost you far more than the ten HP gain. You could go to a looser (less efficient) converter to get the turbo to spool quicker. However, Once again, the losses would most likely out way any gains. Personally, I think you should just do a stroker motor with ported heads and not have to worry about the turbo lag.;)

This is a fun project, by someone who's passionate about Turbo Buicks. This is also turning out to be a very constructive thread. It is nice to see someone who has the balls to stand with class and accept the constructive criticism. Rick, we are behind you in this. Whatever you do. Just post your data and let the chips fall where they may. Yes! Everyone wants to be the Rock Star and show HUGE gains. However, just as much respect can be earned by proving what doesn't work and telling why. Everyone in the "Performance" world wants to go fast, but too many of them don't want to learn how. They just want to buy the "Magic Bullet" to make their car go fast. IMO, If there is a magic bullet to making these cars go fast, that bullet is "Knowledge".

Thanks for doing this and keep us in the loop.

Mike Barnard
 
To make it real, now you should to do a comparison with other providers headers, sponsor or not, to see the differences.

Would have loved to! Unfortunately my hands were tied. Mostly because I personally couldn't afford the cost of purchasing several different sets of headers (that ring in at $1k/set, give or take). In short, if it were 100% up to me, I would have threw on a set from TA Performance in the beginning, and would have been done with it. I even tried to get a set of them with the help of Nick Micale, and it was a no-go...

It's the only true test even though some of your sponsors would disagree because their product may not measure up, but it would be real TV to a car guy.

I agree. But like I said, good or bad, you'll see the results. And that's what you'll get. I'm not going to lie to the reader and tell them they're the greatest thing in the world if they're not. Nor am I going to write a 2,000 word article ripping Hooker/Holley apart simply because they tend to cause a bit of lag on the bottom end on an otherwise stock TR, considering they were kind enough to send us a set to begin with.

Besides, it's not like the car is permanently stuck like this now. I could always buy a set from TA Performance or go back to stock later...

Isn't the truth what this board is truly after? Or will the car be subjected to a test with an agenda, a bought and paid for agenda? We read that in car publications every month.

The only agenda I have is building the car the way I want it to be built. If our clients can help, great, if not, I'll be sourcing parts from the same suppliers that all of you do. If I wanted a "sponsored car" I would have bought something mainstream and generic, like a Mustang...

But since I didn't buy the car for "editorial purposes," but rather because I'm a Turbo Buick fan and enthusiast, I'm building it the best that I can with what I have to work with - while giving the Buick community some much-needed exposure. I'm not going to put "free junk" on my car for the sake of a sponsor either, even though to some of you it might have seemed that way with these headers.

In truth, I actually don't think they're bad at all apart from the slight lag. If I decide to go with a stroker later down the road, they'll work just fine. Given that the car is still relying on a stock turbo, boost, chip, injectors, and an entirely stock engine, I don't think those gains are too bad, considering the OEM manifolds are such an efficient design to begin with.

The misconception is that they're "junk." They're not junk, they're just for heavily-modified Buick engines. Someone back in 1988 must have put a set on their car (along with a Hypertech chip and a Flowmaster exhaust) with poor results, and by word of mouth, and later, the internet, have spread the word that they're "God-awful."

If you are going to put forth a vehicle as unique as a Turbo Regal, be it GN or not, give it a fair shake at it's potential, one with proper direction, insight and knowledge.

That's a given, and I'm doing my best. I appreciate your criticism that stems from the love and respect that you have for these cars. I totally get it. But if a fellow TR owner and enthusiast has the opportunity to build one for a magazine, then why not support it the best you can, rather than knock it every step of the way?
 
A few things to think about. Even if there was a 10 HP gain in some part of the power band (or the entire thing), it would take you longer to reach those power levels with the turbo lag. Whether you were road racing or drag racing, this loss of performance would most likely cost you far more than the ten HP gain. You could go to a looser (less efficient) converter to get the turbo to spool quicker. However, Once again, the losses would most likely out way any gains. Personally, I think you should just do a stroker motor with ported heads and not have to worry about the turbo lag.;)

Indeed. Maybe I will go with a stroked Buick in the future. ;) But once these headers arrived at our door, my hands were tied, and I had to install them. Would I have done things a little differently, now? Sure, but I have no regrets. And like I told Bill Murray, it's not like the car is going to be permanently stuck like this now. I can always swap them out later.

This is a fun project, by someone who's passionate about Turbo Buicks. This is also turning out to be a very constructive thread. It is nice to see someone who has the balls to stand with class and accept the constructive criticism. Rick, we are behind you in this. Whatever you do. Just post your data and let the chips fall where they may. Yes! Everyone wants to be the Rock Star and show HUGE gains. However, just as much respect can be earned by proving what doesn't work and telling why. Everyone in the "Performance" world wants to go fast, but too many of them don't want to learn how. They just want to buy the "Magic Bullet" to make their car go fast. IMO, If there is a magic bullet to making these cars go fast, that bullet is "Knowledge".

Thanks for doing this and keep us in the loop.

Mike Barnard

Thanks, Mike, I really do appreciate all of the love and support that everyone has given me with the project. There are nothing but good things in store for this car, and I'm sure everyone (well, almost) will enjoy it. If you guys don't want to follow along with the project, you don't have to. But I do appreciate the support, and criticisms, regardless.

-Rick
 
That's a given, and I'm doing my best. I appreciate your criticism that stems from the love and respect that you have for these cars. I totally get it. But if a fellow TR owner and enthusiast has the opportunity to build one for a magazine, then why not support it the best you can, rather than knock it every step of the way?

My intent wasn't to knock what you are doing and in fact, I think it's great.

Maybe it's the "in house project car" and "build it for a magazine" wording that led me to believe this is a "sponsored" build with certain manufactures' agendas in play therefore promting my critisism/questions about using only certain products. I didn't clearly see you say that this was a purely personal project (with a little help from your friends at the magazine/show) being built with your own greenbacks until page 3.

Then again, sometimes I'm a bit slow on the uptake. :)

Again, good luck and carry on........
 
Then again, sometimes I'm a bit slow on the uptake. :)

Sometimes?:p You knew it was coming Guy.;)

It's nice to see a magazine do something with one of these antiques and it was nice to see Edmunds do something on them as well, but it may give the reader the wrong impression. When the last FF movie came out with a "GN" in it we had so many friggin idiots join thinking that they'd just bought the perfect American classic that could be easily pushed into a 10 second beast it wasn't funny.:rolleyes: It would be nice to see you add some help from some of the more knowledgeable members on the board that've actually taken the time to understand how they work. We've got guys that have been working on them since they were brand new. I'm sure if you approached then they'd be able to help with some of the kinks you may end up having.:cool:
 
Again, good luck and carry on........

Thanks!

It's nice to see a magazine do something with one of these antiques and it was nice to see Edmunds do something on them as well, but it may give the reader the wrong impression. When the last FF movie came out with a "GN" in it we had so many friggin idiots join thinking that they'd just bought the perfect American classic that could be easily pushed into a 10 second beast it wasn't funny.:rolleyes: It would be nice to see you add some help from some of the more knowledgeable members on the board that've actually taken the time to understand how they work. We've got guys that have been working on them since they were brand new. I'm sure if you approached then they'd be able to help with some of the kinks you may end up having.:cool:

Yeah, I'm not too crazy with the way Edmunds is treating their car. Driving a 5,000 mile example across country, through the rain, leaving it in hotel parking lots overnight, constantly beating on it, and leaving it parked on the street in front of one editors house sort of irritated me for some reason. They're basically treating it like it's any other car. Then they'e going to sell it after they had their fun with it. Kinda makes me sick.

As far as the F&F fallout, I know what you mean. After that movie came out, I had kids constantly coming up to me asking me if it was "a real GNX." When I told them it wasn't a GNX at all (not even a clone), but a Grand National they would lose interest. They would also say idiotic things like, "GNXs ran 11s stock in the quarter," and were clearly under the impression that a GNX is the only Turbo Regal worth owning, and apparently, are a dime a dozen. At least that was my experience. You can partially blame the recent video games for that one too. Kids... :rolleyes:

I've been on this board since 2004, and it was just up to a few years ago Ive actually had the time and money to get serious about mine. Coincidentally, I landed my dream job as a writer for a car mag a couple of years ago, and after the constant stream of writing about the Camaro and Mustang projects cars with this company, my Buick is finally getting it's turn. I'm not going to build the car without the insight of the veteran builders/tuners in the hobby. Not to mention, they'll have their names mentioned in the article, along with TurboBuick.com on occasion. ;)
 
Back
Top