Stumbling/surging

[12lepler]

Hey I have a 1986 GN with 51k original miles, and at highway speeds, the car runs fine at 65mph for like a mile, then it starts surging. It sounds like my engine cuts in and out when it happens and it keeps doing it until I'm going like 45 or 50 mph. What are the proper vaccum readings for that speed? I'm pulling about 20 - 30hgs of vac. Is that normal? I JUST got the car and i really want to like it.. I've been saving for over a year to get it but this problem is really making it hard to enjoy driving it. I need help with it please.

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[Nascar83Fan]

This is a link that is for new owners of TR's, there's alot of information in it that will help you get alittle more familiar with your car.
http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/threads/info-for-new-turbo-regal-owners.380856/

You probably need to do some spring cleaning to your new car.
There's a bunch of info in that thread i pasted the link to, before you start beating on it and have more problems than you already have it's recommended you read up a bit about these TR's.
Where are you located at?
Where did the car come from?
Was it doing it before you got the car?
Do you know what all has been done to it by the previous owner?
What upgrades if any that were done?
Does the car have a Scanmaster or some other type of data logger that you can see what the car is doing?
You say you just got the car, how long have you had the car exactly ( just today, a few days, a week, etc )?
There's alot of people that can help, but need alittle more information in order to give proper feedback to resolve your car issues.

.

 

[12lepler]

Well I live in eastern PA, the car originally came from illonois, and it slowly moved it's way east over the years until it got to me. The guy told me it never had the problem before. (sure it didnt). I have no clue what ALL the mods are to the car. The previous owner bought it modded but I found recipts for stuff. The stuff i know it has is:
Mease performance intercooler,
Precision Turbo exhaust housing,
remote mount oil filter,
50 lb Delphi injectors,
adjustable fuel pressure regulator,
Comp cams 980-12 springs,
3000 stall 12 inch torque converter,
Tubular rear control arms,
Rear in the coil airbags,
I'm just assuming it has a bigger fuel pump and there's a big red wire going to the fuel pump in the back so I'm assuming it has a hot wire kit. That's all I know so far. Of course I don't have a scanmaster. I'm looking for one right now in the WTB section. And I've had the car for 4 days so far.

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[Nascar83Fan]

Did you buy it without test driving it? Did you get to physically see the car before you paid the previous owner?
Just curious, not busting on you.
It sounds like someone had put a hotwire kit on it, however without dropping the tank and getting eyes on the fuel pump you won't know what you're working with for a fuel pump. One thing that you can do if you have a fuel pressure gauge is check and see at idle what the fuel pressure is. It should be close to 40 psi without unhooking any lines and should be steady at idle. It should raise some if you increase rpm's some, if it drops fuel pressure at idle or being brought up some on rpm's then you know you got a problem with the fuel pressure not being stable.
Does the gauge you are seeing vac on also have boost Psi #'s on it?

 

[earlbrown]

Sounds like it might be a simple at the TCC switch unlocking and locking right back up at speed. Then when you slow down enough to reach 'unlock speed' it stops.

 

[12lepler]

Did you buy it without test driving it? Did you get to physically see the car before you paid the previous owner?
Just curious, not busting on you.
It sounds like someone had put a hotwire kit on it, however without dropping the tank and getting eyes on the fuel pump you won't know what you're working with for a fuel pump. One thing that you can do if you have a fuel pressure gauge is check and see at idle what the fuel pressure is. It should be close to 40 psi without unhooking any lines and should be steady at idle. It should raise some if you increase rpm's some, if it drops fuel pressure at idle or being brought up some on rpm's then you know you got a problem with the fuel pressure not being stable.
Does the gauge you are seeing vac on also have boost Psi #'s on it?

Well yeah I did see the car and test drive it. but like I said, it happens after like 1 or 2 miles on the highway and I didn't drive it at those speeds for long enough to get it to do it. And yes the gauge reads both vac and psi.

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[12lepler]

Sounds like it might be a simple at the TCC switch unlocking and locking right back up at speed. Then when you slow down enough to reach 'unlock speed' it stops.

So what's the remedy for that? (If that is the problem)

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[Nascar83Fan]

If your TCC switch is going nuts, then you have to get a replacement TCC switch and change it out.
The test would be unhooking the TCC solenoid plug and if it doesn't act up then probably found the problem.
If the connector contacts are dirty, could maybe cause the same issue.
If i am recalling correctly.

 

[12lepler]

If your TCC switch is going nuts, then you have to get a replacement TCC switch and change it out.
The test would be unhooking the TCC solenoid plug and if it doesn't act up then probably found the problem.
If the connector contacts are dirty, could maybe cause the same issue.
If i am recalling correctly.

Where is this sensor at? And could you describe what it looks like?

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[Nascar83Fan]

http://www.kirbanperformance.com/product/456/Replacement TRANSMISSION TCC SOLENOID #7208.html there's what the part in question looks like.
Also explains where and how to get to it.

 

[1fastcobra]

Un plug the tcc
Its on the driver side of the tranny
Then take it for a ride
See what happens
Before u go changing parts

Also ck the fuel filter


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[earlbrown]

And now for the real answer.......


IF it's the TCC circuit flaking out THEN it could be the hot side on the brake pedal.

or, most likely on the ground side. Every time it's happened to me, it's been the pressure switches on the transmission (part number 8683502). They are a N.C. closed typed switch and get can flaky at times. The easiest way to eliminate the ground side is to jump out the TCC wire on the ALDL plug.


To eliminate the hot side, push the brake pedal just enough to light the lights, but not enough to cause drag. The TCC will unlock. If the surging goes away it's the TCC circuit.

 

[1fastcobra]

If your TCC switch is going nuts, then you have to get a replacement TCC switch and change it out.
The test would be unhooking the TCC solenoid plug and if it doesn't act up then probably found the problem.
If the connector contacts are dirty, could maybe cause the same issue.
If i am recalling correctly.

X2

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[12lepler]

Well I unplugged it and drove it around. The problem is still there. Any more suggestions as to what it could be?

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[Nascar83Fan]

Have you verified the Fuel Pressure is staying stable? Have you had a chance to see if the Fuel Filter on the driver side frame rail towards the rear tire isn't in need of being changed out?
Have you had a chance to look at the spark plugs to see what condition they are in?
Have you tried after starting the car, unhook the MAF and see if it runs better?

 

[12lepler]

Have you verified the Fuel Pressure is staying stable? Have you had a chance to see if the Fuel Filter on the driver side frame rail towards the rear tire isn't in need of being changed out?
Have you had a chance to look at the spark plugs to see what condition they are in?
Have you tried after starting the car, unhook the MAF and see if it runs better?

I've tried none of those yet but I will shortly

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[12lepler]

Have you verified the Fuel Pressure is staying stable? Have you had a chance to see if the Fuel Filter on the driver side frame rail towards the rear tire isn't in need of being changed out?
Have you had a chance to look at the spark plugs to see what condition they are in?
Have you tried after starting the car, unhook the MAF and see if it runs better?

So I tried unplugging the MAF and it made the car knock and run poorly so I'm assuming that means the MAF is good.

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[Nascar83Fan]

yeah if it runs fine with it hooked up and changes to running badly unhooked, then yeah your maf is probably good.

 

[12lepler]

So I pulled a plug and this is what it looks like, it's a bit wet, it smells a LITTLE like fuel but not too bad. The insulator is very brown

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[Nascar83Fan]

I don't think the plugs are suppose to be a bit wet like that, see what the other 5 look like but also verify the gap isn't over 0.035 on each one. Once all the spark plugs are back in, really need to see what your Fuel Pressure is doing. Although i believe a clue is the fact that you so far had found a plug that was a bit wet, the other 5 plugs are gonna tell you if it's only one cylinder that was a bit wet or if it's more. Starting to look like the spark is being drowned out by gas ( whether it's an intermittant spark issue or possibly leaking injector(s) ), but until you see what the other one's look like you won't know what's going on with each cylinder.
Also testing the terminals on the coil pack with engine off with a volt meter to see what ohm's it's putting out on each pair will let you know the health of the coil pack. So if you can post how the readings of each pair were, be able to see if there's something going on with that or not as well.
Testing the coil pack is pretty simple, you just use a multimeter to (check resistance) ohm across the towers from one side to the other.