TA49 vs Precision 6262

[Turbo Keith]

I have the 49 as you can see in my signature and wondering just what if any I could tell going to a bigger turbo ? I have heard the saying " I have out grown my turbo " and I'm not sure what that means or if I am there . I have no plans porting the heads cause they have never been off the car and I know power is in the heads . Just seeing if anyone out here has done the same as I am thinking and what the results have been ? The car is sitting at bout 26-27 lbs of Boost and pulls hard with no knock .
I have read where running a bigger turbo you can get the same HP with less boost ? any thoughts would help being I have not the greatest knowledge about turbos . Thanks Keith

 

[bison]

We’ve seen gains on a 62 with manifold pressures in the 30’s on stock heads. The converter requirements will change a lot compared to a small stage 3 turbine which needs very little to get it going.


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[Turbo Keith]

Hey , I'm proud you chimed in , I hit you on facebook to give me a call and we can talk about it . I will PM you my number

 

[Mr.Spool]

have read where running a bigger turbo you can get the same HP with less boost ?

That's not going to happen.in order to see a gain with your combo you will have to be able to make more boost without killing the spool with the bigger turbo over what you have.an example would be a 49 on your car running 27psi then a 62 running 27psi will make the same power however in real street driving you would slow down because the 49 will light up alot faster and the car will accelerate sooner.only when the 49 runs out of breath will the larger 62 make more power at its usually at the back end of the track and not usually noticeable in street racing till up in 3rd gear.if you are prepared to run the 62 really hard and want to change out the converter to get the turbo response and are looking to do heads and cam down the road then it's a good choice.im sure Brian will explain the ins and outs of the combo potential when you guys speak.

 

[Turbo Keith]

Hey Thanks Mr Spool , I understand what your saying . I'm not gonna break the seal on the heads till I have to , and I hope I never blow a gasket , So I will probably keep running the 49 . My goals are low 11s to 7ish in the 8th and I think i'm there .

 

[Mr.Spool]

Hey Thanks Mr Spool , I understand what your saying . I'm not gonna break the seal on the heads till I have to , and I hope I never blow a gasket , So I will probably keep running the 49 . My goals are low 11s to 7ish in the 8th and I think i'm there .

Your welcomelow 11s are very attainable

 

[Turbo Keith]

That's not going to happen.in order to see a gain with your combo you will have to be able to make more boost without killing the spool with the bigger turbo over what you have.an example would be a 49 on your car running 27psi then a 62 running 27psi will make the same power however in real street driving you would slow down because the 49 will light up alot faster and the car will accelerate sooner.only when the 49 runs out of breath will the larger 62 make more power at its usually at the back end of the track and not usually noticeable in street racing till up in 3rd gear.if you are prepared to run the 62 really hard and want to change out the converter to get the turbo response and are looking to do heads and cam down the road then it's a good choice.im sure Brian will explain the ins and outs of the combo potential when you guys speak.

How do you know when your turbo gets out of breath ? Sorry probably a dumb question

 

[deezdad]

You'll get better answers than this but one way to look at it is when you run it for all it's worth and it fails to push the supporting components to their potential ie cam I/c injectors tc etc

 

[Turbo Keith]

You'll get better answers than this but one way to look at it is when you run it for all it's worth and it fails to push the supporting components to their potential ie cam I/c injectors tc etc

That makes sense

 

[Mr.Spool]

How do you know when your turbo gets out of breath ? Sorry probably a dumb question

There are a few different ways.on the racetrack when you turn the boost up it doesn't pick up any more mph with good converter slip numbers and operating in the rpm of the combo.looking at intank charge temps.not being able to make more boost on a high flowing combo.dropping boost as the rpm range goes higher.measuring boost pressure/back pressure ratio.looking at fuel usuage increases when turning up the boost.as more air is delivered more fuel is required.

 

[Mr.Spool]

On the street marking off a certain distance and look at et through that distance and mph gained.

 

[RUQWKNF]

How do you know when your turbo gets out of breath ? Sorry probably a dumb question

And the extreme way, is monitoring / logging exhaust back pressure before the turbo. IE: header pressure.
We were told a general rule of thumb, is once you reach a 2:1 ratio of back pressure vs boost, it's time to make a change. Turbine wheel size, turbine housing A/R change, timing change, camshaft, etc, etc. Many wrenches in the works at this point in the game.

Example:
So, if you're running 30psi and you have 60psi of back pressure before the turbo, chances are it's time to make a change.
Now if you're running 30psi and you have a lot less than 60psi, keep turning it up until you stop seeing a gain in trap speed mph as said before.
You just gotta be patient and make dang sure your tune is right when you start cranking it too max boost. Otherwise it's a quick way to become a member of the DOTC club and that's no fun.

 

[Turbo Keith]

Thank you guys for the feed back , helps me understand more

 

[1986 Buick GX1]

Is a TA58/58 turbo a good option for low 11's? It looks like it's rated about 50hp more than the TA49 and is available in a ball bearing version for faster spooling if needed.
It sounds like the TA62/62 spools quicker on E85, if switching is an option.

 

[RUQWKNF]

The newer TA58 CEA would be the replacement for a TA49 and it would support low 11's if pushed really hard. IMO, if you have a decent converter, get the TA6262 if you want low 11's and stock appearing without having to run 29psi. The converter requirements are really not that bad between the two (TA5858 vs TA6262) and you can also get the TA6262 in ball bearing as well. And for only a $20 MSRP price difference between a journal bearing TA58 CEA and a TA6262 CEA, get the 62. Spooling up quicker on E85 typically comes from being able to run higher timing and leaning out your fueling in 1st gear, a lot more than you normally could on regular 93 pump gas. The detonation levels are completely different with those fuels. Over the years I have seen many cars/people go from stock, to TA49, to TE44, etc, etc, chasing a goal. They could have saved themselves a ton of money and just skipped all of those turbos and went straight into a 6262 and been very happy. As admiral Akbar taught us, "It's a trap!"

IMHO, and I've said this since the Precision version first came out, the 6262 is the best "1st upgrade turbo" out there, when going from stock. Whether it's Bison's, or PTE's, you can't go wrong with either.


-Patrick-

 

[Turbo Keith]

The newer TA58 CEA would be the replacement for a TA49 and it would support low 11's if pushed really hard. IMO, if you have a decent converter, get the TA6262 if you want low 11's and stock appearing without having to run 29psi. The converter requirements are really not that bad between the two (TA5858 vs TA6262) and you can also get the TA6262 in ball bearing as well. And for only a $20 MSRP price difference between a journal bearing TA58 CEA and a TA6262 CEA, get the 62. Spooling up quicker on E85 typically comes from being able to run higher timing and leaning out your fueling in 1st gear, a lot more than you normally could on regular 93 pump gas. The detonation levels are completely different with those fuels. Over the years I have seen many cars/people go from stock, to TA49, to TE44, etc, etc, chasing a goal. They could have saved themselves a ton of money and just skipped all of those turbos and went straight into a 6262 and been very happy. As admiral Akbar taught us, "It's a trap!"

IMHO, and I've said this since the Precision version first came out, the 6262 is the best "1st upgrade turbo" out there, when going from stock. Whether it's Bison's, or PTE's, you can't go wrong with either.


-Patrick-

Hey , Thanks for the reply. I'm leaning towards the 6262 but I need a tranny and converter upgrade , They are still stock

 

[JP112_89]

Over the years I have seen many cars/people go from stock, to TA49, to TE44, etc, etc, chasing a goal. They could have saved themselves a ton of money and just skipped all of those turbos and went straight into a 6262 and been very happy. As admiral Akbar taught us, "It's a trap!"

IMHO, and I've said this since the Precision version first came out, the 6262 is the best "1st upgrade turbo" out there, when going from stock. Whether it's Bison's, or PTE's, you can't go wrong with either.


-Patrick-

X1000

 

[Mr.Spool]

The newer TA58 CEA would be the replacement for a TA49 and it would support low 11's if pushed really hard. IMO, if you have a decent converter, get the TA6262 if you want low 11's and stock appearing without having to run 29psi. The converter requirements are really not that bad between the two (TA5858 vs TA6262) and you can also get the TA6262 in ball bearing as well. And for only a $20 MSRP price difference between a journal bearing TA58 CEA and a TA6262 CEA, get the 62. Spooling up quicker on E85 typically comes from being able to run higher timing and leaning out your fueling in 1st gear, a lot more than you normally could on regular 93 pump gas. The detonation levels are completely different with those fuels. Over the years I have seen many cars/people go from stock, to TA49, to TE44, etc, etc, chasing a goal. They could have saved themselves a ton of money and just skipped all of those turbos and went straight into a 6262 and been very happy. As admiral Akbar taught us, "It's a trap!"

IMHO, and I've said this since the Precision version first came out, the 6262 is the best "1st upgrade turbo" out there, when going from stock. Whether it's Bison's, or PTE's, you can't go wrong with either.


-Patrick-

the 62 will need to be pushed a lot harder to see any gains over a 44 on a stock motor higher boost levels for one due to the ve of the stock motor.its mainly the stock heads and lower compression and lack of spring pressure.a 62/62 on lowered boost levels will get out ran on a stock motor vs. 44 until the 44 is tired of trying to push through those lousy heads but we are talking about 30+psi and mainly at then end of a run so if your 1/8 racing it's not needed and on the street footbraking off a lite the 49 will fire up like a supercharger.

 

[Mr.Spool]

The newer TA58 CEA would be the replacement for a TA49 and it would support low 11's if pushed really hard. IMO, if you have a decent converter, get the TA6262 if you want low 11's and stock appearing without having to run 29psi. The converter requirements are really not that bad between the two (TA5858 vs TA6262) and you can also get the TA6262 in ball bearing as well. And for only a $20 MSRP price difference between a journal bearing TA58 CEA and a TA6262 CEA, get the 62. Spooling up quicker on E85 typically comes from being able to run higher timing and leaning out your fueling in 1st gear, a lot more than you normally could on regular 93 pump gas. The detonation levels are completely different with those fuels. Over the years I have seen many cars/people go from stock, to TA49, to TE44, etc, etc, chasing a goal. They could have saved themselves a ton of money and just skipped all of those turbos and went straight into a 6262 and been very happy. As admiral Akbar taught us, "It's a trap!"

IMHO, and I've said this since the Precision version first came out, the 6262 is the best "1st upgrade turbo" out there, when going from stock. Whether it's Bison's, or PTE's, you can't go wrong with either.


-Patrick-

the 62 will need to be pushed a lot harder to see any gains over a 44 on a stock motor higher boost levels for one due to the ve of the stock motor.its mainly the stock heads and lower compression and lack of spring pressure.a 62/62 on lowered boost levels will get out ran on a stock motor vs. 44 until the 44 is tired of trying to push through those lousy heads but we are talking about 30+psi and mainly at then end of a run so if your 1/8 racing it's not needed and on the street footbraking off a lite the 49 will fire up like a supercharger.

 

[JP112_89]

Mr Spool are you reading manifold pressure?

62 is a way better option on a 3.8l. Especially over 22 psi compared to 49/44...way more efficient.

If you are reading manifold pressure you have to subtract atmospheric pressure which is 14.7 psi at sea level and drops as you climb to higher elevations. So I could read 36 psi MAP - atmosphere of 14.7 and get 22 psi "boost" (pressure above atmospheric pressure.

This is a common mistake and explains why some people think the Duramax gets 36 PSI of "boost". You are only getting 22 psi of "boost". To make things worse the GM service manual implies you get 36 psi of boost when they mean 36 psi of manifold pressure (above a vacuumpressure which is 14.7 psi at sea level and drops as you climb to higher elevations. So I could read 36 psi MAP - atmosphere of 14.7 and get 22 psi "boost" (pressure above atmospheric pressure).