Teflon center support rings

[Dave Levey]

Does any one have a part# for Teflon center support rings, all my catalogs list are cast iron pieces. A certain vendor was supposed to send me some but I guess they are still out of stock on them and no longer building transmissions themselves

 

[77 cruiser]

Chris has em.

Jim

 

[Lee Thompson]

Your lucky day

E-mail me your address and I will get 3 in the mail Monday. If you can wait that long, if not go to any trans shop and ask for stator support ring for a Chrysler 42LE --Reference # 8675729--2.062 in. OD (Teflon)
Or you could call Automatic Transmission Components (ATC) and ask for part #92181T. Probably should buy more than 3 as you could damage one installing. They may or may not sell you some as they are wholesale. If I send you some you will not owe me anything, just indebted to me forever.

 

[Lee Thompson]

idea

In case you have not used these before, they have to be resized as you have to stretch they over the shaft. I cut a piece of shim stock app. 2.5 X 12 and rolled into a cylinder, then used 3 rad. clamps to size them back down. Much like the old ring compressor.

 

[chris718]

there is a better ring for this job .it is the teflon 4l80e center support ring.it has a higher fiberglass content to reduce shrinkage.is white with green speckles.however there is something you should know about teflon rings on the center support.the forward drum and input shaft always should be outfitted with them but on the center support their usage is questionable.i have seen them get hot and shrink and cause clutch failure,this is not always the case but occasionally it will happen.the iron rings ,although they erode the i.d of the drum over time are a smarter choice if you want to be sure.

 

[Dave Levey]

Well thanks to every one that responded, I really do appreciate it. I was not aware there was a downside to the teflon rings. I thought they sealed better and did not wear into the drum. So I guess I might as well resurface my drum and use the steel rings. Nothing likr thinking you have a better way of doing things then finding it ain't so.

 

[2quiktocare]

Dave, you have mail

 

[WE4]

Sorry but...ahem...

Teflon servon is the only way to go. An iron ring will wear both surfaces and if it was truly understood how a teflon ring seals it would make sense. It uses oil behind the ring to seal. As far as melting, the rings I use have a melting point that is high enough that if they melt you got bigger issues than a bad sealing ring.


IMO

Bruce
WE4
PTS XTREME

 

[chris718]

i do understand how they seal ,but you never know what happens to the trans after it leaves you,and most are not informed enough about thermodynamics to place due emphasis on cooling,or the proper installation of teflon rings.ive seen iron rings eat through the drum and the clutches are still good.the teflon ring is .006 thousandths thinner than the iron and this causes ring float and loss of the oil during apply.perhaps if someone had the correct ring width they would be superior.there is a ring that is 95 thousandths which does fit properly,although disclosure is not going to happen.

 

[WE4]

Ha Ha Ha I didn't mean you...lol

I know you understand, I meant the general public. I guess I should have footnoted that .
But yes you are correct and we have had great success with them. Servon is basically a air compressor piston ring. If they will hold air, they sure as hell will hold fluid. They can be made to any size or spec.
I should have known Chris and excepted you, as I am well aware you know what is up. LOL

Guess I should have paid more attention in school to that Greek class so I could say something here but a great student I was not..

Later
WE4
PTS XTREME

 

[PaulRV6]

So does either of CK's rebuild kits include the correct teflon center support rings?
Or can you only get them from PTS?

Thanks
paul

 

[Otto J]

I have always used teh 4l80E center support rings
Had great luck with them

 

[chris718]

with iron rings something will eventually wear out.look at a cylinder wall after the motor has 100,ooo miles.thing is they do work but it very difficult to install them at home and the chances of something going wrong if it is overheated .iron gives you the security and if YOU GUYS WERE DUAL FEEDING THE DIRECT CLUTCH THE WAY IVE BEEN PREACHING IT THIS WOULDNT BE AN ISSUE.yes we do use teflon rings ,but as i stated before there benefits may be questionable to some extent .we are experimenting with a new ring gm released in new versions of a certain auto .they do work but for how long is the questiopn.if they are proven to be a winner ,we will let you know.

 

[ulose2av6]

NO NEED FOR CAPS

 

[Lee Thompson]

Chris/s manual

I assume this manual gives detailed info on dual feed. I would love to dual feed the present trans I currently have on the work bench. When can I expect to see the manual, or at least the info needed to dual feed direct?

 

[Otto J]

Lee give him a call, HE will walk you thru it, as he has done for many others.
But here is a run down as i know it
In the direct drum leave the lip seal out that goes inside the drum,Leave teh 2 on the piston intact.
Leave the center ring off the center support. (so now youll only have 2 rings on it)
Then while looking at the trans upside down(if you were standing from the tail looking forward to the pump.you have 2 bolts that hold in your center support, take the right bolt(on the shift linkage side) and either replace it with a allen bolt(metric) or weld the hole closed in the original.
Hope this helps

 

[Alky V6]

Interesting topic. I just have to add my two cents here. What I have found with cast iron vs. teflon rings is this:

Cast iron rings are designed to grab the bore of the drum and spin in the sealing ring groove. If it is desired to use cast iron rings in your 200-4R, use a brake hone to true the sealing ring bore and impart a cross hatch pattern or at least a rough surface of some sort. Because the cast iron ring has a pre-tension to the bore, it is slower to react when pressure is applied and side clearance to the sealing ring groove becomes critical. Using a cast iron ring with line pressures up to around 210 psi max has shown normal wear on the iron rings. Above 210, say 250 psi, the iron rings tend to grab the sealing ring groove and spin against the bore of the drum. This is evidenced by rapid wear to the face of the sealing ring that contacts the bore. Clutch failure will soon follow.

Teflon rings are designed to grab the sealing ring groove and spin against the sealing ring bore. Hence the narrow face commonly found on teflon rings. Less area to allow the ring to grab the bore when under pressure. Because the teflon ring is not pre-tensioned to the bore as the iron rings are, when hydraulic pressure is applied it immediately slams against the sealing ring groove wall and because of its flexibility, contours to any imperfections of the sealing ring groove wall and the sealing ring bore, providing a much better seal than a rigid ring could provide. One of the draw backs of teflon rings is the chance of the ring wearing an aluminum sealng ring groove. Sometimes floating metal will imbed into the teflon and act as a lathe on the aluminum material. I have not noticed that being a problem in the 200-4R. Another is shrinkage. Again, I personally have not seen that as a problem either. I can say, I have seen enough worn iron rings in high line pressure applications that it is well worth the risk to use teflon in those applications. I also use 4L80E center support rings.

 

[PaulRV6]

Chris at CK or anyone else who knows, does his rebuild kits provide teflon or cast iron rings that you are referring to? Thanks

paul

 

[LV GN]

im sure it will. just make sure to ask for them when ordering.

 

[chris718]

they have both .