Where has all the TH400 tech gone ?

[turbobitt]

I was getting board and decided to renew my interest in my variable stall project. I really don't like using the term Variable Stall since it implies some level of control and really has now variability but anyway I just completed my first prototype and ready for testing at CK performance transmission dyno. Hoping to get this done between X-mass and new year. I have the upmost confidence in the design and have no doubt it will work but I do have some questions on its effectiveness.

Below are some pictures of the VB installed. Basic principle is to manipulate the fluid flow feeding the converter charge circuit to cut flow on demand and then fill as quickly as possible once deactivated. I took it one step further and created a dump circuit for hopefully quicker RPM rise when building boost. Since Chris's VB is an integrated part of the system, I'm going to keep some of the major details to myself until dyno testing is complete. Then in car testing will be required to further prove out the design. I also have a control strategy that will work with the XFI and make it fully automatic operation so no extra buttons need to be pressed during the launch and pre staging routine.

Allan G.

 

[turbobitt]

Chris has been working hard to get us a Tech manual for some time. Every time he thinks its complete he finds more info to shove in. It will be worth the wait and may also include my variable stall modifications as posted in this thread.

He asked me to look over some pages and post here for a look inside the manual. This is only a very small portion of the manual but gives the idea to the level of detail and content. I will be making a trip to CK after X-mass to do some dyno testing on my Variable Stall prototype so I'll give some updates to anything I here when this manual will be ready.
Enjoy.....

 

[turbobitt]

Completed some more testing on the revised design of the switchable stall th400 today at CK performance. As of now the design and functionality seems solid. Will need to do some in car testing next to see if everything was worth the effort.
I took some pictures of the transmission mounted to the turret while we were switching the valve body out.

 

[turbobitt]

Short video showing RPM increase on a TH400 when the converter charge is turned on and off. Basically made more improvements on response since this was recorded. Gage in lower right corner is Charge pressure, Gage center right is line pressure, Charge flow immediately to the left of line pressure gage, RPM upper left.
AG.

 

[norbs]

Looks like it works well, any negative effects that you have seen so far?

 

[turbobitt]

Looks like it works well, any negative effects that you have seen so far?

Need to vehicle test next. Its not the first design out there but this one is my own.

Allan G.

 

[hungerbuhler1]

I think this is on my new 400. curious how it works.

 

[turbobitt]

This is the latest tested design. Just about everything integrates into the CK performance trans brake RMVB with no external lines. The hose shown in this photo is for test measurement purposes only.
Allan G.

 

[turbobitt]

Its been a busy winter and started plans on a Gen II design change that will make this even better. I have the current design working perfectly and I guess I can't leave well enough alone. The Gen II design will have a dedicated oil supply directly from the pump to supply oil to the charge/lube oil circuit instead of the current design that takes it from the line supply within the valve body. The benefit to this fill be less of a pressure drop across the valve body due to the increase flow demand from the charge circuit that would not normally be there. As with the Gen I design, it will all be self contained within the confines of the factory iron valve body with no additional oil lines, internal to the case or external.

Also made some really neat but small changes to the trans brake side of the valve body to make 3rd gear engage even faster. Very excited to do some testing and see some results. My 3rd gear pre-charge modification takes intermediate oil and pre-fills the direct circuit with a very small .028 feed orifice in the factory direct passage to force out any air and keep oil contained within trans brake direct circuit that would normally drain out the manual valve during acceleration and gravity forces. This pre-charge oil will simply dump out the manual valve in 2nd gear after displacing all the air voids in the circuit making it ready for a 3rd gear shift. As a desirable side effect the pre-charge modification will also vent oil in the trans brake circuit making it release even faster by serving as an addition dump by the trans brake shuttle valve in the valve body.

AG.

 

[V6sleeper]

Good stuff!

 

[turbobitt]

I also have a manual valve modification I been testing. I reduced the minor diameter and eliminated the large radii to increase flow around the valve. The below picture has two manual valves shown and are both modified the left one at final configuration.
I also attached a little right up on my pre-charge mod to the CK trans brake vale body. I wrote it up with a 2nd gear pre-charge but have no need to attempt that at this time.
AG.

 

[turbocamino1]

Quote : I really don't like using the term Variable Stall since it implies some level of control and really has now variability ..." Basic principle is to manipulate the fluid flow feeding the converter charge circuit to cut flow on demand and then fill as quickly as possible once deactivated" I am trying to figure how adjustability works? Flow to converter is changed/deactivated affecting stall and coupling, rite?... when you say "on demand" how do you control/minipulate this?

 

[turbobitt]

Quote : I really don't like using the term Variable Stall since it implies some level of control and really has now variability ..." Basic principle is to manipulate the fluid flow feeding the converter charge circuit to cut flow on demand and then fill as quickly as possible once deactivated" I am trying to figure how adjustability works? Flow to converter is changed/deactivated affecting stall and coupling, rite?... when you say "on demand" how do you control/minipulate this?

The oil flow is either turned on or off and no in-between so this is why I don't call it variable. When the device is turned on, and oil flow cut off to the converter, it will start to draw air from a vent port in the valve body. Much like the brake system in a car, it doesn't take much to raise the stall very quickly. It also appears to purge this air very quickly when the device is shut off and oil is allowed to flow into the converter. I believe part of this is due to the fact that the converter itself is acting as a pump and will try and draw oil from the supply. This suction from the converter aids in the response of the device. I have found it to be much more responsive than I ever thought.
The actual control strategy is easy, Power is applied at the same time as the trans brake and the FAST XFI interrupts that power at a predetermined RPM. For my application the shut-off RPM is 4400 and launch RPM is 5200. By the time it reaches launch RPM it is just about ready to go. During normal driving or racing, the devise can't be powered of without the trans brake power applied. This is just the way I choose to control it.
This project was started partly from curiosity and also a challenge from Bison. His challenge was that there has never been any significant data posted or success stories published. I know there are other working designs out there that exist under the patent radar but I wanted to share my results on this forum. Chris (CK Performance) has all the intention of publishing our design in his TH400 book that is well overdue. As of now I have a complete write-up detailing the modifications necessary to make this work.
AG.

 

[V6sleeper]

This is one of the better threads on here in a while..

 

[turbobitt]

This is one of the better threads on here in a while..

Thanks and I'll take that as a compliment if you don't mind... I but a lot of heart and soul into this project and been lucky enough to work with CK who has the same passion and drive to make things happen.
AG.

 

[turbobitt]

Some other changes I made this winter are lightweight forward and direct drums with the 2.10:1 gear set. I'm hoping to get some run data to see if it will make any improvements.
AG.

 

[V6sleeper]

Definitely a compliment , im no super expert but this is the kind of stuff that made me join this site few years ago after just trolling around here since 2003, the cool tech threads are getting scarce.

 

[turbobitt]

Tired of hand fabricating plates so I made a really good 3D Pro-Engineer model to be converted to a water jet friendly DXF file. Next step will be to get some plates made.

Allan G.

 

[Mike E]

I have a local shop that can do laser cut aluminum up to .090 cheap. With water jet you are going to have some garnet abrasive trash stuck in the cut. The laser cut aluminum is smooth as silk. Send me the .dxf or even a 3d model and I can get you a price on whatever quantity you want.

 

[turbobitt]

I have a local shop that can do laser cut aluminum up to .090 cheap. With water jet you are going to have some garnet abrasive trash stuck in the cut. The laser cut aluminum is smooth as silk. Send me the .dxf or even a 3d model and I can get you a price on whatever quantity you want.

Yes I'm interested. Will send you 2 files. Would like to get a quote for 10 of each.
Allan G.