which valve seal material?

[haywire4130]

hello all, i'm doing my homework before ordering rebuild parts, it's quite the process, lots of choices. quick history: engine was built 1k miles before i bought the car... previous owner thought the alky was optional and ran the tank dry at 26 psi. needless to say, it toasted the cometic gasket around the #1 cyl, and hammered the rod bearings pretty hard, hence the tear down. it has forged pistons on polished stock rods, crank is std./ std. and remarkably still looks good, 212 cam, girdle, and ported heads with stainless valves which brings me to the first of many questions: a few of the valve stem seals are torn, the top half with the spring ripped off and is floating on the valve stem about half way up. is there a "best" seal to use (rubber, teflon or viton)? is this a common problem? they look like rubber oem style to me but i havent removed one yet. possibly interference from the valve springs? any info would be appreciated!

 

[TurboDave]

It's a common problem IF they were installed on the exhaust valves. The stock heads were not designed to run seals on the exhaust side. It rips them in half.

Not a problem I've heard much about on the intake valves though,

 

[haywire4130]

hmm, i'll have to check, i bet it was the exhausts though, i believe they all had seals on them. so dont run any exhaust seals at all? while i'm there, should i replace the intake ones and if so, which material is best (i'm just wondering the pros and cons of each kind)

 

[TurboDave]

The advice given to me by Richard Clark and other experts is to use the blue Fel-Pro seals, part no. SS 72527.
It's actually a V8 set, so you'll have some extras. They're Viton.

 

[haywire4130]

sounds good, thanks i had to do a ton of side work to fund this project, i can kinda only afford to do it once and do it right! i'm sure i'll have a ton more "which part should i buy" questions along the way.

 

[TurboBob]

the heads need to be set up for seals on the exhaust side.

Stock heads do not have exhaust seals, and the valve has an extra groove to keep the oil out.

To run exhaust seals, you need to run valves without the extra groove, like Dave said.

Bob

 

[TurboDave]

And the exhaust guides have to be shaved down to the same height as the intake guides, if you want to go to all that trouble.

 

[neilb]

I've been having the same problem. I've replaced the exhaust valve seals twice now, and they are all torn up now again. I figured I would need different valves when I saw the groove in the valve stem. Where can I get replacement valves without those grooves?

 

[charlief1]

For a stock replacement you can use SBI part number 01710. The parts are supplied by Eaton from what the box says.

 

[ek02]

Haywire4130, if your valves are aftermarket stainless, they should only have grooves for the keepers. Stock valves have the undercut stem that rips seals. Only the intakes have seals on stock heads, and the exhaust guides are tall to control oil without seals. If the tops of your guides are already machined on the intakes and exhausts, you will only need seals replaced. The guides have probably already been cut by whoever ported the heads, if you have any kind of lift in that cam. I like the viton seals also. They last.

 

[haywire4130]

Haywire4130, if your valves are aftermarket stainless, they should only have grooves for the keepers. Stock valves have the undercut stem that rips seals. Only the intakes have seals on stock heads, and the exhaust guides are tall to control oil without seals. If the tops of your guides are already machined on the intakes and exhausts, you will only need seals replaced. The guides have probably already been cut by whoever ported the heads, if you have any kind of lift in that cam. I like the viton seals also. They last.

thats exactly what i'm thinking, i'm gonna tear into them this week to check and measure. thanks!

 

[haywire4130]

pulled the heads apart today. they have white teflon seals on all the valves, three of them were torn. the valves are indeed stainless with no grooves on the exhausts other than for the keepers, and the valve guides are all the same height. also got an up close look at how heavily ported the heads are, very impressed! the teflon seals seem pretty brittle, i think i'm going to install the blue viton ones recommended above and run it

 

[Jerryl]

Old thread, same question since I only want to do this once.
http://www.jegs.com/i/Fel-Pro/375/SS-72623/10002/-1?parentProductId=

Fel Pro SS-72623 is supposedly for the Buick V6.
Car has aftemarket valves.
What is the correct number?
What are those seals (??) to the right on the picture for?

 

[RmvBfrFlght]

The square cut o-rings to the right are an upper seal. With valves that have two grooves near the retainer, that seal goes into the lower groove and seals between the valve stem and retainer. It prevents the oil that drips off the rocker tip from running down the valve stem.

RemoveBeforeFlight

 

[Jerryl]

The square cut o-rings to the right are an upper seal. With valves that have two grooves near the retainer, that seal goes into the lower groove and seals between the valve stem and retainer. It prevents the oil that drips off the rocker tip from running down the valve stem. . . . . .

Thanks.
Guess I will stop by the machine shop to determine which PN to use.

 

[haywire4130]

Thanks.
Guess I will stop by the machine shop to determine which PN to use.

sorry for the delay, i was away for the week. if you have aftermarket valves without the grooves (like i have) that set won't work. i ended up using comp cams viton/metal body seals on the intake and exhaust. i ordered them from summit, part number cca-517-12 which is a bag of 12, i also got 4 individual ones #cca-517-1 in case i screwed up any installing them (which i did on a couple hahaha). they are really well made and have a real slender profile metal body so they don't snag on the springs, which is what ended up destroying the teflon ones that were on my heads to begin with (mentioned when i originally posted this thread). the comps are holding up great after 5k miles if you order them, quadruple check the outside diameter of your seat where the seal goes around as well as the diameter of your valves and compare them against the measurements on the summit site just to make sure. my heads have been ported and im not sure what else may have been machined on them by the previous owner before i got them. hope this helps!

 

[Jerryl]

........ if you have aftermarket valves without the grooves (like i have) that set won't work. i ended up using comp cams viton/metal body seals on the intake and exhaust. i ordered them from summit, part number cca-517-12 ...........!

Thanks for posting the info!

 

[haywire4130]

Not a problem, I felt bad cuz saw it on my phone while I was away but had to check my receipts when I got home for the part numbers

 

[Jerryl]

Not a problem, I felt bad cuz saw it on my phone while I was away but had to check my receipts when I got home for the part numbers

It is not your reponsibility to provide the info I am looking for . . . so thanks a LOT!!!