Who has a sy/ty motor in their t-type/gn?

[87grandnational]

Or has anyone ever thought of this?

Is this GM's modded version of the 4.1? or is it another engine altogether?

If its a stock production block.. couldnt you stroke/bore it out and have somewere around a 4.7L motor?

Just wondering, I searched and couldnt find anything about it so i thought i just pop the questions up.

thanks anyway

- cody

 

[CTX-SLPR]

Completely different engine. A 4.1 is simply a 3.8L with 3.965" bores instead of 3.800" and the same 3.4" stroke. Both of these engines, the 4.1 and 3.8, are based off the architecture of the old Buick 350 small block, basically a 3/4 V8. Likewise the 4.3 is 3/4 of a 350 SBC as far as architecture is concerned, ie 4.00" bore and 3.47" stroke. The Sy/Ty stuff is also water intercooled vs the air to air of the LC2.
As far as I know, the blocks are no different from anyother 4.3L V6 and are production pieces. They make stroker cranks and such like the Stage Buick stuff left over from the days of the V6 NASCAR Busch series engines though the Chevy never went IRL.
I have no idea what you are getting at and/or asking so this is just some basic information, for more I suggest googleing it or asking in the Sy/Ty forum.

 

[novaderrik]

the 4.3 is nothing more than a 350 Chevv missing a middle cylinder on each side. it is a very durable and relatively powerful package with a LOT of parts available for it for prices that a Turbo Buick guy would think are a bit on the cheap side due to it's many parts that swap with the most common engine in the world. but the turbo upgrade parts would cost about as much as equivalent turbo Buick parts, or maybe more expensive due to less demand.
as for whether anyone has put a turbo 4.3 in a GN- why would they do that? a better swap would be a turbo 3.8 in a SY-Ty- which would be a bolt in deal with a set of 4X4 S-10 2.8 engine mounts- but finding a 700r4 tranny with the Buick bellhousing might be a bit of a bitch, but that's why Trans-Dapt makes adapter plates.

 

[bruce]

Originally posted by 87grandnational
Or has anyone ever thought of this?

The Sy's use the Chevy 4.3L

Swapping a *truck* engine into a car, is never going to get past a smog station, and that's the big problem. No one knows how crazy the EPA may get in the future.

The 4.3L instead of having headgaskets as the fuse in the system, will live right till you blow the bottom end out of it. For the well experienced tuner, that's not to big of deal, but for the new guy trying to go fast, if one gives into the temptation of boost, it can get $$$$$$$

While the Sy ecm and code is pretty slick, there's also a few spots that can take some work to get right to make it really friendly.
I've run my GN on the Sy ecm, and spent some serious time in getting the code really right for car use.

The G Bodies did some with 4.3L TBI engines for a while so you can get the parts to make it a bolt-in, thou I'm not sure if the Sy headers would work.

Nope, never thought of doing that..........

 

[TurboTR]

Yes that would be a bitchin' v6... I think you can build them up to over 300 ci with little trouble. Not to mention 18 deg bowtie heads and many other parts for 'em, still available <drool>

TurboTR

 

[Drac0nic]

The temptation to go to extra cubes is there, but unless you're gonna put a lot of money into it forget it. Buicks have good rods, for a 4.3L you're talkin about buying a set of eagles outa the chute if you're gonna make serious power. Tthe stocker EFI systems on all but the Sy/Tys leave a lot to be desired. Expect to mod an intake for port injection, or spend in the order of several hundred for a Sy/Ty intake, then have it modded for the 96+ vortecs. A lot of Sy/Tyers also don't like using anything short of nodular caps (Sy/Tys were nodular stock) if not 4 bolt billet caps, I know of a TT 4.3L that was in the high 9s with just studs however. The other thing is that caps are considerably cheaper since they're 350 caps. You're gonna have to build headers too, also a lot of work. Admittedly the numbers I've seen on worked Vortec heads are frickin sweet as hell at .5 and below lift and you can probably make up a lot of difference in the valvetrain department. A set of Chevy 350 mounts won't work with a 4.3L, the mounting position is different. Bellhousing issues are easy as a $50 plate from summit, what I'll be doing with my swap eventually. (going from a 4.3L to a Buick 3.8) If you've got a good 3.8L configuration I'd stick with that and get parts for it, if you're looking for something "all out" a 4.3L may be a good choice, especially if you're gonna use an aftermarket system like DFI with it. As far as the 4.3L being a "truck" motor, they did use it in B-bodies and the last of the el caminos.

 

[TurboTR]

Wouldn't it be sweet to have factory support like this for our cars??

For example:

10134371 V6 Aluminum Block
This new and best-ever V6/90º aluminum block is improved to withstand the ever increasing power levels that today's racing is imposing. This new design is shipped with 3.980" bore and will accommodate 4.125" cylinder bores and 4.00" stroke crankshafts. This offers the flexibility to build engines ranging from 3.0-liters (180 cid) to more than 5.2-liters (320 cid). The block is designed for standard 2.45" diameter (350 cid small-block) main bearing inserts. The new block is cast from prime ingot A-356 aluminum and heat treated to T-6 specifications, providing an ultimate strength of 37,500 psi. The deck surface is .620" thick and the front and rear bulkheads are reinforced. The head bolt holes are blind-tapped to eliminate coolant leaks. The flared head bolt bosses can be drilled to full depth for full HO turbocharged applications. New four-bolt main bearing caps were designed for the block. They are machined from 4340 chrome-moly steel and their mating surfaces are precision ground. The oil system has been upgraded to provide trouble-free lubrication at high rpm. It features V8-style oiling with three oil galleries above the cam tunnel. There are no provisions for a mechanical fuel pump. Eliminating the fuel pump boss significantly improves coolant flow. These blocks weigh 74 lbs.
Technical Notes: This is a two piece style rear main seal.

http://www.gmgoodwrench.com/perfpartsjsp/partlist.jsp?cat=9314&section=ep

or heads:

http://www.gmgoodwrench.com/perfpartsjsp/partlist.jsp?cat=9315&section=ep

Schweeet

TurboTR

 

[bruce]

Originally posted by Drac0nic
Tthe stocker EFI systems on all but the Sy/Tys leave a lot to be desired.

Can you expound on that?.

 

[CTX-SLPR]

The 4.3 in the B-body is a baby LT1 called an L99, uses basically the same setup but has tiny bores and a shorter stroke. From what I've read about the Vortec V6 heads is that they are only good if you compare them to something that very crappy. Basically the flow numbers out of a ported set of 96+ Vortecs are only up to LO5 305 SBC stock head numbers but as we all know Booste is the great equalizer, but airflow is still king. As far as headers are concerned... well get a set of stock replacement headers from some aftermarket manufacturer, I bet ATR sells them but I'm not willing to look that one up, and do what those of us who are going hybrid do, cut and splice them till they clear. If anything if they will clear a stock cramped AWD front end on a Sy/Ty, it should be fairly easy to make them fit in the comparatively caverous engine bay of a G-body. One other thing... most if not all TH200-4Rs have universal bellhousings meaning you can bolt it right up to your existing tranny.

Thanks,

 

[Drac0nic]

Originally posted by bruce
Can you expound on that?.

The 85s used carb, the 86-92 used TBI, the 92-95 used CPI and the 96+es used a central point multiport fuel injection system, no other 4.3L based vehicle except the Sy/Tys were set up for multiport injection using standard injectors. Not exactly like a GN, plunk in some 60s and you're set.

 

[Ormand]

Sounds like a good project for someone who has a Monte or maybe an El Camino, and wants to keep it "all chevy". Wouldn't be cheap, but you could go for big inches, and use lower boost, go get a good torque monster to run on pump gas. If you just happen to have a bunch of chevy parts lying around, that might help. Pistons, rods, timing chains, lifters, rockers, etc, stuff that can be swapped from the 8 to the 6, should be relatively cheap and easy to find.

 

[bruce]

Originally posted by Drac0nic
The 85s used carb, the 86-92 used TBI, the 92-95 used CPI and the 96+es used a central point multiport fuel injection system, no other 4.3L based vehicle except the Sy/Tys were set up for multiport injection using standard injectors. Not exactly like a GN, plunk in some 60s and you're set.

You're statements are rather misleading in some ways. You left out the part about just talking about the 4.3Ls.

While not exactly like a GN, you can use a Sy/Ty ecm to run a GN. Doing that allows for tunning a MAP/SD system instead of MAF, thou at the expense of SEFI.