XFI: New motor-will not start.

[karolko]

Possibly but I would also confirm there is an ignition strategy checked off as well. This is a big one.


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Yeah, IPU/XIM is checked off.

would inductive delay play apart in not wanting to start?

 

[turbobitt]

Yeah, IPU/XIM is checked off.

would inductive delay play apart in not wanting to start?

Don't think so. Also make sure the XIM dwell override is not checked off. If so, it will default to the XFI tables that are pre populated with garbage data.
AG


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[karolko]

yes, XIM dwell override is not checked off.

 

[turbobitt]

yes, XIM dwell override is not checked off.

I would say your good to go as long as the rest of your previous tune is loaded in. Guess we have to wait 2 weeks to find out.
AG.

 

[Lance]

Did you install the 2.0 option file? If that option is not installed, the ECU will ignore the crank signal input. You can check by selecting View | Display ECU Configuration. The 2.0 checkbox will be checked if the 2.0 option is installed correctly.

 

[turbobitt]

Did you install the 2.0 option file? If that option is not installed, the ECU will ignore the crank signal input. You can check by selecting View | Display ECU Configuration. The 2.0 checkbox will be checked if the 2.0 option is installed correctly.

It was unclear from the OP but I didn't get the impression he was updating from pre 2.0.
AG


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[karolko]

Lance and Allan,

The XFI was already flashed and working as on 2.01 software before I flashed it to 2.051

unfortunetly I am away from the car so I cannot plug into the xfi to verify what you are mentioning Lance, but I can't see the 2.051 flash screwing that up can it?

 

[Lance]

I can't see the 2.051 flash screwing that up can it?

Doubtful. Also make sure that the crank and cam LEDs on both the XFI and XIM are flashing illuminated when cranking.

 

[karolko]

Hi Lance,

Yes I did that. both the cam and crank signals are flashing on both boxes and the injectors are flashing bank to bank during cranking.

I really hope it was those two tables ( FEC and individual fuel tables that is causing my no start issue.

You would be the one to answer this: would those two table effect anything during cranking? I thought the only table being used for fuel is the cranking table during cranking? How about the injector offset vs battery voltage...Is that table being used during cranking?

Adrian

 

[Lance]

The cranking fuel table forms the base pulse width during cranking. Since cranking fuel is only used while in bank to bank mode, no individual cylinder corrections can be applied. When cranking, BPW is only modified by the fuel energy constant and fuel pressure correction. The result is stored in the gross pulse width variable (GPW sensor). Easy to monitor and check...

 

[karolko]

Thanks for great explanation Lance. This is making more and more sense. Since the FEC was maxed out I can understand why the a/f was so rich when cranking and that it did not change even if I completely zeroed it out. Hopefully this solves my issue.

When I go to crank this thing over next time I plan on data logging the event: can you give me a list of all the important things you would want to datalog and watch to determine what my issue could be IF I cannot get it to start this next time.

Thanks again for the explanation and help.

Adrian

 

[karolko]

okay update guys, I finally got home and had a chance to upload my adjusted tune: and I managed to make it fire.

I can only keep the car running for 1-2 seconds: it hums at 2k and then immediately shuts off.

I asked Cal and he quickly told me that it could very well be my 5 bar map sensor; so here is my follow-up question:

How many of you guys have had to adjust the calibration on your 5 bar map sensors?

With my old 3 bar I have 89Kpa with the car not running, and with the 5 bar it shows 48 not running and for the brief moment that it is, it reads 16 Kpa.

I want to thank everyone who has helped me out with my issues once again. I'm almost there, just in time for the snow

Adrian Karolko

 

[turbobitt]

What 5 bar sensor are you using ? I found most of the default map files to not so accurate for the AEM sensors. If you have an AEM sensor I can send you a corrected file. Should read near 98-100 KPA engine off.
Also, If I'm reading your post correctly, it sounds like you changed the map sensor without updating the Map calibration file. This is really bad. You will have to also adjust and rescale your tables and make adjustments accordingly. For example, with a 3 bar map, the XFI will scale the tables with 3 bar being the maximum value. Switching to a 5 bar the tables will have most likely new map values in each row so the VE numbers will need to be shifted or adjusted to the new scale. Same for timing tables.
Allan G.

 

[lazaris]

Allan is correct. When you change your map sensor you will have to re-do your VE table even though you have the re scaled map table.

 

[karolko]

What 5 bar sensor are you using ? I found most of the default map files to not so accurate for the AEM sensors. If you have an AEM sensor I can send you a corrected file. Should read near 98-100 KPA engine off.
Also, If I'm reading your post correctly, it sounds like you changed the map sensor without updating the Map calibration file. This is really bad. You will have to also adjust and rescale your tables and make adjustments accordingly. For example, with a 3 bar map, the XFI will scale the tables with 3 bar being the maximum value. Switching to a 5 bar the tables will have most likely new map values in each row so the VE numbers will need to be shifted or adjusted to the new scale. Same for timing tables.
Allan G.

Hi Allan,

The MAP is a FAST 5 Bar ( so basically a SSI Technologies Sensor)

As for the fuel and spark tables, they should be 100% okay, as this is a completely new tune for a new motor. I was referencing the 3 bar map sensor with my last motor and tuneup. ( I had a historical datalog of me cranking the car so I could get exact numbers). And since the Kpa numbers should be the same regardless of which map sensor you use, I am pretty sure that I need to recalibrate the sensor.

How much different would the map calibration file be from a 5 bar AEM to a 5 bar FAST sensor? I was really under the impression that they are infact all rebadged SSI Sensors. Correct me if I am wrong.

Adrian

 

[karolko]

you know what...now that I actually look at the fuel and spark tables, the Y axis only goes up to 325 KPa. under system config, the is set to 5 bar so I would have assumed it would have changed the Y axis accordingly. Is this a glitch?

Adrian

 

[turbobitt]

I'm not familiar with the Fast 5 bar but if it's reading as low as your saying then something is wrong.
As far as the y axis, that could be just the way it was scaled by the tuner assuming you didn't do it. Typically if you change from a 3 bar to a 5 bar map the system will change the y axis scale and could be changed by the tuner.
AG


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[karolko]

Allan one question for you:

is your 5 bar graph a straight linear line? Or does it have multiple points/slopes to it.

 

[turbobitt]

Allan one question for you:

is your 5 bar graph a straight linear line? Or does it have multiple points/slopes to it.

Mine is linear and the x axis voltage numbers are equally spaced such that the linear line represents linear output from the sensor.
AG


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[karolko]

Huh, would you be able to take a snapshot of the table so I have it for reference sake.

I will be calling fast tomorrow and seeing what they say about their sensor calibrations. Will let you know what I find.