100lb valve springs and wiped lobes

[Turbo Steve]

I upgraded to some Kirban 100lb springs and all is well.My question is could the possible increase in spring pressure decrease the lifter spin resulting in a wiped lobe? These buick V6's are some durable engines in stock trim and only seem to take out lobes when modded.

 

[Steve V]

Yes, it could. I try to keep my pressure to #85 closed-90 max. I would also use his ZDDP in your oil. You maybe okay.

 

[mikestertwo]

If you are running a stock cam then I would go with new stock springs. No point in stressing things when it's not needed. JMHO

 

[conn84gn]

Where can you get stock springs?

 

[mikestertwo]

Where can you get stock springs?

TRW makes stock replacement springs. Just about any auto parts store should be able to get them.

 

[87NAT]

I bought my GN with some Easten Performance heads already installed. My car has 35k and the heads were installed at about 22k miles by the previous owner back in 1994. Long story short: I have done many mods to my including the 6776dbb turbo, converter the list goes on and on. The car never felt like it should have. I new even with a stock cam my car should run better. After many months and many $$ I took the next step.

I pulled my engine and low and behold EVERY single lobe on my cam was worn along with the lifters. The valve springs however were great..too great actually. They all had 100-104 #'s of pressure. Over the course of a few years and a few miles the high spring pressure wore down the cam. I am not going to argue with anyone ove this. Some say this cant or wont happen. Maybe some better oil would have saved the cam... but you cant cry over spilled milk. The point is the springs KILLED my cam. Put the low pressure(stock) pressure.

Happy ending: New motor, new roller cam and the car will fry the ET Streets at 35 mph like it has Gatorbacks instead of sticky tires.

 

[Turbo Steve]

I just ordered a roller kit and while i'm in there a set of champ iron heads

 

[TurboDave]

I upgraded to some Kirban 100lb springs and all is well.My question is could the possible increase in spring pressure decrease the lifter spin resulting in a wiped lobe? These buick V6's are some durable engines in stock trim and only seem to take out lobes when modded.

While it's possible, I doubt the 100# springs will have that effect. Just remember to leave the mounting "cups" out of the equation.
I mounted those same springs back about 40,000 miles or so, and haven't suffered any ill effects.
I don't bother with any of that ZDDP crap in any of my cars either. Hasen't seemed to hurt a thing. Let's see, 170,000 on my 86, 150,000 on my 87, and 103,000 on my 84 Z28, 150,000 on my powerstroke. Maybe I'll also get hit by lightning tomorrow.

 

[conn84gn]

I think I've lost a cam for the second time in two years about 10,000 miles each time.
New motor is a roller and if I rebuild the old motor it will have a roller.

 

[SPOOLFOOL2]

Yep, I'm doing a Roller cam upgrade right now. I put Champion ported irons with heavier springs on my car a few months ago, and got a wiped lobe last week. Run a zinc additive, and you "may" be allright.

Happy spooling

Mike

 

[Scooter3800]

While it's possible, I doubt the 100# springs will have that effect. Just remember to leave the mounting "cups" out of the equation.
I mounted those same springs back about 40,000 miles or so, and haven't suffered any ill effects.
I don't bother with any of that ZDDP crap in any of my cars either. Hasen't seemed to hurt a thing. Let's see, 170,000 on my 86, 150,000 on my 87, and 103,000 on my 84 Z28, 150,000 on my powerstroke. Maybe I'll also get hit by lightning tomorrow.

I'm not sure what to think of the ZDDP stuff either - I'm still debating Dyno oil or synthetic...

 

[bison]

Ive seen 2 stock cams fail unexpectedly in the last few years for no reason other than the lack of ZDDP. Both were on the 3ex. position. If the cam is already broken in the spring replacement wont hurt it. Id definitely add ZDDP though. Some blocks are worse than others and the 3 exhaust will get worn because of it.

 

[Turbo Steve]

well besides the power increase I can sleep at night too :biggrin:

 

[turbojd]

I' ve had a set of Kirbans LT1 100lb. valve springs on my GN for 10 yrs. now with no problems. Only oil I have used with GN is Mobil 1 full synthetic 10w-30 I just started adding the ZDDP to my oil also for peace of mind!

 

[87GNTTOP]

Comp Cam 980 Springs

I am getting ready to change my springs on my 87 GN. Therefore, I did alot of reading using the search engine on the board.

I found a majority of turbo buick owners, recommend the Comp Cam 980 springs when utilizing a stock original cam.

 

[87NAT]

While it's possible, I doubt the 100# springs will have that effect. Just remember to leave the mounting "cups" out of the equation.
I mounted those same springs back about 40,000 miles or so, and haven't suffered any ill effects.
I don't bother with any of that ZDDP crap in any of my cars either. Hasen't seemed to hurt a thing. Let's see, 170,000 on my 86, 150,000 on my 87, and 103,000 on my 84 Z28, 150,000 on my powerstroke. Maybe I'll also get hit by lightning tomorrow.

Dave, As always I appreciate your input on any subject on these boards.:smile: I always learn a little something.

Could you tell me what wore my camshaft and lifters down if it wasnt my high pressure springs that were installed before I bought the car. I always thought that is what did it..if it wasnt then what happened? I didnt have any "wiped" out lobes per se..they were all just a little rounded. Please let me know what you think.
Ed

 

[Turbo Steve]

Ed, off topic for a sec but what head gaskets on your new engine? i'm either going 9441pt or RJC steels

 

[getchasum]

I’ve been on the board prior to Crash & 2000 and I have definitely witness a steady increase of “My cam lobes are wiped” threads over the years. My thoughts on it are this, I believe in the GM EOS as an oil supplement for flat tappet cam engines and if it’s not available I’ll use some form of a ZDDP additive as a preventive measure of insurance. I consider an extra $10 spent an oil change very cheap insurance when you consider cost & time of what’s required to pull and build an engine correctly. I also believe any time a set of 100# springs are thrown on a used cam is like playing Russian roulette, threads out there to prove it. But the biggest thing that makes me cringe is when I witness the guys that swap a used cam & lifters from engine to engine. I like to follow those just to see how long it is before they post my cam lobes are wiped, why gamble what’s at stake for the few dollars saved. I mean darn, the SpeedPro cam kit from many vendors is only $130. One of my flat tappet engines may have started wiping as I’ve posted this, but it will not be from the above concerns mentioned.

 

[87NAT]

Ed, off topic for a sec but what head gaskets on your new engine? i'm either going 9441pt or RJC steels

9441.

 

[GARY HARVEY]

The tree huggers have won... and

zink and sulfer are (for months) not in off the shelf oils.
Rotella works great, easy to find and it's cheap and one of the few oils that continue to have EP additive in their blend package.

A additive (at least for break in purposes) is needed. Pre mixing the break-in additave is suggested and pre-lube before starting.
Spinning an engine without plugs to pre-lube in NOT a good idea.

Don't idle a engine with a fresh cam shaft... how is it going to get ANY oil?

100 lb. springs are not causing problems, lack of proper lubricants and improper start and break-in will kill a freshly installed cam in any engine, no matter what spring pressure.

After break in and without EP additives in oils, using some type of racing oil or a EP additive would be a BIG positive to any engine.