Aluminum vs Cast Iron heads

[bison]

I love my TA heads and I believe they will flow better then your irons right out the box
.View attachment 274358

The exhaust didn't on the ones I've seen flowed though they came right up with light work.


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[Nick Micale]

The internet is full of BS and opinions stated as facts, and this thread has many replies that prove this point?

You have to be really stupid or stubborn to run iron modified stock heads in the low 9's, much less into the 8's.

HP is made by fuel and air, so the more air you can get into the combustion chamber, the more power you can make.

Since boost is restriction, less is better since compressing air quickly adds lots of heat which is not wanted in the combustion process.

The fact is alum heads have considerably larger ports and valves, more air can be moved and it will be cooler when entering the combustion chamber because of less boost.

Alum heads also dissipate heat better than iron heads, you can use more boost or compression than iron heads. All modern performance engines run alum heads with high compression compared the old muscle cars.

As far as pricing, that is more BS, max ported iron heads done right will cost about $1500, a set of new TA alum heads out-of-the-box with little clean up will out flow the irons by 50%. Basic cost of a complete set of TA heads is $1800.

Good flowing heads is the cheapest HP you can purchase!

One other BS statement on alum heads is they do not respond well in street driving. We have replaced many iron heads with alum, and NEVER seen any drop in street performance, just the contrary.

Of all the performance mods on our turbo cars, alum heads is an item that in most all cases will add value to the car because it is visible proof, not someone's sales pitch about their iron heads that my be ported with larger valves or not!

 

[forcefed3.8's]

There is no doubt that aluminum heads are better, but at what point? Will it help a car that runs 10.8s with a 6262? Not really, and there is probably a place where the money could be better spent.

 

[johnplogii]

You have to be really stupid or stubborn to run iron modified stock heads in the low 9's, much less into the 8's.

Wow!

 

[Mike T]

Johnplogi, I've been researching your car a bit and as I understand it your running a set of DLS heads?? If so.... would you be willing to share flow numbers if you happen to have them?

Sorry if this is asking too much but I'm very intrigued by your car and Dan is a great guy.

 

[johnplogii]

The exhaust side could use some more work

 

[Mike T]

View attachment 274394


The exhaust side could use some more work

Wow!!! I didn't expect you to share this kind of information!!!!!! Outstanding!

As far as the exhaust.. you shouldn't change a thing because you have run the numbers and that proves that the heads are doing their job.

 

[Mike T]

Impressed....excellent things going on there. The heads are flowing very well by mid lift and maintain this all the way to .600, he wasn't just going for high flow numbers... this was a well executed and thought out plan.

 

[forcefed3.8's]

This is good info. I am looking for a shop close by with a flow bench. I have my small valve GN1s with tall ports, std GN1rs and tall port GN1rs I would like to get done.

 

[TurboWh1]

The internet is full of BS and opinions stated as facts, and this thread has many replies that prove this point?

You have to be really stupid or stubborn to run iron modified stock heads in the low 9's, much less into the 8's.

HP is made by fuel and air, so the more air you can get into the combustion chamber, the more power you can make.

Since boost is restriction, less is better since compressing air quickly adds lots of heat which is not wanted in the combustion process.

The fact is alum heads have considerably larger ports and valves, more air can be moved and it will be cooler when entering the combustion chamber because of less boost.

Alum heads also dissipate heat better than iron heads, you can use more boost or compression than iron heads. All modern performance engines run alum heads with high compression compared the old muscle cars.

As far as pricing, that is more BS, max ported iron heads done right will cost about $1500, a set of new TA alum heads out-of-the-box with little clean up will out flow the irons by 50%. Basic cost of a complete set of TA heads is $1800.

Good flowing heads is the cheapest HP you can purchase!

One other BS statement on alum heads is they do not respond well in street driving. We have replaced many iron heads with alum, and NEVER seen any drop in street performance, just the contrary.

Of all the performance mods on our turbo cars, alum heads is an item that in most all cases will add value to the car because it is visible proof, not someone's sales pitch about their iron heads that my be ported with larger valves or not!

As far as my goals. My car is not a full blown race car and probably never will be.... Yet, My aspirations are to have a really fast street car that I can drive to the track once a month and run a heads up index class. I probably will be installing a cage in the near future so I don’t get kicked out plus the wife is on my A$$ to not die in the car. She knows I have the go fast addiction much like you all!!

As far my car.... I'm not even running roller rockers-not that it matters, the Aluminium head price doesn’t scare me if it allows me to make more power at lower boost. I try not to test the limits of my set up which seems to be making the engine live longer. I may push it a little harder once I have a cage. I'll be honest, I’m a little afraid to get crazy with the boost on pump gas and alky. I haven’t had any issues yet. Its just a little unnerving since I'm tuning with prehistoric stuff.

 

[Nick Micale]

There is no doubt that aluminum heads are better, but at what point? Will it help a car that runs 10.8s with a 6262? Not really, and there is probably a place where the money could be better spent.

Over 15 years ago we demonstrated the performance improvement of alum vs. worked iron heads.

A local car with a TA-49 and a few other mods was very consistent at the 12.0 level. NHRA then allowed car to run at 11.50 w/o a roll bar and the owner wanted to easily run at that level.

We installed a set of Champion GN-1's with no porting and no others changes to the car, it ran a 11.50 the first time at the track!

After selling his iron heads, this proved to be a very in-expensive way to immediately gain 1/2 a second in performance, especially for a mainly street car.

I understand opinions are posted frequently, but I qualify my comments based upon actual experience ,or my guess depending on the discussion, but it is always differentiated between the 2.

 

[Nick Micale]

View attachment 274394


The exhaust side could use some more work

That is where the TA alum heads far outshine and flow much better than iron heads as only minimal porting is needed on the exhaust side.

When the design for the TA heads was under way, Kenny D. did some flow bench work, and helped on the redesign of these heads which resulted in improved flow, especially on the exhaust side.

 

[forcefed3.8's]

I have had no problems going low 11s, high 10s on stock unported heads and a TE44. 9.8s@137 with lightly ported stock heads on the 3rd pass with a te63 turbo. These are facts, not opinions. If you need aluminum heads to run 11.5, something else is wrong.

 

[Mr.Spool]

Wow!

you should of switched to aluminum heads at the 12.0 level

 

[johnplogii]

That is where the TA alum heads far outshine and flow much better than iron heads as only minimal porting is needed on the exhaust side.

When the design for the TA heads was under way, Kenny D. did some flow bench work, and helped on the redesign of these heads which resulted in improved flow, especially on the exhaust side.

Hey Nick, how fast have you been with your race car with the aluminum block and ta heads? And what does it weigh?

 

[MCH86GN]

you should of switched to aluminum heads at the 12.0 level

Well this isn't an apples to apples comparison, but my best time was 11.88 at 113 with an stock long and TE44. I was talked into getting Champion Ported Heads, with the same setup as before and my best run was an 11.92 at 115. I was trapping a mile or two higher with ported heads, but no improvement in my et. I was on gnttype.org at the time this was taking place and several people there told me ported irons or GN1 without a better CAM or higher rocker ratio was a waste of money. That I should have invested my money else where.

 

[GNBRETT]

well thats not really saying much Nick cause a car running 12.0 with a TA-49 wud be considered a turd! thats one car with that combo. that doesn't mean everyone else running iron heads will pick up 1/2 a tenth in the 1/4 by switching to aluminum heads.

plenty of cars have been low 9's with iron heads. do they probably run more boost to get there? I wud think so but at those levels its C16 anyway so turning up the boost a couple extra lbs isn't gonna mean much imo.

the fact is most don't max out their irons anyway.

Over 15 years ago we demonstrated the performance improvement of alum vs. worked iron heads.

A local car with a TA-49 and a few other mods was very consistent at the 12.0 level. NHRA then allowed car to run at 11.50 w/o a roll bar and the owner wanted to easily run at that level.

We installed a set of Champion GN-1's with no porting and no others changes to the car, it ran a 11.50 the first time at the track!

After selling his iron heads, this proved to be a very in-expensive way to immediately gain 1/2 a second in performance, especially for a mainly street car.

 

[ZNix]

There's nothing wrong with running an aluminum head over an iron. It is not going to hurt the combo in any way. It seems to me that there are a few advantages over the iron heads when switching to a quality set of aluminums. Out of the box flow numbers are superior, they run a larger valve, they can run higher lift cams, better heat dissipation, and more rocker options (if running the stud mount style). You could make an iron head achieve most of these things, with some work. So what is the advantage of the iron heads over the aluminum, is my question? Trying to play the devil's advocate here.

 

[forcefed3.8's]

Nothing wrong with aluminum heads. He already has heads capable of maxing out his current set up. So the answer is no gain. When you have plenty of octane or alky, and are capable of running the extra boost required to make the iron heads make the power, then it isnt worth the time and money. At his level, i really doubt he would see much of a difference at the same boost. Anybody looking to buy heads with 9s in mind, I recommend aluminum. I have some iron headed cars in the 9s, but I do my own port work, so it makes running iron heads way cheaper. Plus I get HS rockers for a great price.

 

[TT/Ameasap]

The op doesn't want to run high boost. He has a girdled motor and forged internals. He also doesn't care about the cost...... Perfect candidate for ported aluminum heads.