Any interest in Cranks, Rods

[EightSecV6]

I have been contemplating this for awhile....Would there be any interest in a crank and rod package consisting of:

New 4340 Eagle forged steel crank 3.525 stroke or any stroke less than that down to 3.275, would be set up for internal balance.

New 4340 forged steel Eagle 6.00 rods, .912 on the small end, shotpeened and bushed, 7/16 ARP rod bolts, magnufluxed and weight matched, would be for on center or off center engines.

Would also include STD F-M race brgs on the mains and .010 under F-M race brgs on the rods. They would use SBC 2.100 brgs on the rods,and require custom pistons.

probably better suited in the TSM section but I'd like to gauge interest here first.

 

[750H.P.V6]

Bill,

Unless I miss what you're getting at you're planning on offset grinding a Eagle crank for SBC rod journals and a wider journal width, then using 6.0" Eagle rods correct? Sounds like a pretty economical deal to me. I agree that the TSM guy's might express most intrest like you said.

Neal

 

[TurboDave]

Sounds like the way I'm going to have to go for my (alum.) block.

Excuse my ignorance, but why the .010 under rod bearings? couldn't the journals just be cut to 2.1000?

Have to wait until after the xmas holidays though, when I'm all settled in all.

 

[Grandnat]

this would interest me.

Is Eagle making stroker cranks (last I heard they were not)?

and can we get a ballpark figure? $$$

how about WITH pistons and rings?

 

[TurboDave]

Originally posted by Grandnat
this would interest me.

Is Eagle making stroker cranks (last I heard they were not)?

and can we get a ballpark figure? $$$

how about WITH pistons and rings?

As Neal asked, I'd bet Bill is thinking of getting them offset ground to obtain the additional stroke.
Then again, I could be wrong.

 

[EightSecV6]

You have to make it .010 under after offset grinding it to make it PERFECTLY round. Ballpark would be in the range of $1400 for crank,rods and bearings

 

[turbodave231]

Bill,

I like the idea of the offset grind, but hate the idea of going .010 under a std bearing size. Staying at a std size allows the builder to use .001 under or .002 under brgs to adjust clearances. As you know, when using a stock oil pump, these engines don't like generous clearances

Have you heard anything about Eagle making "Buick" rods to compliment the 3.400 crank they offer? If you're going to PRI, gig them and tell them this is a good idea.

If we get enough people asking, it may help them make a decision. I don't personally need these parts, but it would be good for the Buick community to have stronger alternatives to the stock parts.

Dave

 

[EightSecV6]

Dave, there are alot of different opinions on the whole subject, I will say, when the crankshaft is machined properly, there is no need for a .001 or .002 under bearing.
I'd say you can pretty much hang it up on the rods and at the rate the cranks have (not) been selling, they may become extinct even in the 3.400 stroke. These are nice pieces and Eagle has already heard a bunch of crap from Buick guys about the fact that they are internally balanced, there were complaints about the knurl not being there on the seal surface (which is not needed at all unless you are brave enough to use a rope seal, the neoprene seals work better with a smooth surface).

 

[TurboDave]

Originally posted by EightSecV6
Dave, there are alot of different opinions on the whole subject, I will say, when the crankshaft is machined properly, there is no need for a .001 or .002 under bearing.
I'd say you can pretty much hang it up on the rods and at the rate the cranks have (not) been selling, they may become extinct even in the 3.400 stroke. These are nice pieces and Eagle has already heard a bunch of crap from Buick guys about the fact that they are internally balanced, there were complaints about the knurl not being there on the seal surface (which is not needed at all unless you are brave enough to use a rope seal, the neoprene seals work better with a smooth surface).

Figures, doesn't it
Ya know, after being in the T/R community for over 18 years now, there has been a huge change in attitudes the last bunch of years.
Seems like all you hear is a lot of griping and snipping at the tiniest details of any new item that shows up on the market for these cars. The bitchers and complainers seem to roll out of the woodwork almost immediately. Seems a very vocal minority of the "new crop" are T/R performance experts after a week or two of ownership, etc.

Sorry, down off my box now.

 

[ijames]

Bill, any chance of getting cranks from Eagle that haven't had the rods finish ground yet? That might allow you to go even further in stroke. I'm sorry to hear that the Eagle cranks aren't moving - like you say we are such a small market that if this fails I doubt if any other manufacturer will ever step in. Billet cranks will always be an option, but at 4x the price.

 

[turbodave231]

Dave, there are alot of different opinions on the whole subject, I will say, when the crankshaft is machined properly, there is no need for a .001 or .002 under bearing.

Bill,

You're right, but you know that main brg saddle size and rod big end diameter affect bearing crush and bearing clearances. If I had to choose, I'd always go for std bearings so I have the option of adjusting clearances.

I don't have a problem with the internal balance on this new crank. Guys looking to make that HP level ought to have a new SFI balancer and Flexplate for safety sake...It just makes good sense (to me).

I almost lost a good friend at the recent Cecil County Buick event when his brakes failed. His misfortune has caused me to re-think the safety of my car.

Dave

 

[86brick]

Well it sounds like the email I got from them in April was BS or maybe the cranks were selling good and sales have fallen off a bit since then.... Here's the email I got from them.....

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From : Eagle Specialty Products <eaglerod@netten.net>
Sent : Friday, April 30, 2004 1:42 PM
To : "Steve V." <wanted667@hotmail.com>
Subject : Re: I think you should make rods for...

| | | Inbox


Steve,
We are considering stroker cranks. We are just getting feedback from
everyone first. Rods are in development. They should be released soon.

Thanks.


----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve V." <wanted667@hotmail.com>
To: <eaglerod@netten.net>
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2004 3:42 PM
Subject: I think you should make rods for...


> The Buick 3.8L V6 (231ci) motor and I would like to see you guys make some
> bigger stroke (3.590 and 3.625 stroke) 4340 forged steel cranks as
well....
> I plan on buying one of your stock stroke (3.400) 4340 steel cranks and I
> would definitely support you guys making the rods and stroker cranks....
I'm
> sure there are plenty of others in the Turbo Buick community that feel the
> same way so I hope take this into serious consideration!
>
> Thank you for your time.
>
> Steve
>

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I would think our market can't be much smaller than some of the others they cater too....

 

[EightSecV6]

Carl,
They wont sell us the cranks unfinished,the first part of the process is the most labor intense anyway as you have nothing to index the journal from, that is why companies charge upwards of 1000.00 to finish raw BMS forgings.We could get .100 more stroke out of them using the 2.000 SBC rod journal but that comprimises strength.
As far as production goes, I dont have any inside track but I wouldnt hold my breath on these being produced forever. They already stopped production of the 4.3 Chevy cranks last year.

 

[malibuick231]

Bill I already have a eagle crank how much would you charge for the machine work,brgs,and rods.Also would I have to get a custom built piston to run this in a stock block if so how much would this cost.Would this stroke and rod length put any more stress on the block over the stock pieces.
Thanks Rusty

 

[Mike Licht]

Bill,
GO for the longest stroke that is safe. I could get Diamond to make a shelve piston for this application so it would not have to be a special order. Sell balanced assemblies. GREAT idea!
Mike

 

[1ARUNEM]

I have not been able to find any info suggesting Eagle makes a 6.0 sbc rod with a .912 little end. Only found .927.
These would have to be bushed and honed. I have a call into Eagle now and am waiting a response concerning availability of a .912 little end rod.

 

[KendallF]

Originally posted by 1ARUNEM
I have not been able to find any info suggesting Eagle makes a 6.0 sbc rod with a .912 little end. Only found .927.
These would have to be bushed and honed. I have a call into Eagle now and am waiting a response concerning availability of a .912 little end rod.

.912 is SBF. SBC is .927, and Buick is .939. You'll have to have a custom piston made in any case.

 

[EightSecV6]

Originally posted by 1ARUNEM
I have not been able to find any info suggesting Eagle makes a 6.0 sbc rod with a .912 little end. Only found .927.
These would have to be bushed and honed. I have a call into Eagle now and am waiting a response concerning availability of a .912 little end rod.

What difference would that really make? Are you looking to price them out? just wondering??? They make them, .912 pin diameter would make the rod/pin a little lighter for the same money.They wholesale for $429 for a set of 8 if that is what you are after. You have to order custom pistons anyway so bushing and honing would not be an issue, they will have to be offset ground on both ends to fit the piston as well as the bearing, all the machining would be completed and they would be ready to install. I dont really understand your concern but if that doesnt cover it, please send me a PM. I have had a couple guys call me but nobody serious as of yet, I'll probably put together 3 rotating assembly packages and go from there.
Thanks

 

[1ARUNEM]

Bill,
I hope you didn't take my post the wrong way. I have a friend who gets Eagle products for me. A fellow turbobuick friend asked me to see if he could get a set of 6.0" H beam sbc rods with a .912 little end and a 2.10 big end. Summit lists the rods (sbc) with a .912. But my supplier and others have told me Eagle does not make a .912 sbc rod.

I was just trying to find out for sure if Eagle does make one (sbc).
I am sure Eagle will let me know when I hear back. I just thought you might already know for sure.

Bushing and honing is of no concern other than a little added expense if the .912 isn't available.

As far as price goes, I'm pretty sure I can get/beat Summit's price of $429.. That was not my concern.

Thanks..

 

[EightSecV6]

Originally posted by 1ARUNEM
Bill,
I hope you didn't take my post the wrong way. I have a friend who gets Eagle products for me. A fellow turbobuick friend asked me to see if he could get a set of 6.0" H beam sbc rods with a .912 little end and a 2.10 big end. Summit lists the rods (sbc) with a .912. But my supplier and others have told me Eagle does not make a .912 sbc rod.

I was just trying to find out for sure if Eagle does make one (sbc).
I am sure Eagle will let me know when I hear back. I just thought you might already know for sure.

Bushing and honing is of no concern other than a little added expense if the .912 isn't available.

As far as price goes, I'm pretty sure I can get/beat Summit's price of $429.. That was not my concern.

Thanks..

I didnt take anything the wrong way?????? I bought 2 sets of them with the .912 pin for an SBC, maybe they are no longer available, Eagle is quick to discontinue stuff if it is not selling, that may be the case! I can probably get one set back from my customer if you cant find them, I dont think he is using them.
Let me know.