Engine and Transmission VIN Stamping?

[t-topflyer]

Keep in mind turbo Buick's with non-matching vin numbers means 0 as far as value on these cars. It's not like you could order a big block or any other engine/trans combo for that matter. On vehicles that all came with only one type engine and trans it means 0 in value. I've seen sub 10K GNX's with non matching engine and trans vins. Like most stated already it was very common to blow these engines up in the first year or two when they were new. Like Steve stated most blocks will be stamped with SG1 and that was the replacement block and would not have a vin stamped on it. I believe if the dealer did the install they would re-stamp the block with the cars vin but don't quote me on that. As long as the engine and trans was not from a stolen car, I could care less what vin numbers are stamped on one of these cars.

It may not matter to you, but it's a big deal to me as far as value goes. You could actually get several different engine/transmission/axle combinations in Regals especially in 1987. 307 Olds, 3.8 non-turbo, 3 speed automatic, 4 speed automatic. Something to consider is that if values increase over time, more and more people may try to clone the less valuable Regals into turbo versions. For example, it wouldn't be impossible to clone a non-turbo equipped 1987 T that originally came with a 5.0L Olds into a Turbo-T. Should make it worth more right?

Or, lets say a nice low mileage GNX comes up for sale and you're in the market for a GNX. The owner tells you it's the real deal, never had anything done to it, and you think it's a nice GNX. The car is priced right in line with the market for the car, but since you don't care about VIN stampings, and the owner tells you it's the real deal and he does seem like a trustworthy individual who would never tell you a lie, you pay the market GNX price for it because those numbers don't matter to you so you didn't check them. It might matter to you when someone tries to buy it from you and you then find out it's worth considerably less than what you paid for it to the majority of other collectors that do care about the numbers that you find out at that point are missing.

 

[Blazer406]

I agree.... numbers matching makes a helluva difference in corvettes and camaros.... it will make a helluva lot of difference to turbo Buicks one day.

I have removed my numbers matching motor and tranny and put them away for safe keeping.

FWIW, on my SG1 block I got out of the junkyard...the SG1 was cast into the block raised and is larger than the "109" that is also cast into the block. SG1 is not stamped on it. The SG1 letters are probably 2" tall or so..... pretty hard not to see.

 

[Steve]

Whether or not numbers matching cars will be worth more 20 years from now is up for debate but the examplle above about faking cars doesn't really hold up. On many muscle cars you can not truly tell what the cars came from the factory as without having the numbers matching drivetrain but the RPO sticker and VIN pretty much tells the story on these cars. I don't think these cars will ever reach the type of values as mid year big block Vettes or LS6 Chevelles so I don't think there will be a ton of cloning of them. The reason the muscle cars of the 60's are so valuable is because no one saved them-they abused them and used them up and sent them to the wrecking yard and the 70's gas crunch made them worthless at the time so few survivied. There are 100's(proabaly 1000's, there are beautiful low mileage cars for sale on here and ebay all the time) of very low mileage near perfect turbo Buicks around so there will be enough supply to fuel the future demand for nice cars without having to clone them. When a 66 Corvette 427 was 25 years old in 91 the value was already thru the roof but 25 years into turbo Buicks the same thing hasn't happened because there is enough supply to satisfy the demand.

I looked at one of the inflation calculators on line and if you had bought new 70 LS6 Chevelle conv. in 1970 for $4k then 25 years later that $4k would be worth $13717 but the cars were selling for at least $50-60K in 95 so that would be a good return and people did and still do try to clone them.

If you bought a new GN in 1986 for $17k then 25 years later than money is worth $33,348 and the cars are not bringing that now so I don't see a lot of cloning of these cars being a future problem. I would think there might be a WE4 with GN badges and a spoiler or something similar but that's no a huge deal and the RPO sticker would show that.


I put in the numbers for a GNX also. If you bought a GNX for $32k new in 87(which would have been pretty tought to do since so many sold for prices over sticker) that money would be worth $60,591 now you would need to get at least that to break even and that doesn't inlcude taxes, insurance or any other expenses you may have been out. I could see a potential fake GNX since they are worth more but I bet most if not all GNX vins are known so that would be very hard to do.