The research I came up with is these units are mainly for track and not everyday driving. I drive my car at least 3-5 days a week. I am thinking about upgrading to one of these units, but how do these work as far as controlling the sensors, transmission shifts, Do they do as much as the stock computer? etc. If I am wrong in my assumption, could someone chime in and clarify this for me? I Maybe even go with a Maft Pro, I am upgrading from a GEN II. Just want to make sure I am making the right decision.
Fast XFI or Big Stuff Everyday Driveablilty
- Thread starter twstdv6
- Start date
DailyDrifter
The Slow and the Curious
- Joined
- Dec 5, 2007
I have XFI, I drove 470 straight miles and didnt have any drivability concerns. Great street manners. Not sure about BS3. You wont have trans issues, as the 200r works off of a TV cable (lock-up has to be configured in the XFI fyi). They have much faster sample rate than the stock ECU, and completely tunable. And lets face it who doesnt like having a laptop connected to the car 
chasmat2316
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 7, 2006
I have XFI in my daily driven truck - no problems!!!!!!!
the driveablity is all in the user's hands on how far one want to really nit pick it for the max.
I hve had my fast on my car for 3yrs now and i'm still tweaking it for the max power/gas mileage. My car has far better response and power under no boost better than it did when stock.
DiverDavies
Diver Davies
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2008
Im also looking at a fast sys. also have questions about drivability Thanks for the post..
I dont' want to make anyone mad here but if you think you can tune a fast to drive as good as the factory computer I bet dinner on that one....
If you want all out performance for sure an aftermarket ecm... If you are drivin daily and enjoy all the features you can not beat the stock ecm. This is of course considering you ain't DD a 10.0 car....
I will put Jay's MafPro tune against any fast tune for a DD all day every day...
Just my .02's:biggrin:
If you want all out performance for sure an aftermarket ecm... If you are drivin daily and enjoy all the features you can not beat the stock ecm. This is of course considering you ain't DD a 10.0 car....
I will put Jay's MafPro tune against any fast tune for a DD all day every day...
Just my .02's:biggrin:
10-4 on all that!!
OneQuikSix
Member
- Joined
- Jun 7, 2001
I've got some time before I need to commit to a tuning solution. I've read alot of good things about TurboTweek chips and Fast XFI. I don't have anything against having the laptop in the car for tuning/racing. But for daily driving, how well does either solution (FAST, BS3, TurboTweak, etc...) perform under "lightly boosted" conditions? I guess I'm asking if I should be hesitant to get into the boost without the laptop. Once a car is tuned with XFI, does the unit automatically adjust to compensate for environmental differences that were not present when the program was originally created? I hope my questions make sense. Thanks for your input as usual. Chris.
I don't want to get into a pi$$ing context here, but there are advantages to both systems. When you cut right to the chase, it's all about injector p/w and ignition timing. For a novice tuner, the WBO2 gives you some flexibilty with lean cruise and WOT tuning.
FWIW: Over half of our aftermarket ECU sales are for daily driven street cars, and lately a LOT of E85 cars.
FWIW: Over half of our aftermarket ECU sales are for daily driven street cars, and lately a LOT of E85 cars.
turbotwister
FAST COMPANY PERFORMANCE
- Joined
- Oct 21, 2002
I strongly disagree.my fast tunes are far better than any chip and i consider myself a "semi pro",LOL.
the ability to tune the cold start,idle,air fuel for gas mileage is far superior using and XFI.Our cars run and drive better than most OBD2 based cars i have dealt with in modified form.my car runs near perfect.you just need to spend some time tuning "wisely".A standalone will always be superior to any piggyback system.
Nick,
callmeebryan
Member
- Joined
- Jun 24, 2007
I second this. Being able to adjust every aspect of your tune is ONLY advantageous to driveability. You can tune the car to cruise at nice 15.0 AFR's while still having an aggressive tune when you punch it. Thats the beauty of it... flexibility!!
You may only run into driveability issues because of large fuel injectors, a very aggressive cam, etc etc.... More tuning options just makes things much better!!!
I agree with Cal. No reason to get into a pi$$ing contest over this.
All the systems have their inherent advantages and disadvantages. As a "piggyback" owner however, it's always amusing when folks start talking about the limitations, etc. Cold idle, start up, lean cruise alway seem to come into the converstation as limitations in the same breath as piggyback systems. Not quite sure I understand why, unless it's a misunderstanding of what the capabilties and capacities of such systems really are.
Actually we have complete WB control over all aspects of the rpm and range, etc. from idle to wot and everything in between.
But hey, like I said, each system will have it's pro's and con's. Before making such a purchase, one must evaluate their goals, capabilities and understanding of the tuning process, etc.
All the systems have their inherent advantages and disadvantages. As a "piggyback" owner however, it's always amusing when folks start talking about the limitations, etc. Cold idle, start up, lean cruise alway seem to come into the converstation as limitations in the same breath as piggyback systems. Not quite sure I understand why, unless it's a misunderstanding of what the capabilties and capacities of such systems really are.
Actually we have complete WB control over all aspects of the rpm and range, etc. from idle to wot and everything in between.
But hey, like I said, each system will have it's pro's and con's. Before making such a purchase, one must evaluate their goals, capabilities and understanding of the tuning process, etc.
Hey! I didn't want to ruffle any feathers. I was just interested in purchasing one, but there's not to many threads on BS3, mostly all XFI. Just wondered if there was a reason why? But I see they all have there pro's & con's, just what may be better for your setup or what your looking for out of the unit. makes sense, as electronics are only as good as what we put in them. Still hard to decide, and Thanks for all the replies.
Decisions, Decisions.
I currently have a Fast B2B system on my car and it don't have all the nice features that a AXI or the stock ecm has.
The stock ECM and XFI has the A/C controls and convertor lock-up control. The XFI has closed loop boost control and traction control.
The bank2bank system is just a fuel and timing ecm. but i have tuned my car so it drives better than the stock ecm did when it had a acxa chip and stock injectors.
The piggy back items for the stock ecm are some great things for the average tuners since you are mainly worried about tuning WOT. Yes you can tune the other areas aswell but most are relieing on the stock programs/tables for the mid throttle and idle and cold start area of the stock chips. GM did do some wonderful work there.
we can thank Bob bailey for being able to write hex code to make a user adjustable chip and the translator boxes. those are great stuff.
So one can choose to keep the stock ECM and go with a piggy back(maft-pro,gen2) and then get a WBo2 sensor. or get a complete standalone.
It really boils down to what the user/buyer wants. But i tend to think one can grasp the whole tuning thing a little easier and quicker with a standalone.
now if one just chooses to keep the stock ecm and a chi that person is at the mersey of the chip burner to program the chip to what the car wants. instead of tuning the car to the chip.
Since i have the older FAST B2B i have worked around not having the A/C controls and or lock-up. and it's no big deal to me.
HTH guys
Pat Broughton
The stock ECM and XFI has the A/C controls and convertor lock-up control. The XFI has closed loop boost control and traction control.
The bank2bank system is just a fuel and timing ecm. but i have tuned my car so it drives better than the stock ecm did when it had a acxa chip and stock injectors.
The piggy back items for the stock ecm are some great things for the average tuners since you are mainly worried about tuning WOT. Yes you can tune the other areas aswell but most are relieing on the stock programs/tables for the mid throttle and idle and cold start area of the stock chips. GM did do some wonderful work there.
we can thank Bob bailey for being able to write hex code to make a user adjustable chip and the translator boxes. those are great stuff.
So one can choose to keep the stock ECM and go with a piggy back(maft-pro,gen2) and then get a WBo2 sensor. or get a complete standalone.
It really boils down to what the user/buyer wants. But i tend to think one can grasp the whole tuning thing a little easier and quicker with a standalone.
now if one just chooses to keep the stock ecm and a chi that person is at the mersey of the chip burner to program the chip to what the car wants. instead of tuning the car to the chip.
Since i have the older FAST B2B i have worked around not having the A/C controls and or lock-up. and it's no big deal to me.
HTH guys
Pat Broughton
kingots2004
Member
- Joined
- Nov 6, 2007
I just made the same decision that you are gonna have to make twstdv6. I went fast xfi. The reasons are 1 i had the gen2 like you and honestly didnt trust it. 2. I have a buddy that runs it in his 10.6 dd car with great success. 3. because of the amount of fast systems on buicks. Anytime i go to any buick race there are gonna be some xfi cars there and people that can offer advice. Cal gets on the phone anytime i have a question about anything and they give me a good package deal on injectors, fuel rails, and xfi.
- Joined
- May 27, 2001
The MAFPro really is a darkhorse in engine management with the Buicks. It bridges the gap between those people that want ease of tunability without going to a standalone system. Its really a shame this system hasnt gotten more press because it's a pretty amazing device. The wideband tracking is excellent and its not very difficult to tune.
That being said.. Ive been tuning engine management systems as long, if not longer than anyone else on this board. I've worked with TEC, Motech, DFIs, FASTs, Big Stuff 3, AEM and the latest and greatest, the KAM system we have on our race car.
The bottom line is that if you're not running faster than 10.00s, you really dont need an engine management system and even then with the MAFPro, its debatable.
Can you make an aftermarket ECM have good street manners and drive well? Sure.. Can you make it drive as well as a stock ECM.. I dont think so. Ive tuned countless Buicks with engine management systems, supercharged and turbocharged Mustangs, monster trucks with blower motors in them and tons of street rods that people just cruise in. While you can get good quality driveability with an aftermarket ECM, it still isnt as good as the factory stuff. The factory ECMs are purpose built. They do things aftermarket ECMs dont. Thats not a bad thing. You couldn't take a factory Buick computer and drive a Ford with it. If a single ECM would scale to every application, the factory would only make one ECM.
Anyways, back to the question of XFI vs BS3, XFIs are just a lot more prevalent here because more vendors sell them. At our shop, we work more with Big Stuff 3s but we can tune whatever comes through the door. Almost all the fast Mustangs we deal with are Big Stuff 3 powered. We sell way more BS3s than we do XFIs. For the money, the BS3 is a great buy. Still tho, unless you had a really fast car and were more interested in drag strip time than street time, I wouldnt sell you one.
That being said.. Ive been tuning engine management systems as long, if not longer than anyone else on this board. I've worked with TEC, Motech, DFIs, FASTs, Big Stuff 3, AEM and the latest and greatest, the KAM system we have on our race car.
The bottom line is that if you're not running faster than 10.00s, you really dont need an engine management system and even then with the MAFPro, its debatable.
Can you make an aftermarket ECM have good street manners and drive well? Sure.. Can you make it drive as well as a stock ECM.. I dont think so. Ive tuned countless Buicks with engine management systems, supercharged and turbocharged Mustangs, monster trucks with blower motors in them and tons of street rods that people just cruise in. While you can get good quality driveability with an aftermarket ECM, it still isnt as good as the factory stuff. The factory ECMs are purpose built. They do things aftermarket ECMs dont. Thats not a bad thing. You couldn't take a factory Buick computer and drive a Ford with it. If a single ECM would scale to every application, the factory would only make one ECM.
Anyways, back to the question of XFI vs BS3, XFIs are just a lot more prevalent here because more vendors sell them. At our shop, we work more with Big Stuff 3s but we can tune whatever comes through the door. Almost all the fast Mustangs we deal with are Big Stuff 3 powered. We sell way more BS3s than we do XFIs. For the money, the BS3 is a great buy. Still tho, unless you had a really fast car and were more interested in drag strip time than street time, I wouldnt sell you one.
Not true. The piggyback systems (Translator Pro for example) can do all the things you discounted them doing in that paragraph. Mid throttle, idle, cold start, etc. All while doing it closed loop with a WB if desired.
Oh, and it also has closed loop boost control, and dual fuel pump control.
Traction control? no, but then again it's not a $2,000+ unit.
Not meaning any digs, just clearing up misunderstandings. They seem to be quite prevelent.
