Few ?'s surrounding ported heads

[DCVING 6]

Basically wondering weather ported heads are right for me. I am looking into ported heads so I can run lower boost levels (run lower octane on street), yet still put out reasonable power.

Ok, I have all the little BS that the car needs such as Walbro 307, hot wire, gauges, friend has T-link, fuel pressure regulator. Right now, I am running the stock turbo/IC/Injectors. I probably will be for quite a little while.

My future plans call for a TE-44. It will take me as fast as I want to go. This is a While in the future, probably a year from now. Is it sensible to get ported heads now, before the turbo? Will it give a reasonalbe improvement with the stock setup?

I have a set of bluetops that I haven't put in the car. I know the TE-44 will work well with these, but I have heard that the 36lbs are too small injector with ported heads. Should I try and sell the blues, and go for say 50's ?

What kind of times would I be looking at with TE-44, ported heads, 50's, at say 18-19 psi? Would I get the same times with unported heads and say 22-23 psi?

Also, what about the cam? Is it safe to run ported heads with the stock cam?

I know I'm all over the place here, but thanks for any help.

 

[REDS HOT AIR]

what other post ?... LOL

good choice on turbo but the turbo and ported heads will go farther than them injectors..might want to think about getting 50's and not having to worry about it again

ported heads 44 turbo and 50's wil take you well into deep 11's
might want to toss in a cheap cam like i got ..seems to work real good

ported heads definatly help out.

when i did one street trim pass with the 49 turbo at 18# it was real rich ...never ran again after tuneing it and it went 12.0 at 114 mph on 93 octane with a crappy 1.9 60 ft on 235/60 drag radials

 

[DCVING 6]

Re: what other post ?... LOL

Originally posted by REDS HOT AIR


when i did one street trim pass with the 49 turbo at 18# it was real rich ...never ran again after tuneing it and it went 12.0 at 114 mph on 93 octane with a crappy 1.9 60 ft on 235/60 drag radials

YES!!!! thats exactly what I want. I think 12.0 is as fast as i want to go, without putting a cage in the car. I can always turn up the boost and go quicker if I want.

So, since I am doing this in steps, would it be reasonalbe to get the heads done before the turbo? Is it possible to run ported heads with stock turbo/injectors?

What about the cam? should I go with a 206/206?

 

[turbo buicks]

from looking at the ability to run great time w/fewer mods on pump gas w/ported heads i think ill get mine ported too!! how much would a good porting job fom someone like cal hartline be b/c i live sorta close to him? if anyone knows of someone else who can port heads well that i live close to please let me know
reds hot air, i see you have no PCV or EGR valves. i know these arent the most necessary things on the car to have but would taking them off throw a code? did you remove them just to free up working space or is there any benefit HP wise to taking them off? the less clutter the better also, how well does the powerstroke intercooler work for you? was it easy to install and is its efficiency comparable to other front mounts and how much does it affect cooling if any? thanks

 

[LikeMy6]

Cal Hartline deals w/t Champion heads out of Daytona,he can get you a set of cnc production Iron heads from champion. These heads are very nice and considered by most as the BEST ported stock heads on the market! They usually run around $1000-$1100. some have ran in the 9s w/t these heads.

 

[salvageV6]

I bought a used set 50K miles from Steve 311. Good shape heads.

Someday they will be going out to Frank G. in MD for about $600 worth of porting, prolly use stock valve sizes.

Problem is someone to put them on properly with GM gaskets and to stock spec.s. I am getting too lazy to do it.

I will reuse the stock cam too if good, too many cam horror stories out there.

For salvageV6 pump gas and alky.

 

[BLACK6PACK]

If your heads have never been off, then I would suggest leaving them on. Once the seal has been broken it will never be the same. All I'm saying is for a mild combo, ported heads are good, but you could spend a lot lest money for similar performance, and keep the factory sealed heads on. Just buy a SMC alky kit and bolt it on. Unless you do the work yourself, your looking at around $400-700 for R&R the heads and $1000 for porting. If your lucky the ported heads car might be able to keep within a couple of bus lengths of a similar car with alky and 93 octane.

 

[salvageV6]

I've got the alky. already just need more efficiency.

Yes, I am afraid of opening the engine, very afraid.

No hurry for me, I like to collect spare parts too.

 

[Intercooler]

Originally posted by BLACK6PACK
If your heads have never been off, then I would suggest leaving them on. Once the seal has been broken it will never be the same. All I'm saying is for a mild combo, ported heads are good, but you could spend a lot lest money for similar performance, and keep the factory sealed heads on. Just buy a SMC alky kit and bolt it on. Unless you do the work yourself, your looking at around $400-700 for R&R the heads and $1000 for porting. If your lucky the ported heads car might be able to keep within a couple of bus lengths of a similar car with alky and 93 octane.

I don't agree with this statement. If you do the heads you can get them to seal just fine. All that is needed is following the manuf. directions and the correct torque specs. Heads are not $1000.00 to have ported. If you use the stock valves you can off fairly cheaply. I can supply you with flow numbers and actual track tests. A friend of mine that had his heads ported and the stock valves backcut picked up .5/5 MPH. That should be as much gain as you will get with alcohol and you can lower the boost level. My .002

 

[Intercooler]

Here is the thread I speak of: http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39894&highlight=107


FWIW my set I just had flowed went 219 CFM intake and 189 CFM exhaust with 1.77's undercut.

 

[DCVING 6]

no alky for me

I am impressed by what alky can do for a car, but I don't really want to run it. I have my reasons, and don't want to start a flame war here.

Basically two variables:

X amount of HP= higher boost + 93 octane + alky
X amount of HP= lower boost + 93 octane

Also, with ported stockers, you can have the stock appearing aspect. Actually, I might get the TA-49 to go along with that theme.
With alky, if i'm not mistaken, you need to have the bottle and everything else in the engine bay.

 

[KEVINS]

2 friends picked up 2 mph by cleaning up the pockets (not a full port job) on their 12.0 cars but I think you'll be happier with the 44 turbo right now. Then port the heads later if you need to..

Regards
ks

 

[Scottie-GNZ]

Anyone using heads from the URL listed below? The "Budget Race Port" looks a good price/performer. What performance difference can anyone report?

http://www.geocities.com/buickheadporter/TurboBuick.htm

 

[turbo buicks]

wats up scottie, i got my car checked out last weekend and i need injectors, fuel pump, and a FPR. my dad was like dont buy stocker injectors just get those upgraded ones youve been talking about, the MSD 50's. i also want to go ahead and get an adjustable FPR so i can tinker w/FP later if i need to. the starter seems to be fine but the flywheel was the problem. it was all chipped so i got a new one w/the new tranny. last nite my dad was like, "look at this car son you will love it. i bet youve never seen something like this before." and it was your cars pic over on the corvette forum. i was like oh ya i know him. and he felt all dissappointed he didnt see it first, lol did you ever sell those tires? any new times on the GNZ? i have given up on my t type friend b/c i can never get a hold of him to tell him about the tires. oh well ttyl

and also, DCVING 6, if you like the stock look you could get alky and when people tell you its not stock show them the "power injection" lite on the dash, lol j/k

 

[frankg]

Ported heads are one of the best things to do. Heads are the heart of a good engine!!! Frank

 

[BLACK6PACK]

I knew someone wouldn't agree with me, but I'll be the majority will agree not to open the engine until it is necessary. The factory seal is the best. That being said, I have ported heads. I have had some bad detonation and still haven't blown a headgasket.

You can take your heads to Jimbob to be ported and they'll do just fine, but for a professional shop to do it, its going to cost some big bucks. So for around $1500 in labor and parts, I would spend my money elsewhere. Once you decide to take the heads off, by all means get them ported. It is one area that really wakes these cars up.

In terms of ported heads vs alky, don't think so. An alky car will smack around a ported heads car with a similar setup.

I can see why you wouldn't want to run alky though, its sucks running in mid 11 trim on the street with 93 octane in the tank.

Ported heads on a mild combo may give you 3-4 tenths and mph, alky will give you a full second and 10mph for about 1/5 the cost.

Don't get me wrong guys. Ported heads are perfect for our cars and almost necessary for faster cars, but on a mild setup, there are other things that will give you more bang for your buck.

Just check the shop hours to change head gaskets on our cars, I think its over 8 hrs at $50-75 hr. If you can do the work yourself, then by all means do it. Most of the cost is in the labor, not parts.

 

[Scottie-GNZ]

Not everyone can or want to shell out 4-figures for Champions, et al. I asked about that head porting service because several folks seem to have good success with their DIY porting jobs and that seemed to be at least equivalent. I would certainly take .4-.5 from a half-a*s porting job

Turbo Buicks, have not been to the track in a while as I upgrading the front suspension to 5-lugs and figuring out how to fit 12" Vette brakes on the Z. I want to have brakes that can match the acceleration .

Still have the tires but I am tired of tripping over them so I plan to get rid of them soon.

 

[Russ Merritt]

Hold up! The kid said he wanted to run 12 o's, (don't get mad) but, who needs heads, cams, and alky to run low 12's? TE-44, 009's, somebody's DP, drag radials, an air bag, and a 108 race chip should run 12 o's all day long. He doesn't even have to change the intercooler , just a little dremel work. Dude, forget about the heads, cam, and alky (unless you want to run +20# boost on the street) and do it the easy way. Do the turbo before the heads! Save the head,cam,50#inj, swaps for later when you want mid to low 11's (which by the way is still possible with the STOCK engine) Is it me or does everyone forget how to do it without all that? RIGHT!!!

 

[HRpartsNstuff]

I agree, you don't have to have ported heads at 12's or even mid 11's. I also agree that they will help, but probably not a necessity. I also agree that the stock seal is awesome, but if it is all done right, it should not be a problem to open it up.

Now that I confused you & sound like I didn't take a stand, let me say a few things...
I went 10.70's on stk iron heads ported by myself (somewhat handy with a grinder) that I put over 35 hrs into. They still had stk valves in them, which kept the cost down & the valves unshrouded. I wanted to see how fast I could go without $$$ doing it all. I have seen cars run way into the 11's and a few 10's under special circumstances with the heads never off the car too. If you plan to run low boost & pump gas, then helping it get in is good. Technically, letting the heads flow more or upping the pressure get the same job done. What goes in the cyl can be the same either way, and that relates to peak cyl pressure, which relates to knock. The main thing is, the better flowing heads make the turbo work less. This = less back pressure & less heat, which = ability to fill cyl more before knock starts. Depending on mileage & condition, cleaning the carbon out of it can help a bit too.

Don't miss that your money might go further spent on new wider tires, suspension upgrades, notching the frame for even wider tires, better converter, etc... There is more than one way to go faster. They say a tenth in the 60 ft is more like 1.5-2 tenths in the 1/4 mile. I like to work the car instead of the motor, less stress & knock problems pushing it to the edge that way.

Bottom line, you will be OK whether you leave them on or take them off & port them at high 11's - low 12's. If you do take them off, keep it simple for now. A little bowl work & cleanup goes a long way. When you get to the point of needing bigger valves & O-rings, maybe consider selling them & upgrading to alum. The alum will let you run higher boost on pump gas by letting the heat out quicker, but that's a lot of $$$ for that. Also, a 200/200 club cam or 206/206 hyd worked great for me. It don't take much cam to get it working good. Too big & you lose low end & 60 ft, and it takes a lot to make that up.
Hope that helped.

 

[REDS HOT AIR]

i dont think that 108 chip your talking will work too good on pump gas.

when i went 12:0 at 114 it was on 93 octane only...no alky ever been on my car.. it was tuned like crap too.


show me a full weight car on here running 12:0's with a ta49 turbo and 93 octane with stock heads and cam

on a stock d5 converter and 235/60 tires 1.9 60 ft