Forced Induction's FI91X report!

[Alky V6]

Nice looking Turbo for sure in black. I would have thought it would come in more then 55#'s. My PT91.5 I believe came in at 70+#'s.

Well, I'm going to have to weigh that thing again. It sure feels like a ton.

 

[Quint]

You know Donnie, the more I think about it, I think my 91.5 was around 60#'s, not 70? Eitherway, these are big boys and making big top end power. Good luck, hope to hear good things

 

[Chevota]

Well, I'm going to have to weigh that thing again. It sure feels like a ton.

Just think....All that weight might eliminate your need for wheelie bars!
Flange done? Waiting for pics!

Scott Wile

 

[Alky V6]

That's good to hear Quint. I thought I was pretty careful when I checked the weight on it.

I got the rough cut piece back from the waterjet shop today. Now to get to work. Rough cut isn't a fair description. Waterjetting is amazing.

 

[Alky V6]

Just think....All that weight might eliminate your need for wheelie bars!
Flange done? Waiting for pics!

Scott Wile

I still have quite a bit of work to do on the flange. That will be done before the end of the weekend.

 

[Bent6]

We run a 91.5mm on a 272 Stage II using NOS to spool. Fought with converters for years before adding the blue bottle. I can go from 0 - 15psi in about 2 secs with the NOS activated on the trans-brake. It does work - even on a little V6! I need to look at tightening the converter for more efficiency now that spoolup is a non-issue.

Donnie - I have an aluminum wedge plate for a T6 flange if you need it. I had to tilt my turbo forward to clear the water pump before I switched to a remote electric pump.

 

[Alky V6]

Very nice! I do appreciate the offer, but I've got it handled. Thanks again.

Thanks for posting the pics. Nice machine.

 

[JZ 97 SS 1500]

We run a 91.5mm on a 272 Stage II using NOS to spool. Fought with converters for years before adding the blue bottle. I can go from 0 - 15psi in about 2 secs with the NOS activated on the trans-brake. It does work - even on a little V6! I need to look at tightening the converter for more efficiency now that spoolup is a non-issue.

Donnie - I have an aluminum wedge plate for a T6 flange if you need it. I had to tilt my turbo forward to clear the water pump before I switched to a remote electric pump.

Have you thought about just going to a more efficient 91mm unit to reduce the lag? That may eliminate the need for NOS. An F-trim turbine is hard to spool with anything less then 350ci's even with a 1.00A/R.

BTW, nice setup......

 

[Bent6]

Have you thought about just going to a more efficient 91mm unit to reduce the lag? That may eliminate the need for NOS. An F-trim turbine is hard to spool with anything less then 350ci's even with a 1.00A/R.

BTW, nice setup......

The turbo in the picture actually died this year @ BG due to an oil pump failure. I looked into possibly going with a billet wheel pro-mod 91.5mm but decided to stick with what I have for now due to $$ and the fact that the only real advantage of switching would be the spool time and boost efficiency. Since I already have the NOS for spoolup, that negated that issue and there is no peak HP advantage between the two turbos. I may switch to a bigger turbo with new technology on a future engine project I've got planned for this car. Another reason to keep the NOS is for intercooling enhancement - I'm only using a 75 shot jet - never used the NOS other than at the line on the brake.

 

[Bent6]

So you installed it last week and hit the gas,Did it spool yet or is it still coming up?:biggrin:
Just joking

You know better than that from testing boost rise in the pits with the NOS on my car at BG this year!

You guys keep thinking in the non-nitrous world. How quick can that big turbo spool? The possibilities are immense with nitrous in the picture. I was just waiting for the right turbo to come along. One that's large enough and with the properties to allow it to be used on a small cid application.

You already know the possibilities with NOS. I used to be adament about NO NOS but it no doubt made driving my car a WHOLE LOT easier. I can concentrate on the lights now rather than trying to coax the thing to spool and worrying about cooking the tranny fluid in the process! Plus the intercooling properties inherent to NOS is a bonus feature. My goal is to eventually try to figure out how to do away with the intercooler by using NOS and a little ALKY for intercooling. Good luck!:biggrin:

 

[Alky V6]

Once you've had a taste of nitrous with a turbocharger, it's awfully hard to imagine giving it up. For one thing, like bent said, it makes the torque converter choice so much simpler. Gone forever is the consideration for turbo spool-up properties when choosing a T/C. Just look for an efficient T/C, period! My case for instance. The stall I'm using is about 2,500 at 0 boost. This is a small 224 cid application! The difference of running the nitrous and not running it is amazing (there really is no word to convey it). If I chose to stop using nitrous, I would be in a world of hurt trying to match a T/C to my setup. Especially with the new turbo!

While on the transbrake, when I use the nitrous, the stall of the T/C goes from 2,500 to almost 5,000 in about half a second. Who would want to give that up? How the system will work with this much larger turbo will certainly be interesting.

 

[Alky V6]

You know better than that from testing boost rise in the pits with the NOS on my car at BG this year!



You already know the possibilities with NOS. I used to be adament about NO NOS but it no doubt made driving my car a WHOLE LOT easier. I can concentrate on the lights now rather than trying to coax the thing to spool and worrying about cooking the tranny fluid in the process! Plus the intercooling properties inherent to NOS is a bonus feature. My goal is to eventually try to figure out how to do away with the intercooler by using NOS and a little ALKY for intercooling. Good luck!:biggrin:

Let me make your figuring easy for you. Switch to 100% methanol. It's not as hard as you may think. You'll need a second set of injectors and another fuel pump, maybe.

Bent. You said you're reaching 15 psi in .2 seconds? Get a tighter T/C. What's the stall off the nitrous now?

I get excited when I see others discover nitrous. Good for you.

 

[John Wilde]

Running the motor on straight alky would give you extra exhaust velocity.
This would make it possible to run your existing turbo with it's oversized turbine wheel.
However in my opinion you should run a smaller turbo!
With the weight of your car and the tire size it would be in the mid 7s with a GT4788.
Look at what Fiscus is doing at 3400 plus lbs and drag radials. (8.30s).

 

[John Wilde]

BTW the GT4788 is only rated at 50HP less than your current turbo.

 

[Bent6]

Let me make your figuring easy for you. Switch to 100% methanol. It's not as hard as you may think. You'll need a second set of injectors and another fuel pump, maybe.

Bent. You said you're reaching 15 psi in .2 seconds? Get a tighter T/C. What's the stall off the nitrous now?

I get excited when I see others discover nitrous. Good for you.

I've had some experience with methonol on 2-stroke sand drag engines. PITA from my recollection. I was really thinking of gas with an alky/nitrous mix injected into the inlet stream for intercooling. You've got me thinking now though..................

I'm still running the same converter I've had since before going with the juice. It stalls around 5500 w/out the nitrous. I've been thinking about having it tightened up a bit since it's not really a factor any more in spoolup. It is a lockup unit so it hasn't been that big a deal as far as top end efficiency.

BTW the GT4788 is only rated at 50HP less than your current turbo.

I assume you are talking about me? Why would you suggest going back down? This 91.5mm was an update from a 90mm. I know a GT4788 may be slightly more efficient and would spool better but it would notheless be sacrificing 50HP. Spoolup is no longer an issue with the nitrous and I'm not a class racer anymore so rules don't apply. A certain person who has been helping me with this setup has aspirations for LOW 7s with this turbo. It's always been my goal to exceed the chassis certification! My engine is out west receiving some "updates" for mo power as we speak!

 

[JZ 97 SS 1500]

BTW the GT4788 is only rated at 50HP less than your current turbo.

Their is a new race cover coming for the GT47 . So far in testing its gained about 100hp on high PR setups.

 

[John Wilde]

I've had some experience with methonol on 2-stroke sand drag engines. PITA from my recollection. I was really thinking of gas with an alky/nitrous mix injected into the inlet stream for intercooling. You've got me thinking now though..................

I'm still running the same converter I've had since before going with the juice. It stalls around 5500 w/out the nitrous. I've been thinking about having it tightened up a bit since it's not really a factor any more in spoolup. It is a lockup unit so it hasn't been that big a deal as far as top end efficiency.



I assume you are talking about me? Why would you suggest going back down? This 91.5mm was an update from a 90mm. I know a GT4788 may be slightly more efficient and would spool better but it would notheless be sacrificing 50HP. Spoolup is no longer an issue with the nitrous and I'm not a class racer anymore so rules don't apply. A certain person who has been helping me with this setup has aspirations for LOW 7s with this turbo. It's always been my goal to exceed the chassis certification! My engine is out west receiving some "updates" for mo power as we speak!

Will,

What is the maximum HP your combination has made at the track?
I was not aware that you were not doing any class racing anymore.
If you are simply doing test and tune passes, you have a lot more freedom
to experiment.

Good Luck and God Bless,

 

[Alky V6]

I've had some experience with methonol on 2-stroke sand drag engines. PITA from my recollection. I was really thinking of gas with an alky/nitrous mix injected into the inlet stream for intercooling. You've got me thinking now though..................

I'm still running the same converter I've had since before going with the juice. It stalls around 5500 w/out the nitrous. I've been thinking about having it tightened up a bit since it's not really a factor any more in spoolup. It is a lockup unit so it hasn't been that big a deal as far as top end efficiency.

I don't have any experience using large amounts of methanol with gasoline, but I have read that it can get pretty touchy. If I recall correctly the book stated that when using larger amounts of methanol with gasoline, the methanol can become unstable and preignite without warning. I would have to guess that it has something to do with the vastly different exhaust gas temps that the 2 fuels work best at. Where gasoline egts can be 1550F +, alcohol egt in a racing situation can be as cool as 1050F. The more extreme the performance requirement, the cooler you want the egt with alcohol. The autoignition temperature and pressure thresholds of alcohol in a gas/alcohol mix could easily be exceeded because of the different burn rates and burn temperatures.

If you're going to play with alcohol, don't play with it, burn it. If you have any questions, I'm here.

 

[Bent6]

Will,

What is the maximum HP your combination has made at the track?
I was not aware that you were not doing any class racing anymore.
If you are simply doing test and tune passes, you have a lot more freedom
to experiment.

Good Luck and God Bless,

Around 1300 but I've never really pushed this turbo. Always ran around 24psi with the old turbos but this one seems to really like about 30-35psi. Should be around 1500HP with ideal conditions which I feel is about the max for a V6.

FWIW - I usually just run Quick8, Pro-Mod, Outlaw, or whatever heads-up programs are running at local tracks when we go out. Got tired of being turned away by NMCA and other sanctioning bodies for being a turbo, a V6, tube chassis, etc, etc, etc. I just wanted to go FAST and be different. When turbos finally became politically correct, the rules started reading V8s only and I was told no V6's. I did run Nostalgia Pro Street a few years back at an NMCA event after a lot of politics to make an exception for my car as the rules didn't allow turbos or V6s. They strapped me with 3100#s to make sure I wasn't competitive and said if I came to a few events they would see about getting some weight off. I said thanks but no thanks. We all know they would cry foul if a V6 ever did become competitive and my pockets aren't deep enought to run with the like of what "Fastest Street Car" racing has turned into.

I don't have any experience using large amounts of methanol with gasoline, but I have read that it can get pretty touchy. If I recall correctly the book stated that when using larger amounts of methanol with gasoline, the methanol can become unstable and preignite without warning. I would have to guess that it has something to do with the vastly different exhaust gas temps that the 2 fuels work best at. Where gasoline egts can be 1550F +, alcohol egt in a racing situation can be as cool as 1050F. The more extreme the performance requirement, the cooler you want the egt with alcohol. The autoignition temperature and pressure thresholds of alcohol in a gas/alcohol mix could easily be exceeded because of the different burn rates and burn temperatures.

If you're going to play with alcohol, don't play with it, burn it. If you have any questions, I'm here.

Good stuff Donnie. You make a good point about the autoignition issues. Conley experimented with the alky/NOS on his twin turbo BB Camaro right before he got out of it altogether. The goal was to get rid of the intercoolers/weight and pick up some HP at the same time. Never got it dialed in before he hung it up.

Heck, I guess I could just go straight alky and eliminate the radiator instead!:biggrin:

 

[Alky V6]

The start of the part.