Hotair Recipe on GNTTYPE.ORG
- Thread starter mike85gn
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IRaceAV6
Guest
oh boy...
Some of us will agree with you on this one... and others will quickly slay you for your commentary.
Seems there is a following of sorts for the contributions by both contributors.
The concept of a recipe:
A. Go faster with few changes to the stock configuration.
B. Use accepted mods to attain previously set ET's
C. The group concurs unanimously with __________ (you fill in the blank).
D. Follow most of the '86/'87 recipe. If that doesn't work buy an '86/'87 motor and a TE44.
... and someone will surely reply... "If you don't like it... why not provide something yourself?"
STOPPING THE FIGHTING BEFORE IT EVEN BEGINS....
Some of us will agree with you on this one... and others will quickly slay you for your commentary.
Seems there is a following of sorts for the contributions by both contributors.
The concept of a recipe:
A. Go faster with few changes to the stock configuration.
B. Use accepted mods to attain previously set ET's
C. The group concurs unanimously with __________ (you fill in the blank).
D. Follow most of the '86/'87 recipe. If that doesn't work buy an '86/'87 motor and a TE44.
... and someone will surely reply... "If you don't like it... why not provide something yourself?"
STOPPING THE FIGHTING BEFORE IT EVEN BEGINS....
H
hotair85t-type
Guest
Once someone has a combo that actually runs, they should submit it. These recipes are proven. I followed the first one (before NIVEKS was up), and got the same results. Now with the new IC kit, it should be the same as building an 86/87.
Well I'm pulling all of my data from here, not really any specific recipe, just bits and pieces. We can all agree on a good Walbro unit with hotwire and adjustable regulator, as well as an adjustable wastegate. But, after this point, others would start going off in different directions. Good tires are a must, obviously, and some type of intake/induction would be nice (a la Big Mouth, we need results on this as soon as someone gets it) and I would definately say a scantool, boost gauge and chip. But so far, the biggest seat of the pants part was the ATR downpipe and performance exhaust, no cat. Yay or nay on this? What about injectors, we could say 36# or 38# or screw that go 50# with 87 ECM conversion and a MaxEffort. What about stall? TA-33 or go with a different turbo altogether (TA/TE-50/60/70?) Which cam grind, what heads and what kind of intake manifold mods? The V.1. setup? Or go straight to the V.2. or Spearco units? Air-to-air, or air-to-liquid? Alky or NOS or water injection? I'd really like A LOT of input from you guys with information on specific builds so we can get a solid baseline of what is at least considered necessary as a solid base for performance, as well as all of the possible future options. E-mail me your builds, or list them here for everyone to see and we'll pick them apart and come up with something usable. Thanks, it would be nice to point beginners to one specific document instead of repeating ourselves all of the time.
turbowrenchhead
Drive like you stole it!
- Joined
- May 25, 2001
- Messages
- 854
Look at my signature. I am happy with the time slips. I ran a 13.62 on a very hot day. I know I can improve on that cause I could only get 19 psi of boost that day. I had to much pump gas in the tank.
I think gutting the intake was a good mod. I did that and a eastern cam and I noticed a difference in power.
I think gutting the intake was a good mod. I did that and a eastern cam and I noticed a difference in power.
I agree with Hotair85. Once you get the intercooler kit build it according to the intercooled recipies. The only exception I can think of is the headers would need to be upgraded sooner than the IC cars. There's no reason a hotair with a good intake/intercooler shouldn't respond the same as an IC car to the same mods.
As time goes one we are finding more power outta these "slugs". We are starting to have some fairly/really fast rides (mine not included - slow pos) It is amazing how the hot-air community has come together and shared the secrets on how to make these cars run. We now have vendor backing too.
Funny when I started coming here (summer '98), there was no support for hotairs and the answer was always "get an intercooler" or "shoulda' bought an intercooled car". Remember those days Louie?
So anyone that has kept track of there mods and reflecting 1/4 times please take the time to document them.
I'll quit mummbling now......
Funny when I started coming here (summer '98), there was no support for hotairs and the answer was always "get an intercooler" or "shoulda' bought an intercooled car". Remember those days Louie?
So anyone that has kept track of there mods and reflecting 1/4 times please take the time to document them.
I'll quit mummbling now......
I would love to post my build up and times but I haven't ever run the car at it's potential yet and with my luck it will probably blow up before it get a full run. I would hate to have a list of excuses like plugged catalytic convertor so boost would only go to 13psi for the last half track.
I
IRaceAV6
Guest
It has always been the old paradigm... get an '86/'87 car.
I am converting my car to an '87 T motor for the remainder of the year. My machinest doesn't have the time to get the mods I want accomplished on the '84 GN girdled motor anytime before February at best. Business is good, and other customers come first by fact their stuff arrived into the shop ahead of me.
I have plans to try out the V2 intake with a front mount Spearco intercooler - with a solid billet roller cam in the '84 Girdled motor.
It is cheaper to intercool an '84/'85 car IMO by buying a used '86/'87 motor outright than it is to rebuild the '84/'85 motor and attempt to regain the horsepower difference by adding additional mods. You may disagree with me but that is an opinion gained by my pursuing that path. Some of you (with your intercooled guru connections) could do it for even less money.
I'm amazed at the vendor support. They stepped up and provided some great products. IMO we should consider ourselves lucky for surely there is very little money in it for them.
I am converting my car to an '87 T motor for the remainder of the year. My machinest doesn't have the time to get the mods I want accomplished on the '84 GN girdled motor anytime before February at best. Business is good, and other customers come first by fact their stuff arrived into the shop ahead of me.
I have plans to try out the V2 intake with a front mount Spearco intercooler - with a solid billet roller cam in the '84 Girdled motor.
It is cheaper to intercool an '84/'85 car IMO by buying a used '86/'87 motor outright than it is to rebuild the '84/'85 motor and attempt to regain the horsepower difference by adding additional mods. You may disagree with me but that is an opinion gained by my pursuing that path. Some of you (with your intercooled guru connections) could do it for even less money.
I'm amazed at the vendor support. They stepped up and provided some great products. IMO we should consider ourselves lucky for surely there is very little money in it for them.
Turbo Riviera
New Member
- Joined
- May 29, 2001
- Messages
- 442
My '84 GN buildup
Altitude: 3500 feet
1.86 60 foot
13.258 ET
101 MPH
stock 3.8 shortblock
mild ported heads
1.77 valves
210/205 Ruggles cam
ported intake (not gutted, EGR tower still in place)
electric fan
8" K&N
Big turbo (got it from Lee Thompson, dunno how big)
TH-400
9" converter
Lee Thompson headers and downpipe
NO INTERCOOLER
15 psi boost (very hot day and bad chip combo)
Left line at idle...
Lots left in this combo, but one too many street blasts on pump gas cracked #1 piston. Have not run car since. Engine is still apart.
I think this combo has solid 12.50's in it at sea level with some more boost... I ran these times about 5 years ago before I knew jack crap about Buicks
Altitude: 3500 feet
1.86 60 foot
13.258 ET
101 MPH
stock 3.8 shortblock
mild ported heads
1.77 valves
210/205 Ruggles cam
ported intake (not gutted, EGR tower still in place)
electric fan
8" K&N
Big turbo (got it from Lee Thompson, dunno how big)
TH-400
9" converter
Lee Thompson headers and downpipe
NO INTERCOOLER
15 psi boost (very hot day and bad chip combo)
Left line at idle...
Lots left in this combo, but one too many street blasts on pump gas cracked #1 piston. Have not run car since. Engine is still apart.
I think this combo has solid 12.50's in it at sea level with some more boost... I ran these times about 5 years ago before I knew jack crap about Buicks
REDS HOT AIR
Buick Tweaker
- Joined
- May 24, 2001
- Messages
- 3,433
TURBO RIVIERA
i still have the stock pistons out of my 85 turbo motor if you need one just say so....
i still have the stock pistons out of my 85 turbo motor if you need one just say so....
REDS HOT AIR
Buick Tweaker
- Joined
- May 24, 2001
- Messages
- 3,433
as far as combo for mine im not posting it other than my sig because it requires disassembly and porting knowledge ...and besides noone seems to believe it anyway except crazy gn because he met me at the track and checked it out himself.
Yeah, see there is a lot of information there now. But beginner-wise, I am pretty certain we can establish a base of modifications to improve performance. I'd like to keep the recipe simple, start with just "bolt-ons" at first. Lets have a look at what most consider necessary with respect to modifying a hot air:
1- Walbro 307/340 fuel pump
2- Hotwire kit
3- Adjustable fuel pressure regulator
This gives us a good basis for future upgrades in regards to adding more boost. At this level, one should consider:
1- Boost Gauge
2- Scan Tool
Standard hot-rodder philosophy would lead us to believe basic induction and exhaust work should come next. Here is where peoples opinions may start to differ. IMO, there are a few good options, but here is what I would suggest based on experience:
1- Gutted or no catalytic converter
2- Free flowing or no mufflers
3- The ubiquitous K&N cone or complete induction kit
and lastly,
3- I have had excellent results with a larger downpipe, so feel as though I should highly suggest it.
Of course, after the long life of our engines, there are some disposable parts which should be replaced as they may be a weak link in making power, such as:
1- Valve springs
2- Timing chain
3- Swap injectors if they are original
With all of the proper basic equipment in place, a few other little goodies to enhance tunability/drivability/performance:
1- Adjustable wastegate
2- Performance PROM chip
3- Low temperature thermostat
4- Throttle body coolant bypass
and I've had success with:
5- Header wrap on up pipe, downpipe, and crossover (all ATR)
And after these basic modifications, a stock hot air car would really wake up and go. But instead of just leaving it at that, other issues need to be addressed, such as:
1- Larger injectors
2- Larger turbochargers
3- The hot air's poor intake design
4- Headwork
5- Camshafts
6- Nitrous Oxide
7- Intercooler kits
8- Alcohol/Water injection systems
9- ECM conversion w/electric fan and chip
10- Cooling systems upgrade
11- Accel/SpeedPro DFI
And so on, so forth. You guys let me know what you think for now, and I'll gather a little more information.
1- Walbro 307/340 fuel pump
2- Hotwire kit
3- Adjustable fuel pressure regulator
This gives us a good basis for future upgrades in regards to adding more boost. At this level, one should consider:
1- Boost Gauge
2- Scan Tool
Standard hot-rodder philosophy would lead us to believe basic induction and exhaust work should come next. Here is where peoples opinions may start to differ. IMO, there are a few good options, but here is what I would suggest based on experience:
1- Gutted or no catalytic converter
2- Free flowing or no mufflers
3- The ubiquitous K&N cone or complete induction kit
and lastly,
3- I have had excellent results with a larger downpipe, so feel as though I should highly suggest it.
Of course, after the long life of our engines, there are some disposable parts which should be replaced as they may be a weak link in making power, such as:
1- Valve springs
2- Timing chain
3- Swap injectors if they are original
With all of the proper basic equipment in place, a few other little goodies to enhance tunability/drivability/performance:
1- Adjustable wastegate
2- Performance PROM chip
3- Low temperature thermostat
4- Throttle body coolant bypass
and I've had success with:
5- Header wrap on up pipe, downpipe, and crossover (all ATR)
And after these basic modifications, a stock hot air car would really wake up and go. But instead of just leaving it at that, other issues need to be addressed, such as:
1- Larger injectors
2- Larger turbochargers
3- The hot air's poor intake design
4- Headwork
5- Camshafts
6- Nitrous Oxide
7- Intercooler kits
8- Alcohol/Water injection systems
9- ECM conversion w/electric fan and chip
10- Cooling systems upgrade
11- Accel/SpeedPro DFI
And so on, so forth. You guys let me know what you think for now, and I'll gather a little more information.
Well, we could always use a dual A-pillar gauge holder. With, say, two in the console, that can give us up to 4 total. I would also choose a temp gauge, because I like to keep tabs on that as well. But, a scantool can measure the knock, so a knock gauge isn't an absolute necessity. Hell, I don't even run a knock gauge, just a turbolink. But I'd ideally say a boost gauge, temp gauge, knock gauge, and something else, like oil pressure (especially if you have an external oil cooler). Any other gauge ideas?
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