Is this a good combo or is a waste of money?

[oddiesGN]

Is your driverside header cracked?:biggrin:

It actually was cracked, but I noticed it when I first bought the car. When I put in the new engine I welded the crack on the header. I check all over and didn't see any more. I put them back on and even put a flame up by where the crack was and the flame didn't move.

Since I have every thing torn apart again, I was going to check headers again for leaks. I built this contraption that plugs the end of the header and a plate that bolts up to the part that bolts to the head. I have a gauge on it and a valve stem to put air in. I was going to watch the gauge to see if it slowly goes down. Don't know how well it will work, but hope it will show me if there are cracks. I guess I could get them magnafluxed if that works.

Otes.

 

[blackgn1]

A good short block with a mild cam and mild heads should get your goals. I have some experience with E85. I like it. With you trying to get in the low 11's why not go with 93? With alky injection. E85 just brings more into the game with tuning. Bigger injectors. Bigger fuel pump. Without a good converter and tranny you are wasting your time. I do know this for a fact. I'm there now. Doing a converter swap again this winter. A bigger turbo than the 49 will help.

 

[oddiesGN]

A good short block with a mild cam and mild heads should get your goals. I have some experience with E85. I like it. With you trying to get in the low 11's why not go with 93? With alky injection. E85 just brings more into the game with tuning. Bigger injectors. Bigger fuel pump. Without a good converter and tranny you are wasting your time. I do know this for a fact. I'm there now. Doing a converter swap again this winter. A bigger turbo than the 49 will help.

The reason that I use E85 is because 91 octane is the highest that I can get and I live in a town of 235,000, you would think that some one would have 93. There is one station that sells 100, 110 and 114, but I think the 100 is about $6.50 a gallon, but not sure its been 2 years since I checked. Plus I can't find any place in town that I can get the fuel for an alky injection. I checked this out before I decided on E85. I plan on getting a good converter and do want a bigger turbo, but with my ta 49 being new I would like to see what I can get out of it, then maybe next year go with the 6262. Unless some one out there wants a used, but still new 49 then I would sell it and go bigger.

Otes.

 

[blackgn1]

I understand your decision. Your 60 footer will for sure help your times. The converter will help then your next problem will be getting the car to hook.:biggrin:

 

[oddiesGN]

I understand your decision. Your 60 footer will for sure help your times. The converter will help then your next problem will be getting the car to hook.:biggrin:

I'm hoping that getting to hook up will be cheaper then getting the power to the wheels. I'm thinking it shouldn't be too bad, I'm not running 9s or 10s. I'm hoping to get the job done with some basic stuff, don't want to get away from being streetable I still like to have a good riding car down the highway.

Otes.

 

[Amelio]

If your car was still together I was going to suggest you tuning your current combo before you change it. .....but since you mentioned it's apart no point.

I see you mentioning you think you want a bigger turbo.....well I can provide my opinion on that.......

I would suggest you stick with your combo you have picked out it does seem to be a decent one and the ta49 will put you at your goal and then some. When I first started playing with these cars I always wanted the bigger...the better ect...etc... I bought parts that I thought would work and parts some people told me to buy. I just eneded up with a bunch of miss matched parts.

Had I known then what I know now I would be doing more with less.....but then I would not have learned.

My point is try not to get into an upgrade rush....lots of times guys upgrade before they have actually maxed out their combo just so they can say they have a bigger turbo or whatever.......

It sounds like you have a great deal to learn when it comes to tuning......trust me I know cause I am still learning it takes a while and when you mess up and hurt something it takes a while to fix unless you got loads of cash on hand and I dont...............

Just my opinion, stick with what you got....learn to tune and make small changes when you tune and understand it may take a few trips to the track to meet your goals. Then when you have a firm grasp on tuning and you have gone as fast as you can with your combo then upgrade.

Best of luck!

 

[oddiesGN]

Thanks Amelio. The only reason I was wanting a bigger turbo was not to go faster (well you always want to go faster), but to run less boost and make it more efficient. Less back pressure and lower air temp from the turbo.

I will take your advice and I will get the parts that I listed above and keep my turbo. I do need to learn alot about tuning and I just need to have patience and do one thing at a time and keep track of my tuning.

Thanks, Otes.

 

[Amelio]

Thanks Amelio. The only reason I was wanting a bigger turbo was not to go faster (well you always want to go faster), but to run less boost and make it more efficient. Less back pressure and lower air temp from the turbo.

I will take your advice and I will get the parts that I listed above and keep my turbo. I do need to learn alot about tuning and I just need to have patience and do one thing at a time and keep track of my tuning.

Thanks, Otes.

No problem.....I wish I was on this board or one like it when I started playing with these cars, it would have kept me frm buying lots of parts I did not need to run the times I wanted then. I made the mistake that soooooo many other guys do....buy big parts take it to the track run an ok time then throw more parts at it. It really is in the tune which is why you see stock long blocks in the 10's........yeah they are running 30+ psi but they can do that cause their tune is dead on!

I am still learning and have a long way to go but I finally have a decent combo and I know it is capable of much faster times then I have run I just gotta get my tune dialed in.

Your TA49 will put you where you want to be all day long and by the time you max out that combo you will have a really good grasp on how to tune and then make your next jump.

 

[blackgn1]

Powerlogger at some time will really help with your tuning. Not that expensive and gives tons of information. Just a thought.:biggrin:

 

[Steve]

On the subject of rockers-for your goals I would just run stockers. I have been 10.30's@131 on stock rockers and many have gone as fast or faster with them. The only hassle to stock rockers is you have to measure for pushrods and get exactly what you need since the stockers are non adjustable, but that's a fairly small amount of work to do to save $500 IMO. My car that went 10.30's had a stock unported intake, stock throttle body and plenum with a power plate and a stock MAF with a TE-45A turbo. The heads were stockers with mild port work done by me(and I have no idea what I am doing!) with stock valves, and a 206/206 flat tappet cam. I have had 4 different mid 10 second turbo Buicks over the years and have never owned a roller rocker so they are nice to have but not required.

 

[Amelio]

On the subject of rockers-for your goals I would just run stockers. I have been 10.30's@131 on stock rockers and many have gone as fast or faster with them. The only hassle to stock rockers is you have to measure for pushrods and get exactly what you need since the stockers are non adjustable, but that's a fairly small amount of work to do to save $500 IMO. My car that went 10.30's had a stock unported intake, stock throttle body and plenum with a power plate and a stock MAF with a TE-45A turbo. The heads were stockers with mild port work done by me(and I have no idea what I am doing!) with stock valves, and a 206/206 flat tappet cam. I have had 4 different mid 10 second turbo Buicks over the years and have never owned a roller rocker so they are nice to have but not required.

i second that but would reccomend HD shafts..... i have broke 2 shafts since i went to a roller cam and it happens at high rpm when the engine is twisting and the shafts are seeing the most strain from the added spring pressure.

I have never bought roller rockers due to the cost......but I will be getting some HD shafts and braces here real soon!

 

[turbocamino1]

I could be wrong, but I believe to use the DW300 fuel pump, your fuel return line needs modified or the fp wont go low enough at idle. Didnt see that posted on your modification list.

FWIW...Many have had no issues with the f/press and the stock return with the DW301..myself included. Some did but never heard why though. Hope this helps.

 

[oddiesGN]

No problem.....I wish I was on this board or one like it when I started playing with these cars,

I wouldn't know what to do if it wasn't for this site. I probably would have done something stupid like put in a sbc engine. But thanks to all the helpful people here, I still have my little V6.

Powerlogger at some time will really help with your tuning. Not that expensive and gives tons of information. Just a thought.:biggrin:

Thats on my list to get next. I'm thinking that the powerlogger will help me learn to do better tuning.

On the subject of rockers-for your goals I would just run stockers. The only hassle to stock rockers is you have to measure for pushrods and get exactly what you need since the stockers are non adjustable, but that's a fairly small amount of work to do to save $500 IMO. .

That could be an option. The only problem is measuring the pushrods. What do you have to do, put in adjustable pushrod, put on rocker arms and make the pushrod longer? I tried to look for a thread that talks about this, but couldn't find one. Could someone guide me the a thread that explains this. Will like to learn more before I decide. Take out the price and adjustability out of the equation, besides that one has a wheel on the end whats the benifits for using a roller rocker?

i second that but would reccomend HD shafts..... i have broke 2 shafts since i went to a roller cam and it happens at high rpm when the engine is twisting and the shafts are seeing the most strain from the added spring pressure.

The HD shafts will have to be a must with the braces. If I do go stock rocker arms I will use these.

FWIW...Many have had no issues with the f/press and the stock return with the DW301..myself included. Some did but never heard why though. Hope this helps.

For what I've heard is that with a smaller return line you build up too much pressure at idle. Don't know why if your fuel pressure reg works shouldn't that keep your fuel pressure normal at idle? 43# is 43# no matter how much fuel the pump pushes, is that right or am I missing something here.

Thanks everyone, these are all good things to consider. Otes.

 

[turbocamino1]

For what I've heard is that with a smaller return line you build up too much pressure at idle. Don't know why if your fuel pressure reg works shouldn't that keep your fuel pressure normal at idle? 43# is 43# no matter how much fuel the pump pushes, is that right or am I missing something here.
Its the smallish fittings that are in the return line that is a bottleneck....the f/press reg. can do its job, but after it is where the issue is. Some that use 2 pumps will use the old feed line for their return as it is bigger. I ran a separate -10 feed so that freed up the stock feed line and when i switch to e85 i can use it for the return.There is also a member who customized his regulator at the bottom with a bigger fitting. I will do both mods.

 

[oddiesGN]

What do you do about the rubber lines between the frame and engine? Do you have new ones made or use them when going with bigger hard lines?

 

[turbocamino1]

What do you do about the rubber lines between the frame and engine? Do you have new ones made or use them when going with bigger hard lines?

Visit our E85 section....check out 2 posts ..near the top....they start with "120LBS and stock fuel...." , the other, "New drop in E85 compatible...." they outline it pretty well.

 

[Amelio]

What I did......

Turbocamino1.........you are correct with too small of a return you have too much pressure at idle and everywhere else. Yes the regulator is trying to do its job but if the fuel can not get back to the tank fast enough this is where you run into a problem.....

I saw this first hand.....I needed to replace my feedl line due to rust, I made a fitting at the rail and went -6 AN Braided SS from the rail all the way to the pump. I also omitted the factory filter and went to an inline billet serviceable unitl. I did not touch my return thinking it would be ok.......I was wrong:redface: I increased my feed but not the return and the car was pig rich no matter how much fuel I pulled out of the chip.

I then pulled all the stock return line, I made a -4 AN fitting into my regulator and ran -4 braided SS line all the way to the tank. I now have my fueling under control.



OddiesGN,

As far as your pushrods go you will need to measure them when assembling the engine, this is done with an adjustable pushrod tool and a wire feeler gauge. It is a fairly simple procedure and there are threads on it. Basically with the engine pretty much assembled minus the intake........you install your pushrod checker tool(it looks just like a pushrod but it is threaded internaly so it extends) and install the rocker bar.......As the plunger in the lifter collapses you will need to take a measurement from the top of the lifter plunger to the bottom of the plunger retainer clip. I dont remeber exactly where its supposed to be but I wanna say no less than .010 and no more than .040 for a nice quite engine (dont quote me on those figures its been a while since I built mine)

To get the lifter preload where you want you extend the pushrod tool until you hit your target preload number......once you get your target preload number you remove the pushrod tool and measure it. This gives to what length pushrod you need.

Alot of factors go into changing this......I am running stock heads that have never been milled nor has my block,I run Felpro 9441 gaskets stock rockers and I was able to run the pushrods that came in the kit. Because my lifter preload was within spec my engine is nice and quite.

Sorry for the long reply......its not easy to explain that stuf in a few words

 

[oddiesGN]

Turbocamino1.........you are correct with too small of a return you have too much pressure at idle and everywhere else. Yes the regulator is trying to do its job but if the fuel can not get back to the tank fast enough this is where you run into a problem.....

I saw this first hand.....I needed to replace my feedl line due to rust, I made a fitting at the rail and went -6 AN Braided SS from the rail all the way to the pump. I also omitted the factory filter and went to an inline billet serviceable unitl. I did not touch my return thinking it would be ok.......I was wrong:redface: I increased my feed but not the return and the car was pig rich no matter how much fuel I pulled out of the chip.

I then pulled all the stock return line, I made a -4 AN fitting into my regulator and ran -4 braided SS line all the way to the tank. I now have my fueling under control.


OddiesGN,

As far as your pushrods go you will need to measure them when assembling the engine, this is done with an adjustable pushrod tool and a wire feeler gauge. It is a fairly simple procedure and there are threads on it. Basically with the engine pretty much assembled minus the intake........you install your pushrod checker tool(it looks just like a pushrod but it is threaded internaly so it extends) and install the rocker bar.......As the plunger in the lifter collapses you will need to take a measurement from the top of the lifter plunger to the bottom of the plunger retainer clip. I dont remeber exactly where its supposed to be but I wanna say no less than .010 and no more than .040 for a nice quite engine (dont quote me on those figures its been a while since I built mine)

To get the lifter preload where you want you extend the pushrod tool until you hit your target preload number......once you get your target preload number you remove the pushrod tool and measure it. This gives to what length pushrod you need.

Alot of factors go into changing this......I am running stock heads that have never been milled nor has my block,I run Felpro 9441 gaskets stock rockers and I was able to run the pushrods that came in the kit. Because my lifter preload was within spec my engine is nice and quite.

Sorry for the long reply......its not easy to explain that stuf in a few words

So lets say you replace all the lines, but have restricted lines off the fuel pump and the fitting off the fuel rail, will it still help flow because 99% is better flowing or is it still no better then keeping stock lines?

On checking pushrod length, do you adjust it till you have zero lash then get .040 preload then measure pushrod? How do you know for sure that you have the right pushrod length untill you buy the right length and its wrong? Is it better to be a little too short on length or a little too long on length? Because I have seen so many different lengths that others have used some say you need .060 some say .040 and I have even seen .100. I'm almost thinking that roller rockers are the way to go to be 100% sure instead of stock rockers.

Thanks, Otes.

 

[big reazon]

Turbo fabricator on here just replaced the restricted factor fittings from the frame to fuel rail and said that doubled the capacity of the return line there is a thread about it somewhere around here.

 

[oddiesGN]

Turbo fabricator on here just replaced the restricted factor fittings from the frame to fuel rail and said that doubled the capacity of the return line there is a thread about it somewhere around here.

I will have to try to find that thread. If someone know what that thread is please pass it on. I wonder if you have to cut and reweld the fitting on the fuel rail. What do you do about the lines off the fuel pump, how do you get that to get bigger?

Thanks, Otes.