My cheap alternative to Howes / SC&C Stage 2 - Suspension gurus PLEASE chime in

[BuickMike]

Before I begin, I know most of you guys are going to start off with "just get SC&C Stage 2 and be done with it." I'd like to, but I am trying to put my car back together on a TIGHT budget and a few hundred bucks saved on suspension can go elsewhere. I'm just trying to build an all around decent car to drive. Here's what I already have: My motor should be making about 450whp, I have boxed rears with H&R bushings, S10 wheel cylinders and aluminum drums in the rear, S10 RSB, and S10 brakes in the front. I will probably be getting the SC&C spring set because it's only about $30 more than a set of Moogs and I know I'll be getting a good quality set of springs. I will also put on my GTA wheels and get an IROC FSB. Bilstiens will come later.

So....

I really want to go with taller ball joints and found an alternative to Howe that is cheaper. AllStar Performance has adjustable lowers and uppers that will adjust to .5 taller and then some. If I go with their balljoints and put new bushings on the stock control arms I will be saving about $380 over the SC&C stage 2 setup.

Now my question is, will I be able to shim those stock upper control arms to get a good alignment. If I remember right I should be shooting for -.75 degrees of camber and 3+ degrees of caster?? If I can pull this off I'm sure this suspension setup will be just fine for a car that will be mostly street driven. Please let me know if I will have some major issues with this setup and exactly why?

Thanks,

Mike

 

[Silver Fox]

Before I begin, I know most of you guys are going to start off with "just get SC&C Stage 2 and be done with it." I'd like to, but I am trying to put my car back together on a TIGHT budget and a few hundred bucks saved on suspension can go elsewhere. I'm just trying to build an all around decent car to drive. Here's what I already have: My motor should be making about 450whp, I have boxed rears with H&R bushings, S10 wheel cylinders and aluminum drums in the rear, S10 RSB, and S10 brakes in the front. I will probably be getting the SC&C spring set because it's only about $30 more than a set of Moogs and I know I'll be getting a good quality set of springs. I will also put on my GTA wheels and get an IROC FSB. Bilstiens will come later.

So....

I really want to go with taller ball joints and found an alternative to Howe that is cheaper. AllStar Performance has adjustable lowers and uppers that will adjust to .5 taller and then some. If I go with their balljoints and put new bushings on the stock control arms I will be saving about $380 over the SC&C stage 2 setup.

Now my question is, will I be able to shim those stock upper control arms to get a good alignment. If I remember right I should be shooting for -.75 degrees of camber and 3+ degrees of caster?? If I can pull this off I'm sure this suspension setup will be just fine for a car that will be mostly street driven. Please let me know if I will have some major issues with this setup and exactly why?

Thanks,

Mike

Are you planning on using the stock UCAs? If so (from SC and C's website):

"Q: Can I use the tall ball joints or tall spindles and use my stock upper A arms?

Original arms on A, G and 1st Gen F body cars were originally designed to droop down over the frame and have the ball joints at the proper angle for a full range of travel. Once you lower the car, go to taller spindles or ball joints etc. the arms end up closer to level and the ball joints end up close to binding at ride height. Hitting a big bump can bind up the ball joints and put a tremendous amount of stress on them as well as the upper A arms and A arm mounting bolts. They'll only take that for so long before something fails..."

In your case I would recommend installing Moog Problem Solver bushings in your upper/lower control arms and stock factory ball joints back in. When you can afford to go with the Stage II then buy it.

Rob

 

[BuickMike]

Thanks Silver Fox. That's a good point. I will call All Star Performance and see if their balljoints possibly allow for more travel than stock. They have different part numbers for left and right upper ball joints. It may be possible that the mounts are angled to compensate for this. I will follow up and check. I'm also wondering how hard of a bump you have to hit in order to cause a bind.

I wonder if those old school guys who run Impala ball joints and had their spindles reamed and had issues?