NHRA Rule Update (Check it out).....

[BLACK6PACK]

There is a difference IMO between driving a '70 440 charger to a 11.5 et and a '89 TTA to a 11.5 et. I forget who said it, but someone on here described driving an old mopar musclecar as "a buch of parts flying in close formation." The GN and TTA are much tighter cars than the old 60's musclecars that the rules were based on many years ago.

 

[salvageV6]

Having owned a '69 GS400 and two 1987 turbo cars I will respectfully disagree.

Better frame, disc brakes (optional), same or better rear, turbo 400 tranny, more metal parts less plastic, and similar front ends and steering system on the 1969 car over the 1987 car.

Brakes were way better on my GS than the GN, well until I ordered the Baer kit.

Only major difference is tires and overall weight a few hundred pounds.

Older muscle cars are built just as good if not better than your typical G body in MHO.

As for Dodges and Fords I will totally agree.

 

[turbov6joe]

I just knew that someone eventually would make a post like Strikeeagle's....was just a matter of time!

 

[86brick]

Originally posted by turbov6joe
I just knew that someone eventually would make a post like Strikeeagle's....was just a matter of time!

Yup

 

[zam70]

And, there's truth behind it.
The rules are there for YOUR safety (and some for others safety as well). They're not just there to be a pain in the butt.
It seems we all are sometimes obsessed with what we can get away with and ignore the logic of it all (this includes me). We get lulled into fooling our selves...
I say forget the rules - save your ass. Do what needs to be done to stay safe. You can just so happen to use the guidelines to help you along the way.

 

[strikeeagle]

I'm that little voice you ignore just before you ask yourself, "WHAT THE F WAS I THINKIN'?"

 

[kgouldsk]

Ok, this should put a BIT of the bickering to bed, anyway. My questions are below, the response is at the top. When in doubt, simply ask. As I promised when I submitted this query, I would encourage people who are members of other boards to share this information around to remove some of the FUD happening.


___________________________

Kevin,



Any vehicle equipped with a turbo and/or intercooler may use a larger than original unit. Cold air kits, aftermarket air filters, and mass airflow meters are permitted. Competition exhaust, including down pipes from the turbo are also permitted. Tires that meet DOT requirements are acceptable, providing they do not have (not for highway use) embossed on the sidewall.



Pat Cvengros

Technical Services Representative

(626) 250-2295

Are you an NHRA member yet? Join today! http://www.nhra.com/2004/join.html

-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Gould [mailto:kgould@yahoo.com]
Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2004 11:04 PM
To: Danny Gracia
Subject: New E/T class - all the clubs are talking-a plea for more info

http://www.nhra.org/2004/news/june/062202.html



Regarding this release, my club is having huge discussions and arguments as to what the interpretation of this should be. It would be helpful to enthusiast clubs throughout the country if you would issue some kind of clarification.



Our example:



The turbo Buick cars come with a factory turbo. We generally at very least increase the boost setting on that turbo. Clearly, that will not invalidate the rule.



What about adding a bigger turbo? Same/different manufacturer?

How about airflow improvements - cold air kits, K&N filters, modified mass airflow systems, larger intercoolers?

Exhaust is allowed. What about the larger downpipe from the turbo?



Are E/T Streets allowed? Just drag radials in general? More clarification on the tire issue is needed.



We're all VERY excited about this, but we're also very tentative, and I don't think the tracks are going to know how to interpret this - it will be inconsistent. At a liberal interpretation, it sounds like many of our mods that take us into the 11.51-12.99 range are allowed. People reading it very literally believe that with even the most minor mods, we're disqualified from the class.



Can you please help? It would solve a lot of chaos on message boards throughout the country.

 

[strikeeagle]

Well, that's interesting, but it still comes down to how safe you feel in a car going 120 MPH w/o a bar.

It's interesting that DOTs are OK, but slicks aren't. I'd contend slicks are safer on a fast car.

 

[murphster]

Very interesting indeed. Looks like we should be covered to 11.5's for most typical mods. Fast enough for me!

 

[Nick Micale]

Originally posted by strikeeagle
.......... but it still comes down to how safe you feel in a car going 120 MPH w/o a bar.

It's interesting that DOTs are OK, but slicks aren't. I'd contend slicks are safer on a fast car.

Actually, I would feel safer under the track condition you stated rather than 70 MPH on our freeways!

Most of the "problems" I have seen at the track happen in the first half of the track rather than top end.

As far as DOT's vs. slicks, my experience is the DOT tires handle better at high speed.

 

[kgouldsk]

I agree with Nick. Our conditions are mostly pretty controlled, other than the possibility of failure of a steering component or something of that nature. We at least rarely have to worry about other drivers.

As far as tires go, the speed rating on the tire has a significant margin of error built in, plus is for sustained speed. It will endure a higher speed for the short durations we need it. Of course, we DO put it under just a little more strain at the beginning - I'm not sure what testing they do for that, but being a drag radial, you know the manufacturers are expecting it.

 

[JP87GN]

Sum of you are missing the point intended. These rule changes are going into effect to keep the faster cars that get kicked out for no cage off the street racing scene and back onto the track into a controlled endvironment. The law inforcement agencies were pushing NHRA to change the rules becouse the newer cars are built with more safety in mind and they were already that fast, but they just did it on the street were the chance of someone getting hurt was much higher. Just my 2cents.

 

[UNGN]

Originally posted by strikeeagle
It's interesting that DOTs are OK, but slicks aren't. I'd contend slicks are safer on a fast car.

Maybe on a 9 second car but not on an 11 second one. Drag radials at 120 feel safer than slicks at 70. More control and less side to side wallow... and no fear of hopping if you have to lay on the brakes.

 

[strikeeagle]

Well, then in the interest of safety, I guess I'll throw my slicks away and run drag radials, even if I get a 1.5 one time, and a 2.3 the next...

 

[Nocooler]

This is big news.......

Maybe this is way I didn't get yelled @ last night, and they specifically asked if I ran N20 during tech. I did make a few passes on slicks too......all in the 11.9x range. I have no problems running DR's (I like them better) - If I don't need a bar till 11.5x

I'm still unsure if I want a bar in my car and I'm fairly content with the performance (for now).

Tomorrow I'm going to consult my tech and see what he says.

Jeremy

 

[SilverSleeper]

As for the older cars were built just as well or better than newer cars argument....

Older cars might have been built more solid, stronger frames, rears, etc. But what they dont have is things like crumple zones, airbags, adjustable belts, modern chassis engineering, etc.
I used to think the same thing. I would have rather been in a wreck with my 73 Electra than a newer car. Well, I can tell you firsthand (driver front impact at about 60mph) that it beat me up pretty bad. If you looked at the car, it didnt do much damage to it, needed a new bumper, drivers fender and door. Didnt even bend the frame. But the car didnt absorb much of the impact when I hit. I absorbed most of it. Newer cars might look worse after a wreck, but they are designed that way...to absorb the impact rather than transferring it to the driver.
A friend of mine in high school had a 86 GP. He was involved in a head on at 55-60 mph. The only reason he lived was the fact the car crumpled in the front as it was desgined to.
Its about time NHRA figured it out. Hopefully people will stop taking it to the streets now, even though what we really need is more tracks.

 

[UNGN]

Originally posted by SilverSleeper
As for the older cars were built just as well or better than newer cars argument....

Older cars might have been built more solid, stronger frames, rears, etc. But what they dont have is things like crumple zones, airbags, adjustable belts, modern chassis engineering, etc.
I used to think the same thing. I would have rather been in a wreck with my 73 Electra than a newer car. Well, I can tell you firsthand (driver front impact at about 60mph) that it beat me up pretty bad. If you looked at the car, it didnt do much damage to it, needed a new bumper, drivers fender and door. Didnt even bend the frame. But the car didnt absorb much of the impact when I hit. I absorbed most of it.

I'd agree with this. Watch an old Nascar race from the 60's. When the car hits the wall, it's looks barely damaged. The driver had to take the full brunt of the impact. It's painful to watch.

It's funny how we don't hear about "whiplash" too much anymore.

 

[c&cgn]

Originally posted by strikeeagle
Well, that's interesting, but it still comes down to how safe you feel in a car going 120 MPH w/o a bar.

It's interesting that DOTs are OK, but slicks aren't. I'd contend slicks are safer on a fast car.

C'mon Strike, doesn't one of your TR's run low 11's ? And weren't you doing this for years w/o a rollbar in there? That's just my recollection of some of your past statements, although they may be out of date. I just think you're being a little hard on some of these guys considering you were on the other side of the fence for quite a while.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong and you've never made any low 11 second passes without a bar.

And before you ask...... both of my GN's have rollbars and 5 point harnesses etc. I had my own wakeup call about safety a couple of years ago when I broke an axle at the starting line (shooting for and 11.20 at the time).

At this point, knowing what I know now, I'd probably opt for the bar before the 11.5 mark anyways.

 

[JDSfastGN]

well i was happy about the rule, but went to the track tonight and asked if they were gonna go by the new rule (its Houston raceway park) and nobody had heard about it and they said 11.99 was still the rule. Oh well, back to sandbagging

 

[kgouldsk]

You should print off the rule, along with the email response I received, and deliver it to them. If they're like most organizations, their method of communicating change......leaves something to be desired.