Re-route Tranny lines?

[Buick Beginner]

Folks,
What do you think about re-routing the tranny cooler lines? I notice that the factory metal lines are practically touching the starter, oil pan and exhaust. If I were to run some heavy duty rubber lines through the frame rail up to the cooler, (exiting out near the front of the rail), the lines would be isolated from the heat of the engine. Has anyone else tryed this? Or am I just crazy? - BB

 

[turboman38]

I rerouted my tranny lines and used stainless braided rubber lines. The problem that I have is the size of the lines. Make sure the inside diameter on the rubber lines you use is the same size as the inside diameter of the stock steel lines. If you go to big you loose pressure (don't know how much). If you go too small pressure should increase but the amount of fluid in the lines is less. I don't actually know if this has any negative or positive effects on the tranny.

 

[Carolinaturbot6]

Another thing you can do is sleeve em with some rubber hose. You can also tie-wrap them to help keep the vibration under control. It's a good idea because some of us have had holes wear into them from rubbing.

 

[gnsrule]

Not an expert on this one, but i dont belive you could go too big...within reason of corse.

 

[cooper]

I was thinking of doing something like that. The original lines wore through at a metal clip by the block (81 NA, not a turbo-but they both have tranny cooler lines). It's a real pain in the ass to bend new lines.

So I can use HD hose and not worry about the fluid eating through or being too hot?

Any suggestions for the connections at the tranny and radiator ends?

Thanks.

 

[Chris McDade]

I deleted my trans lines. I put an aftermarket cooler in with braided lines from the cooler to the trans. I used AN fittings. Looks real nice. I think the whole setup cost about $110.00

Hope that helps

 

[Men in Black]

We rebent some new lines and got them out of the way of the starter, downpipe, crossover pipe,etc.

 

[WFO]

i would stay away from regular rubber hose and hose clamps.i wouldn't trust them to go the long haul with the pressure and heat.

i used parker pushlock hose and an fittings to re-plumb my tranny lines,it works great.teflon/stainless and rubber/stainless would work fine too.you could also use 1-wire hydraulic hose and crimp fittings,probably be pretty cheap too.

later,sean

 

[Chuck Leeper]

Tranny linz

FWIW, here's how I did my mine.
I got 3/8" hard fuel line and made 2 lines up using AN -6 nuts and sleeves, along w/ adapters to -6 for the trans. They run under the trans at the area just in ft of the pan and end at the dr side of the pan. [are staggered for easy attaching of jumper hoses, made of -6 braided]
I then made a pair of the same kind of lines to run along the top of the frame to the ft edge at the core support from the area at the brake prop. valve. Again, I used AN-6 nuts and sleeves and unions. A pair of jumper hoses run to the cooler that's mounted on a pair of rails suspended on the ft diagonal frame braces.
This is NOT cheap to do.

Material list:

3 pcs of 3/8" hard line x 50"
2 trans adapter fittings
8 nuts and sleeves
4 -6 to -6 unions
Approx. 4' -6 AN stainless braided line.
8 -6 hose fittings

All lines MUST be double flared.
Do not use pushloc. I have found the liner will get hard and stiff w/ VERY little use. DO NOT use rubber hose and clamps.
At ANY location that a stainless braided hose touches another hose or frame or ??, it WILL abraid the other surface. These hoses must have a protective wrap on them.

This mod gets the lines away from the hot side of the engine, away from the starter and looks ALOT nicer.

 

[Roger]

I agree with WFO "i would stay away from regular rubber hose and hose clamps.i wouldn't trust them to go the long haul with the pressure and heat."
I've had too many problems with rubber to ever do it again on a tranny.

 

[Buick Beginner]

Thanks

Thanks alot for the replies folks - BB

 

[tom h]

Chuck,

"...Do not use pushloc. I have found the liner will get hard and stiff w/ VERY little use ..."

Does that warning include Aeroquip's AQP® SOCKETLESS™ hose and fittings?

I was thinking of using that for my auxillary transmission cooler, although I was planning to mostly retain stock hard tubing and transition to Aeroquip hose at the metal unions, that are a few inches away from the radiator.

 

[WFO]

Originally posted by tom h
Chuck,

"...Do not use pushloc. I have found the liner will get hard and stiff w/ VERY little use ..."

Does that warning include Aeroquip's AQP® SOCKETLESS™ hose and fittings?

I was thinking of using that for my auxillary transmission cooler, although I was planning to mostly retain stock hard tubing and transition to Aeroquip hose at the metal unions, that are a few inches away from the radiator.

no,it doesn'tjust like anything else there are different grades of push lock hose.there are the bottom grades which are not much more than glorified rubber hose(yuck).parker,aeroquip and gates all have high line pushlock hoses that are good to 300p.s.i. @ 300 degrees.the parker hose that i use has a "pkr" inner tube that can withstand damn near anything(including 100% methanol )

i've been using it for years for fuel/tranny/vacuum/power steering/oil without a single failure.


later,sean

 

[WFO]

Re: Tranny linz

Originally posted by Chuck Leeper
FWIW, here's how I did my mine.
I got 3/8" hard fuel line and made 2 lines up using AN -6 nuts and sleeves, along w/ adapters to -6 for the trans. They run under the trans at the area just in ft of the pan and end at the dr side of the pan. [are staggered for easy attaching of jumper hoses, made of -6 braided]
I then made a pair of the same kind of lines to run along the top of the frame to the ft edge at the core support from the area at the brake prop. valve. Again, I used AN-6 nuts and sleeves and unions. A pair of jumper hoses run to the cooler that's mounted on a pair of rails suspended on the ft diagonal frame braces.
This is NOT cheap to do.

Material list:

3 pcs of 3/8" hard line x 50"
2 trans adapter fittings
8 nuts and sleeves
4 -6 to -6 unions
Approx. 4' -6 AN stainless braided line.
8 -6 hose fittings

All lines MUST be double flared.
Do not use pushloc. I have found the liner will get hard and stiff w/ VERY little use. DO NOT use rubber hose and clamps.
At ANY location that a stainless braided hose touches another hose or frame or ??, it WILL abraid the other surface. These hoses must have a protective wrap on them.

This mod gets the lines away from the hot side of the engine, away from the starter and looks ALOT nicer.

chuck-actually,you don't have to double flare an/jic when you use nuts and sleeves.the sleeve is designed to back up the single flare and align it with the nut.you can do it,but i've built about a bazillion hydraulic tube assy's from -4 to -16 and i've single flared them all and used nuts/sleeves.never had a failure,and we're talking about 5000+psi hydraulic stuff.


on the other hand,inverted flare brake fittings must be double flared.but that's another thread.


later,sean

 

[Chuck Leeper]

???? Flares, pushloc, etc

The AEROQUIP pushloc is the NHRA approved hose. That is what I used on my trans lines. They got hard, the little plastic washer on the fitting distorted and in one case, came off.
As for double vs single flares.. IF the tubing IS NOT seamless, [as Sean obviously was referring to @5000psi!!] the weld seam on the inside of the tube CAN/WILL allow a leak as the contact on the AN flare is NOT 100%, because the seam is facing the seal area.The double flare puts the seam away from the seal. [The welded version of tubing is what you get at the autoparts store]
Additionally, the AN flare has to be 37*, NOT the common 45* found on all "plumbing and general automotive" flaring tools.

Guess it's a personal preference as to what is used and how it's done. I, obviously had a problem w/ the pushloc and chose not to do it again....

The AEROQUIP is called "SOCKETLESS".
Operating range on temp is -45*F to +300*F. [LOTS of trannys are near 300* when racing w/ loose converters]
Operating pressure is 250 PSI. Again our trannys go near the max PSI wheen operating w/ elevated pressures to make them live.

LASTLY: Read the NHRA rulebook if you are intending to race your car.. They have a section devoted to the use of various line materials.

Back to my plumbing job

 

[Vader 87]

Has anybody ever tried running the lines straight forward past the starter etc right into the passenger side of the radiator to an external cooler?
Any problem with this?

 

[salvageV6]

The service manual says to use, and the stockers are, double flared lines. 7A2-12 brazed steel double wrappedl tube.

Lower pressure is found through the coolant lines under 50psi. for sure.

Fuel injection hose works fine.

Double clamp it if you want.

Other than that no reason not to use a compression fitting either for repairing lines and making a splice.

Use what makes you comfortable and is legal for racing.

My tranny cooler came with hose so I used it, worked okay for the first 15 years I'll keep you posted.

Daily driven.

 

[Vader 87]

Originally posted by Vader 87
Has anybody ever tried running the lines straight forward past the starter etc right into the passenger side of the radiator to an external cooler?
Any problem with this?

ttt

 

[Buick Beginner]

Thought this post was long gone.

Apparently Vader wants to bring it back from the dead ! I'll just throw my 2 cents out since I started the whole thing. I had to have my tranny rebuilt about 11 months ago, I found a local shop that had a good reputation and helped them hand pick the parts. Thanks to those that offered advice! Anyway the tranny is full of hardened this and super duty that's. The converter is a 10" 2800 L/U and I've got a deep aluminum (homemade) pan with a temp. gauge and as well as a pressure gauge permanently mounted inside the car. You can see them here: http://gaugepackage.netfirms.com/gauge_package.htm . So I said all that to say this; I wanted to protect my investment! So here's what I did with my tranny cooler set-up. First off I took the radiator out of the loop and went with a stand alone cooler setup. The cooler is the biggest one that B&M sells and I got it through summit racing. The cooler has 1/2" NPT thread fittings on it. This simply because I didn't want any hose clamps in the system, therefore less risk of one coming loose. The cooler looks like a small radiator it's so big. Next up I mounted it out away from the radiator behind the right front side of the air dam. I got a 12 volt cooling fan from a Honda and mounted it behind the cooler for a pull through system. The tranny lines cost me $100 boners at my local tube and rubber shop, but they are heavy duty steel reinforced hydraulic lines that have wire coil over the outside of them. I also had the fittings pressed on and measured the lines exactly to fit. There are no "hose clamps" to tighten, everything is bolted up. The guy at the hose shop wanted to know what kind of "tractor" they were going on , LOL. The lines run from the tranny into the frame. There is an opening in the frame just over to the right side of the tranny where the lines enter the frame. They run right out of the front end of the frame rail and go right into the cooler. They never even get close to the motor. The result? With the 10" converter in Tampa Florida heat the tranny fluid has never gotten over 205 degrees, (I was really hot dogging it through traffic at noon in August). Typically it sits at 190 in the heat of the day in heavy traffic. On a florida evening about 170 degrees. Like I said I'm kind of paranoid about my investment. But that's the way it ended up being done. - BB

 

[Vader 87]

Re: Thought this post was long gone.

Originally posted by Buick Beginner
Apparently Vader wants to bring it back from the dead ! I'll just throw my 2 cents out since I started the whole thing. I had to have my tranny rebuilt about 11 months ago, I found a local shop that had a good reputation and helped them hand pick the parts. Thanks to those that offered advice! Anyway the tranny is full of hardened this and super duty that's. The converter is a 10" 2800 L/U and I've got a deep aluminum (homemade) pan with a temp. gauge and as well as a pressure gauge permanently mounted inside the car. You can see them here: http://gaugepackage.netfirms.com/gauge_package.htm . So I said all that to say this; I wanted to protect my investment! So here's what I did with my tranny cooler set-up. First off I took the radiator out of the loop and went with a stand alone cooler setup. The cooler is the biggest one that B&M sells and I got it through summit racing. The cooler has 1/2" NPT thread fittings on it. This simply because I didn't want any hose clamps in the system, therefore less risk of one coming loose. The cooler looks like a small radiator it's so big. Next up I mounted it out away from the radiator behind the right front side of the air dam. I got a 12 volt cooling fan from a Honda and mounted it behind the cooler for a pull through system. The tranny lines cost me $100 boners at my local tube and rubber shop, but they are heavy duty steel reinforced hydraulic lines that have wire coil over the outside of them. I also had the fittings pressed on and measured the lines exactly to fit. There are no "hose clamps" to tighten, everything is bolted up. The guy at the hose shop wanted to know what kind of "tractor" they were going on , LOL. The lines run from the tranny into the frame. There is an opening in the frame just over to the right side of the tranny where the lines enter the frame. They run right out of the front end of the frame rail and go right into the cooler. They never even get close to the motor. The result? With the 10" converter in Tampa Florida heat the tranny fluid has never gotten over 205 degrees, (I was really hot dogging it through traffic at noon in August). Typically it sits at 190 in the heat of the day in heavy traffic. On a florida evening about 170 degrees. Like I said I'm kind of paranoid about my investment. But that's the way it ended up being done. - BB

WOW!!! 205....170 degrees!!!! I just got my tranny back from Bruce Toelle and i installed a temp gauge in it and i run a cooler thats a 1/4 the size of the radiator and i see 130 degrees all the time.....it got a little warm recently and i ran her kinda hard and saw 150 but that was max!!!