Shooting for 11's stock turbo, can't get the car to go faster......

[scojack_2001]

DougsfastZ, congrats on the 11 second stock turbo timeslip!! Take it from someone else who has done it, it wasnt easy was it? I ran mine back in March the first day Cecil was open.

As far as I know my 109 is completely original to my GN. Along with everything else. All I did to it was put my old 009s in it and a THDP and a few other parts. I also dont know if the heads have been touched, but I do know stock valve springs are in them. My GN usually picks up ~21-22mph between the 1/8 and 1/4.

My stock turbo is ported (comp inlet only, w/big bell), ported stock IC, and a stock TB with ported plenum; running a PowerPlate. I have all the fuel upgrades and run one of Razor's awesome alcohol kits. :biggrin: Pretty much everything is still stock, although I do have a BigMouth intake and a Hooker catback on my car. My best time is through the exhaust. Ran that time on bald 275/50 MT's with a original rear suspension except springs and shocks. The 60' was a 1.64.

Timing was about 26°/25° and boost was 26psi. My car is a full weight street car @ 3720lbs.

 

[DougsfastZ]

DougsfastZ, congrats on the 11 second stock turbo timeslip!! Take it from someone else who has done it, it wasnt easy was it? I ran mine back in March the first day Cecil was open.

As far as I know my 109 is completely original to my GN. Along with everything else. All I did to it was put my old 009s in it and a THDP and a few other parts. I also dont know if the heads have been touched, but I do know stock valve springs are in them. My GN usually picks up ~21-22mph between the 1/8 and 1/4.

My stock turbo is ported (comp inlet only, w/big bell), ported stock IC, and a stock TB with ported plenum; running a PowerPlate. I have all the fuel upgrades and run one of Razor's awesome alcohol kits. :biggrin: Pretty much everything is still stock, although I do have a BigMouth intake and a Hooker catback on my car. My best time is through the exhaust. Ran that time on bald 275/50 MT's with a original rear suspension except springs and shocks. The 60' was a 1.64.

Timing was about 26°/25° and boost was 26psi. My car is a full weight street car @ 3720lbs.

Hell no it wasn't easy. It was a combination of getting the short to be below 1.65 and grabbing some mph up top.

I'm glad to see your car is similar to mine, running similar to mine. The next question is what to do next................

 

[sqhatch]

Just thinking out loud based on some ideas of my own but what about seeing how fast a stock turbo/stock intercooler/stock block car can do by shedding some weight? aluminum supports/brackets/drums/ skinnies/slicks etc

That'd be neat to see how much more is left

 

[DougsfastZ]

Just thinking out loud based on some ideas of my own but what about seeing how fast a stock turbo/stock intercooler/stock block car can do by shedding some weight? aluminum supports/brackets/drums/ skinnies/slicks etc

That'd be neat to see how much more is left

Talk to me, what do you guys what to see?

I was thinking stock turbo, dutt neck intercooler, meth, wheels, full weight other wise, pump............

Let me what you guys think.........

 

[scojack_2001]

Talk to me, what do you guys what to see?

I was thinking stock turbo, dutt neck intercooler, meth, wheels, full weight other wise, pump............

Let me what you guys think.........

I know my GN already has alum. supports on it. I doubt the alum. drums will really do that much IMHO. My GTAs are light as he!!, so there's a weight loss right there. If its primarily a track-only car, lose the front swaybar as well. Im going to get a mini starter as soon as funds allow, another 10lb. loss off the car. Plus Ive lost weight since I last raced (~25lbs) so it all relative.

Dutt neck would help out and gain about 2psi in the process. Me, personally Id rather put the $200 towards a PTE SLIC, but thats just me. Even with the Dutt neck, its still a stock 10-row IC.

My buddy is running the same combo I am except he has a TE-44 and a 2800 modified D-5 and he's running 11.30s with a ported stock IC.

Lighter wheels would definitely help Doug! Maybe a set of ProStars or TelStars would help out.

I know there was a thread in the MAGNA section on the other board on reducing weight.

 

[Slow91z]

ScoJack, My old dutt neck got put onto a TSS car and went mid 10's.

On a 11 sec. car I personally believe it's all someone needs.

 

[scojack_2001]

ScoJack, My old dutt neck got put onto a TSS car and went mid 10's.

On a 11 sec. car I personally believe it's all someone needs.

Colin, I dont doubt the improvement from the Dutt neck on a basic buildup. What else was done to said TSS car to run 10s?

Personally, I cant make the investment of cash (parts & labor) into a stock intercooler. For me to have that done, it'd be over $200. That could go a long way to a bigger/better IC in my eyes.

Isnt the stock IC core restrictive? Ive heard the pressure drop is close to 5psi...

 

[Thumper]

I remember that Collin, guy had a stretch that the mounting tab broke off and needed one quickly, you shot in there and the car actually ran faster on the same tune with your old used part. man I wish i had that cooler.

If you bought a used dutt neck cooler and sold yours you would be say $125 or so in one.

Thanks
Bill

 

[pacecarta]

actually according to bob dicks tests its 5.52 psi drop stock , open the neck with a dutt and its only 3.62

 

[Slow91z]

Colin, I dont doubt the improvement from the Dutt neck on a basic buildup. What else was done to said TSS car to run 10s?

Personally, I cant make the investment of cash (parts & labor) into a stock intercooler. For me to have that done, it'd be over $200. That could go a long way to a bigger/better IC in my eyes.

Isnt the stock IC core restrictive? Ive heard the pressure drop is close to 5psi...

ScoJack, when my car was running 118 MPH in the quarter I went from a Dutt neck intercooler to a precision front mount and gained NOTHING...TRUST ME in the 11's there is no reason to have anything more than a duttneck...I was pissed when I didn't gain anything, I could have spent that money I spent on the front mount on stuff that would have made me faster.

Besides you can find dutt neck intercoolers for like 200 bux then you have a stocker to sell you can have a dutt necked intercooler for CHEAP.

 

[pacecarta]

speaking of precision , the drop (restriction) on that is nearly half as much as a dutt

 

[Thumper]

I may be wrong, but pressure drop and cooling need to be looked at both, if only looking at pressure drop and going with the lowest drop, does it cool the best? Or does the highest pressure drop offer better cooling to some degree. Or is pressure drop the only thing to care about, dont we need some restriction for the cooling to work. now I am confusing myself, help me out.

Thanks
Bill

 

[Slow91z]

Bill I would agree that is true to a point.

But it's also going make a difference if the person uses alcohol or not, if they do then that lowest pressure drop may be the best for that person.

 

[Thumper]

to what point do you agree, that I confuse myself!!!! I already know I did that......

Alcohol changes the situation some don't it.

Thanks
Bill

 

[Slow91z]

I agree that the better cooling can add to pressure drop, I think the best thing is to find the best happy medium...But with modern cores this may not be much of a concern.

 

[Blazer406]

From an engineering standpoint... air at a higher pressure .... moving to a lower pressure will always be cooler.... but that IMHO... isn't the driving force behind what makes a better intercooler. The contact area the outside air has with the fins....effects how efficient the air is at "cooling" the fins... which in turn... cools the air inside...... heat transfer.... While it is true that not necessarily is the least pressure drop going to offer the best intercooler... but one with the least pressure drop that also cools the air the most.... both need to be looked at...

The high pressure drop.... makes your turbo work harder..... to generate the higher pressure... which heats up the air even more... and possibly moves the turbo away from a higher efficiency part of the compressor map.....

IMHO... the big intercoolers with lots of surface area... automatically have a cooling advantage.... with the biggest drawback... is the shear volume of plumbing for the turbo to "fill up" when you go from vacuum... to boost.... makes it have more "lag".... which some can't seem to work around....

Just trying to encourage more thinking....